Shipboard fire fighting

[threedawgs]

To give all a brief Readers Digest version, myself and others are working on ship board fire fighting procedures. Now we have taken alot of the Royal Australian Navy procedures and have been working on them to implement our training. Now a question to all as I know there is alot of proffessionals (ALL) on the forum.
Prior to entering a water tight compartment, they put 2 quick gas cooling shots above the door prior to opening. I am assuming that this in case there is hot gasses exiting the space or any rollover. Their nozzles they use put a "very fine" mist into the air.
Now with the nozzles we use, I feel the water that we put above the door towards the deck head is to heavy of a spray and would be redundant. It as far as I am concerned soaks your team prior to entry in a fire zone and this could have some pretty drastic results.
Would like anyones thoughts or opinions on this. "to gas cooling prior to opening the door". If anyone has any documentary on this please feel free to email me at
threedawgs1968@yahoo.com

Thanks for all your time
3dawgs

[FWDbuff]

To give all a brief Readers Digest version, myself and others are working on ship board fire fighting procedures. Now we have taken alot of the Royal Australian Navy procedures and have been working on them to implement our training. Now a question to all as I know there is alot of proffessionals (ALL) on the forum.
Prior to entering a water tight compartment, they put 2 quick gas cooling shots above the door prior to opening. I am assuming that this in case there is hot gasses exiting the space or any rollover. Their nozzles they use put a "very fine" mist into the air.
Now with the nozzles we use, I feel the water that we put above the door towards the deck head is to heavy of a spray and would be redundant. It as far as I am concerned soaks your team prior to entry in a fire zone and this could have some pretty drastic results.
Would like anyones thoughts or opinions on this. "to gas cooling prior to opening the door". If anyone has any documentary on this please feel free to email me at
threedawgs1968@yahoo.com

Thanks for all your time
3dawgs

I dont buy into that gas-cooling bullschit. Use a nozzle that applies a massive amount of water in a rapid, orderly military manner- which has been proven over and over again to absorb BTU's and cool the surrrounding compartments and bulkheads. Here in the USA- 1.75 inch line (44mm) with a 7/8ths" solid-bore nozzle (22.2mm) delivers a hard punch in a hurry. Control man opens the WTD with the nozzleman in a ready position- WTD opens, nozzleman delivers water. As a famous FDNY Fire Chief once said- "Put the fire out and your problems go away.

[Theusje]

The idea of giving two short pulses above your colleague and yourself is to protect you both from flames if the door is opened. If done fast enough some water should still be in the air or on the walls when opening the door.

These pulses are part of the so called "door procedure", which we use in Belgium in interior firefighting. This procedure can be used when the fire hasn't flashed. Basicly this means that the fire lacks oxygen and thus has not self ventend. The door, when opened, is thus the only entry point for oxygen and only exit point for fire gasses.

The door procedure goes like this:
The nozzle man shouts "ONE" and gives a pulse above your heads.
He does the same thing when shouted "TWO".
When he shouts "THREE", his colleague opens the door enough for the nozzle man to put his nozzle through the door and he gives three pulses into the room. After the third pulse the door is closed again and this procedure is repeated.

The first two pulses above your head are only done, the first time, if there is flame showing when opening the door. If you do this procedure and no flames come through the upper part of the door the nozzle man counts to three and only pulses inside the room.

I hope this somewhat answers your question.

[FWDbuff]

I hope this somewhat answers your question.

What puts out fire? Absorption of BTU's. Short pulses don't cut it in my book.

[Jonny Rotten]

FWD, I agree completely with applying copious amounts of water versus quick short bursts of higher pressure water droplets. In my opinion the reason that Europeans use the "quick burst" technique is that most of their buildings are of type two construction which makes its much easier to compartmentalize the fire. They'll never truly understand our way of aggressive firefighting.

[Theusje]

I forgot to mention that the pulses, mentioned in my post above, have a cone of 60°.

Pulses are only one small part in interior firefighting and have the sole purpose to cool the area arround the attack team.

Once the seat of the fire can be reached the nozzle is set to a straight stream with maximum flow to extinguish the fire.

[FWDbuff]

FWD, I agree completely with applying copious amounts of water versus quick short bursts of higher pressure water droplets. In my opinion the reason that Europeans use the "quick burst" technique is that most of their buildings are of type two construction which makes its much easier to compartmentalize the fire. They'll never truly understand our way of aggressive firefighting.

Yup, very familiar with European firefighting tactics as well as Shipboard Firefighting as I am a former Federal Firefighter once assigned to a large Naval installation.

I forgot to mention that the pulses, mentioned in my post above, have a cone of 60°.

Pulses are only one small part in interior firefighting and have the sole purpose to cool the area arround the attack team.

Once the seat of the fire can be reached the nozzle is set to a straight stream with maximum flow to extinguish the fire.

Unless things have changed, United States Navy and most American civilian firefighters do not even use fog nozzles on shipboard fires. Smoothbore or solid stream nozzles are used- delivering the large, quick punch needed to rapidly cool a compartmentalized shipboard fire. Open the hatch and open the nozzle, problem goes away in a rapid, efficient orderly manner.

[Truck_3]

Yup, very familiar with European firefighting tactics as well as Shipboard Firefighting as I am a former Federal Firefighter once assigned to a large Naval installation.

Unless things have changed, United States Navy and most American civilian firefighters do not even use fog nozzles on shipboard fires. Smoothbore or solid stream nozzles are used- delivering the large, quick punch needed to rapidly cool a compartmentalized shipboard fire. Open the hatch and open the nozzle, problem goes away in a rapid, efficient orderly manner.

FWD, do they still use the APN's for shipboard use? Know the Dirt Side guys use the Combo tips like everyone else but the Blue suits used the Old Navy Nozzles and the Low Vel Fog Applicator on board. 'Course that was 30 Years ago. Showing my age. :/

[threedawgs]

We use the Elkhart Vary nozzle. 3 different spray patterns.