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Thread: 18 Children Dead in CT Mass Shooting

  1. #441
    Forum Member Chenzo's Avatar
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    Here ya go SC. A well thought out, backed up with facts, definition of an assault weapon.

    http://www.assaultweapon.info/

    Not that it matters, because I know you're going to come back with something snide about how that's wrong because it doesn't fit your agenda.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    Here ya go SC. A well thought out, backed up with facts, definition of an assault weapon.

    http://www.assaultweapon.info/

    Not that it matters, because I know you're going to come back with something snide about how that's wrong because it doesn't fit your agenda.
    As I do some research on this topic, I'm trying to figure out how this AWB is going to get past the various precedents regarding the 2nd Amendment.

    In DC vs. Heller, the SCOTUS cited United States vs. Miller
    United States v. Miller limits the type of weapons to which the right applies to those in common use for lawful purposes

    If the AR-15, or any other weapon specifically named in Feinstein's, Obama's, or anyone else's AWB is "in common use for lawful purposes", which the link you posted said the AR-15 is the best-selling rifle in the US today, it would appear that AWB would be unconstitutional.

    That is actually the same caselaw cited in the Illinois ban that was recently overturned.

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    I just want to see all sales required by law to go through an FFL.

    State and Federal background checks required on all sales.

    And hospitals who admit a patient to a psych floor who is determined to have a chronic or long term psych problem will have their name placed on a gun ban list by name and birthday, no healthcare information is disclosed other than a mental issue incompatible with responsible gun ownership. Simple enough, the same way the hospital is required to report incidences of elder abuse or child abuse.

    I really don't think those three things are unreasonable. If no one else finds it absurd that you can buy a gun off craigslist any day of the week down here in the dirty south than I guess you are probably not opposed to your neighborhood drug dealer exercising his free market business rights down the street....

  4. #444
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catch22 View Post
    They wont' go after you, they'll go after kids and women who they think can't defend themselves. These guys go to soft targets, not where they'll have a fight. And when they encounter resistance, they tend to kill themselves.

    Do you think it's a coincidence that Columbine happened when the lone resource officer was known to be at a remote location? Coincidence Lanza chose an elementary school? Or Holmes a theater? This isn't suicide by cop or something like that, it's making a statement on their way out (sound a bit like terrorism, don't it).
    I feel it's a lot easier for women to offer that resistance to a person holding a knife compared to a person pointing a gun at them.

    They are failing with their statement plan....cuz I have no idea what statement they are trying to make.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Catch22 View Post
    It depends on where you get the definition. One definition is that an "assault rifle" is one with a selectible fire switch. However, the legal definition is going to be whatever Congress determines it to be. In 1994 it was a weapon that featured two characteristics on the list within the law or had a certain name.
    I was specifically asking LA to cite source that says the Bushmaster was not used in Newtown.

    The semantics of the term assault rifle are going to be ignored by the anti-gun lobby, thus we can try to present facts until we're blue in the face, they'll ignore them and continue to use fear mongering to support their agenda.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    I could only hope that if someone is trying to kill me they are going to run after me while trying to set me on fire.

    This is yet another ridiculous comparison to a semi-auto high powered rifle with a 30 round magazine.
    Here's another point where you lose credibility An AR-15, M4, Bushmaster, etc. are not high powered rifles by any stretch of the ballistics. The 5.56 or .223 round would not be considered where high powered rounds would be needed: long ranges, larger live targets, or a need for penetration of cover or hides. The use of the term "high powered" along with "assault weapon" are pure fear mongering tactics. If you want intelligent debate, use facts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    Here's another point where you lose credibility An AR-15, M4, Bushmaster, etc. are not high powered rifles by any stretch of the ballistics. The 5.56 or .223 round would not be considered where high powered rounds would be needed: long ranges, larger live targets, or a need for penetration of cover or hides. The use of the term "high powered" along with "assault weapon" are pure fear mongering tactics. If you want intelligent debate, use facts.
    Another moving target. The .223 will penetrate a 1/4 inch of steel at 700 yards. That factoid was given to me by an Army Ranger. How much more power does a projectile need to be considered "high power?"
    Last edited by scfire86; 01-14-2013 at 10:01 AM.
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  8. #448
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo
    Considering they have a fraction of the population we have (Australia Population-22,620,600 USA Population- 311,591,917) I would hope they have a lower homicide, violent crime, etc rate.

