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Thread: On Rappel

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by collinmoon View Post
    Mike, you may want to have your buddy double check his compatibility. The G-Rated (Red) ID is for 11.5 to 13 mm rope. I would really only use it for 1/2". Using it with 11mm can result in an ultra-fast and even uncontrolled descent.
    Even though its a decade old, there are still a bunch of people out there using the ID without having a solid knowledge base for its use. If you want to use 11mm rope, get the ID S. Problem seems to be people either want to use 11mm line but still want a G rated device and/or people are afraid of the safety gate on the ID S. All of this can be fixed with a solid review of the manufacturer's literature. Sorry, seen this too much before not to address it!.

    http://www.petzl.com/files/all/techn...o/D20L-IDL.pdf

    Collin
    It's been my observation that when using the 1/2" I'D with a 7/16" rope, it still works, even with a 2-person load. The difference is that it takes far less movement of the handle to open the cam.


  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricUlner View Post
    Hey Mike,

    Not sure what videos you're referring to. RTR isn't in the biz of making them. Perhaps it was Lance's videos from Rescue Response Gear?

    Anyway, my suspicion regarding your buddy seeing smoke is... it likely wasn't smoke. It was most likely steam. As in from moisture cooking off of a hot descent device. If the rope has a bit of moisture on it, or if in a humid environment, a long enough rappel (think about the squeegee effect on the rope by the I'D) can generate enough moisture on the I'D to produce visible steam if it gets heated up enough, particularly on a rappel that long.

    Not sure what you mean about "pinned down over the top of the I'D". The device has a rolled metal flange across which the rope is designed to run. It will certainly be hot to the touch quickly in descent.
    Hey Eric,
    So after looking into this some more I've got a few more details for you. I'm curious if this will change your thoughts. My friend said the rope was stiff and he and another guy actually had a burning smell at one point. Interesting point regarding the moisture in the rope, I never thought of that. My friend also said he went down in a controlled manner not fast. He contacted Petzl and they didn't have an answer for him. After hearing the rope felt stiff to him my thoughts are the bend of the rope through the I'd and what ever "greater resistance" applied to that bend through the device due to the condition of the rope.
    Thoughts..
    Mike
    "Training Prepares You...For Moments That Define You

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ProgressiveRescue View Post
    Hey Eric,
    So after looking into this some more I've got a few more details for you. I'm curious if this will change your thoughts. My friend said the rope was stiff and he and another guy actually had a burning smell at one point. Interesting point regarding the moisture in the rope, I never thought of that. My friend also said he went down in a controlled manner not fast. He contacted Petzl and they didn't have an answer for him. After hearing the rope felt stiff to him my thoughts are the bend of the rope through the I'd and what ever "greater resistance" applied to that bend through the device due to the condition of the rope.
    Thoughts..
    Mike
    Was it a newer I'D? Maybe it was the smell of the anodized layer wearing on the rolled flange. And what brand of rope, and what type? Nylon or poly?

  4. #24
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    Thanks Eric for the input but the I'D wasn't his it was companies providing the training as was the rope. He had no further info for me thanks again for the input.
    Mike
    "Training Prepares You...For Moments That Define You

  5. #25
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    I have used the ASAP for a few years now; great device. I usually place it on a tag line for myself so I can move quickly from edge to anchor while students are operating systems. Most fire/rescue guys have never seen the thing....of course theirs that whole arguement of NFPA vs. non-NFPA.....Dont' get me started on that again!!

  6. #26
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    Eric -

    I agree with what you're saying (I have used the G with 7/16". I would proceed with caution though as with any NFPA rope (Not sure about European standards) one can round up a rope .5mm. With that said a some 7/16" rope may be .5 mm thicker or .5 mm thinner. While I have no empiracle date, this could account for the rapid descent of some.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmatthe2 View Post
    Eric -

    I agree with what you're saying (I have used the G with 7/16". I would proceed with caution though as with any NFPA rope (Not sure about European standards) one can round up a rope .5mm. With that said a some 7/16" rope may be .5 mm thicker or .5 mm thinner. While I have no empiracle date, this could account for the rapid descent of some.
    That's where I was going with my question as to which brand...

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