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I know I am gonna get flamed for being a "meanie" , but I am old enough to remember seeing the flag at half staff after president Kennedy was killed. It was a sobering sight. I know it is a bad thing that 12 moviegoers got murdered , but is it on the same level as when the leader of the free world got killed? Is this just more of the same thought process that hands out trophys for all teams? Im sorry but the meaning of lowering the American flag is being watered down.
I agree completely. We drop the flag to half staff far too easily anymore. This has badly diluted the importance of the symbol. :(
You both may refer to your age in your post. But I truly think you both lack the knowledge or common sense of why and when we put the flag at half mass.
This is easily the most disrespectful posts I have ever seen on this board.
I'm old enough to remember JFK's assassination. I don't mind flags being lowered to half staff for the moviegoers in Aurora, CO.
I respectfully disagree. Lowering the flag was originally reserved for Presidents and high govt. officials. In recent times, it has evolved to where it is today, and I don't think it is all that bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tipys
The original post was a question and appeared to me to be seeking opinions, thus not necessarily disrespectful.
I agree, it's started down the same path firefighter funerals and our LODD standards have traveled...
Most of you know my respect for our National Flag. With that, I have no problem with lowering the flag to half staff for 5 days. What happened in Aurora was a National travesty. The Nation as a whole, is effected by this tragic event. As well, military personnel were also victims.
The next thing we'll probably see, is the complaining of why each local community lowers their flag to half staff for a fallen hero, that died in combat.
Times have changed from the 60's to today. We have more respect for life today, than we did 50 years ago.
FM1
I agree, mech, to a certain extent. I will never say that Aurora wasn't a tragedy of massive proportions but is it really on par with an assassination or even a major loss of life in combat? I also have little problem or objection to lowering the flag but the question remains, when does a tragedy become a national tragedy? Again, I mean no disrespect to the lives lost in Colorado but how does it compare to last year when we lost 31 troops in one crash? I saw very little, and I'm only speaking locally, in regard to flying at half-mast at what I think is a national tragedy.
The American populace has always had a problem knowing when to draw the line. I hope it never reaches the same level where we are expected to lower our flag for a coked out singer and no one pays attention to the continuous loss of life over seas.
Our Governor ordered flags at half mast for the RPG hit of the 31 for 3 days. Locally, we do what we can, for fallen military personnel. We even dropped the flag for an Iowan this past weekend, out of respect for our neighbor. Usually not done.
I'll be the first to bitch about dropping the flag when it becomes flagrant, or blatantly unneeded. As said, I have no issue with this tragedy, or the VT one, or Von Maur (local, and didn't happen, 9 killed).
As said, it is a different time period as well.
I do somewhat agree with you though. Where is the line drawn, as to who we DO honor, Nationally. Locally, any and all that have fallen in combat. Nationally, outside of mass military personnel deaths, high gov't officials, etc. Do we need one for 30 people that died in a bus crash, or 500 in a plane crash, no.
FM1
EDIT: To answer your question on a coked up singer, no, I will not drop my flag, under any condition.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slackjawedyokel
I know I am stepping out onto a cracked glass walkway by saying this, but I agree. People die every day and yes it is a shame and loss, but these visitors of a movie theater are just victims of another shooting. I have always felt the lowering of the flag is reserved for fallen heroes. When you lower the flag for the death of 12 people that were murdered in amass shooting, IMO, that takes away the relevance of it being lowered for a fallen hero.
Don't get me wrong, the 12 should be remembered, but what's next? Are we going to drape flags over their coffins? Give them a 21 gun salute? Honor guard?
It is sad when people die, but HONORS needs to be reserved for those that are being HONORED.
This goes the same for funeral processions. Out of respect I will pull over for them. But I think it is an odd thing to do. It is written in my WILL that a procession NOT be done. There is no need for the whole town to stop, just because I am dead. Pack my ashes up and go home.
BTW we are the only culture to do this.
Please remember that this is just my personal opinion. Sorry if you disagree. :)
Americans dropped the flag to half mast after the Colombia disaster. 7 people died then, which is less than the Colorado attack. Should the flag have been dropped then?
I agree the lowering of the flag is being diminished in value due to the way that honor has been applied to way too many people. Here in KY, we lower the flag from sunup to sunset on the day of a funeral for a soldier or Marine KIA who is either a KY native, or if the unit he was serving with is based in KY. I'm OK with that. For just this past week, the governor ordered the flags down for the entire period of time between the death and funeral (3 + days) for the governor's chief of staff, who I failed to see any reference to military service at all in his obit. I had a hard time with that one.
How many times has your so called president ordered the US Flag to be flowed a half staff for any military personnel being killed in action?
ZERO!
:mad:
It would be forever stuck at half-mast if that happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptOldTimer
Colombia had a NASA crew on board, Those people are heroes. They rick their lives for their job. SO YES they deserved the honor of half mast.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfn
Agreed, that's why local towns do the honor of such.Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfnIt would be forever stuck at half-mast if that happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptOldTimer
Loss of life is tragic no matter what and should be respected and honored, in part. But certain person deserve the extra honor (ie flag lowered) and that extra should not be cheapened by giving it to everyone.
How would you feel if every person that died got a firefighters funeral?, Flags, bag pipes, the works? It wouldn't feel as special when a FF dies would it?
Ok, I am taking leave on this topic before it goes too far. Remember folks. it's just opinions. :)
And the people who died protecting others (including one who was in the American military) at the Colorado shooting are not heroes?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. D.
What about Virginia Tech? Should the flag have been flown at half mast for that?
Well, let's see. If Jane Doe is driving down the road and is about to have an accident and can tell it's going to be bad, so she throws herself on top of her child to protect them. Yes, in a way she is a hero, but no she does not earn a lowered flag.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfn
The solider that died in the theater, he deserves his local town to lower the flag.
There is a fine line on this issue, but the end result is still that the honor of a lowered flag should not be cheapened by doing it for everyone.
As for VT, no, I don't think it deserved a lowered flag, nor did Columbine.
I have no problem with a community lowering the Colors to half staf for a fallen Soldier, Sailor, Airman, Marine or Coast Guardsman, nor for a firefighter, police officer, State Trooper or Corrections officer killed in the line of duty.
Governor Chris Christie of New Jersey cheapened the lowering of the Colors for Whitney Houston.
Anyone lower for Neil Armstrong?