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Thread: The danger of LAFE's way of thinking

  1. #521
    Forum Member dfwfirefighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    The worst kind are those that know they don't know but attempt to bluff their way through.
    Add (to the above statement) new and/or inexperienced firefighters who don't know what they don't know and you have a recipe for disaster.

    That was one of the points I was trying to get LaFireEducator before he "tapped out". Maybe he saw the error of his ways and is rethinking his "Law of Averages" Training Program? Or, maybe we delved into a few areas that were out of his comfort zone.
    DFW



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  2. #522
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfwfirefighter View Post
    Add (to the above statement) new and/or inexperienced firefighters who don't know what they don't know and you have a recipe for disaster.

    That was one of the points I was trying to get LaFireEducator before he "tapped out". Maybe he saw the error of his ways and is rethinking his "Law of Averages" Training Program? Or, maybe we delved into a few areas that were out of his comfort zone.
    You can't get through to Bobby. He doesn't care what anyone thinks but him.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

  3. #523
    Forum Member CaptOldTimer's Avatar
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    I go away for a couple of weeks and this bribble still going on.
    Weruj1, Chenzo and BVFD_LT2 like this.
    Stay Safe and Well Out There....

    Always remembering 9-11-2001 and 343+ Brothers

  4. #524
    MembersZone Subscriber tree68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPFDRum View Post
    I am seeing trend, when it comes to vollies'; those that grouse the loudest about not being treated as an equal or a "professional", are the quickest to feel they have no need to meet even the most basic requirements as a firefighter. The excuses dreamed up and put forth is almost criminal....
    As a volunteer - it's my observation that in many areas the fire department is still working on that transition from being a social organization that fights fires to a public safety organization and all that it entails.

    Some people have a real problem making that transition, and all too often they are the folks with the political power in the organization. Enthusiasm is suspect and anyone who wants to bring any sort of progress into the mix becomes a pariah.

    Even younger members will toe the old line, if they want to be accepted. They'll meet the requirements, whatever they may be, but don't expect them to strike off in new directions.

    You can't go over their heads, because the mayor is probably a member of the fire department, too. And very likely a member of the "clique."

    Time will provide the catalyst, if some enlightened members stick to their guns as the older members leave/die/move to Florida.
    Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

    Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

  5. #525
    MembersZone Subscriber tajm611's Avatar
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    I agree with everything you just said tree. I agree 100%. You have a constant tug of war between those who want to be a volunteer FIRE DEPARTMENT and those who want it to remain a get together or a hang out spot. Just looking through the minutes of a local volly, I read more about when and where they can drink on drill nights than what was drilled on. It's a pitiful state and only harms those trying to be seen a legitimate source of fire protection.
    Chenzo likes this.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  6. #526
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfwfirefighter View Post
    Add (to the above statement) new and/or inexperienced firefighters who don't know what they don't know and you have a recipe for disaster.

    That was one of the points I was trying to get LaFireEducator before he "tapped out". Maybe he saw the error of his ways and is rethinking his "Law of Averages" Training Program? Or, maybe we delved into a few areas that were out of his comfort zone.
    No, I didn't "tap out".

    I have been monitering but I have been on vacation .. so trying to get away from the everyday stressors for a little while, including FH.


    Honestly though, I have said what i needed to say, and so have you. You know where I stand and I know where you stand. And more discussion isn't going to change that.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  7. #527
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tajm611 View Post
    I agree with everything you just said tree. I agree 100%. You have a constant tug of war between those who want to be a volunteer FIRE DEPARTMENT and those who want it to remain a get together or a hang out spot. Just looking through the minutes of a local volly, I read more about when and where they can drink on drill nights than what was drilled on. It's a pitiful state and only harms those trying to be seen a legitimate source of fire protection.
    Which is exactly what the vollies were in my old department. Whenever any of us would ask if they were going to actually drill they would immediately complain to my BC and DC claiming harassment.

    Like LAFE, they were a disgrace to the fire service.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  8. #528
    MembersZone Subscriber tajm611's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Which is exactly what the vollies were in my old department. Whenever any of us would ask if they were going to actually drill they would immediately complain to my BC and DC claiming harassment.

    Like LAFE, they were a disgrace to the fire service.

    Yeah, they exist but you do realize that isn't the pulse of the volunteer service, right? They are as small of a group as the "horrible, anti-volly career department", they exist but are not indicative of the average point of view. To take that one department you've had dealings with and stereotype ALL volunteers as such, is very.........right-wing-like.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  9. #529
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    Quote Originally Posted by tajm611 View Post
    Yeah, they exist but you do realize that isn't the pulse of the volunteer service, right? They are as small of a group as the "horrible, anti-volly career department", they exist but are not indicative of the average point of view. To take that one department you've had dealings with and stereotype ALL volunteers as such, is very.........right-wing-like.
    But unfortunately, when the public, or even elected officials see the very few..whose POV's look like Las Vegas at night, or the grossly overweight who wear the find em hot leave em wet Tshirts, or even worse the people who decal their POV's with their particular dept's logo, or wear their dept. Tshirt in public and act out of control..That is what the public sees. How hard is it to answer a phone appropriately? or go to wally world and buy a pair of black/navy slacks or cargos and a pair of black boots...or at least a nice pair of jeans for when you do PR..

    The quiet ones are the ones who go un-noticed while these yahoos draw attention to themselves and make the rest of us look bad to not only our career brothers, but the people who we seek support in the form of volunteer recruitment, or financial support..

    1 bad apple ruins the bunch..on a large scale, esp. in this day and age with social media.

  10. #530
    MembersZone Subscriber tajm611's Avatar
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    True, and I don't disagree one bit, but I have no control over that. I do, however, have some say on the education of my state's volunteer service. If I had the power, I'd make it harder (and thusly, more prestigious) to join a local volunteer company. I WISH I had a department like one I know where people actually move closer to it just to be able to join. This can only happen when some sort of standard is introduced. When you make a department's standard "if you can fit through the door" then you will have that problem. When you allow members to make christmas trees out of their vehicles, that'll happen. I've watched a new chief come in and tell his people that the department will have the same basic guidelines and standards as his career department. I watched people walk out. I also watched quality people walk in. It works. You demand excellence and you will get excellence.

    Department shirts shouldn't come in xx-tarp. I blame no one but the officers of departments like that. A drinking club with a fire fighting problem has no place in my fire service. I know that comes off as arrogant but if everyone treated the fire service like it was THEIR fire service, much of this bull**** would stop.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  11. #531
    Forum Member Miller337's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptOldTimer View Post
    I go away for a couple of weeks and this bribble still going on.
    D@MN glad to see you C.O.T., yeah this is the never ending greek tragedy. Can we go drink now? Please?

  12. #532
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfwfirefighter View Post
    We should be aggressive - NOT reckless.
    http://www.firehouse.com/news/107454...-to-brush-fire

    aggressive? reckless? or just slow down??

  13. #533
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire5555 View Post
    http://www.firehouse.com/news/107454...-to-brush-fire

    aggressive? reckless? or just slow down??
    or mechanical failure? or damaged road? or ?????
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  14. #534
    MembersZone Subscriber tajm611's Avatar
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    Or careless citizen, rubber necker, ******* on a bike?

    Crashes happen. That's why we're here. We're not immune.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

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  16. #536
    MembersZone Subscriber tajm611's Avatar
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    Cool story.

    Still a pointless interjection, however.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

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