    Anyone with any common sense could see that it's not a fair comparison. You can't compare when the population difference is so great.

    You sound like Piers Morgan now. Portraying only the facts that you believe will advance your agenda, not ALL of the facts.
    Even with extrapolation of comparing their homicide by firearm rate to the US, they are still significantly lower.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo
    Not extreme at all, considering that's how everyone who isn't a member of the anti-gun crowd feels. Again, you're not presenting all of the facts, just your perception of what is right.
    That makes an assumption the pro-gun crowd is open to any type of regulation. They are showing that isn't the case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo
    It does matter, because country wide gun registration is the precursor to gun confiscation. If they know who has the guns, and where they are, it's easier to come get them.
    Yowza!! Even if they don't know where they are located via registration, what difference is it going to make? Do you really believe a citizen's group armed with AR-15's is going to stand much chance against a modern military force armed with nuke subs, fighter planes, and smart bombs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo
    Open you eyes man. While I've agreed with you in the past (whether I've posted it or just thought to myself I concur), you're way off the ball on this issue. You're looking at what you hope will bring reductions in gun violence. I sincerely believe there is more going on behind all of this that the sheeple of the world who don't think outside the box don't see.
    I've stated repeatedly we should examine what other industrialized nations do to reduce gun violence. So far any idea has been met with adamant oppostion and is labeled as being completely "anti-gun."

    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo
    You're rationale is asinine. By your definition, everything is an assault weapon. That means right now within my reach, I have an assault hammer, an assault knife, an assault glass, an assault screwdriver, etc. It's VERY important to have a direct, concise, to the point definition, because leaving something open to interpretation by the government is dangerous. Give them an inch,they'll take a mile.
    Good to know you have no faith in your government. Do you work for the government? Should others have as much faith in you as you do in the government you now claim is inept?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo
    http://www.impactguns.com/kel-tec-ks...otgun-ksg.aspx

    7+7+1 for 15 rounds. Again, your lack of knowledge on the subject is showing. Readily available for purchase by civilians.
    Well goody. I'm always impressed that someone likes to point one exception to claim another is completely uninformed.
    Last edited by scfire86; 01-14-2013 at 10:03 AM.
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  9. #449
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catch22
    What I get out of it, they made it difficult to get guns so they've started using knives for assault. And imagine that, drugs and alcohol are factors in the majority of assaults and robberies!
    I'll take my chances of getting away from someone with a knife any day.
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  10. #450
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbzep
    As far as I know, you haven't come straight out and typed an individual statement that you are anti-gun. However, as an example, you make statements that pro-gun advocates have narrow definitions of assault rifles, and your definition is opposite, as broad as the Mississippi is wide. The sum of your statements points to an anti-gun direction.
    So which guns have I advocated banning?
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  11. #451
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp
    The only thing you keep pushing over and over is magazine limits and bans of legally owned magazines already in the hands of law abiding citizens. Who will compensate all of these gun owners for those magazines? At a fair market price? Not for some ludicrous $50 gift card.
    I don't know. Who says their fair market value will be $50?

    Your initial rants talked incessantly about assault rifles and why anyone needs one when the fact is fully automatic weapons are heavily restricted, take an extreme permit process and include added fees and taxes. You wanted assault rifles out of the hands of law abiding citizens...that seems pretty clear.
    I've never advocated banning any type of semi-auto firearm. Sadly, you continue to claim otherwise.

    Good luck with that...there is no way at all of knowing who has what for magazines. The truly paranoid, conspiracy wackos, could bury dozens if not hundreds of those magazines, and use legal 5 or 10 rounders to be able to remain proficient with their rifles. If they believe that the government is out to take their guns they will do what they feel is necessary to stop it.
    I always enjoy the paranoid ramblings of extremists. If the government did become as tyrannical as you believe could happen, you are delusional in believing that a militia armed with AR-15's is going to stand much of a chance against a military that has nuke subs, fighter planes, and smart bombs.

    I believe laws that make sense, and have a positive impact on society are valuable...Laws that punish those that are law abiders will always find resistance and as those rights are further and further attacked the resistance will increase.
    How is restricting magazines to a lesser amount punishment?

    Any time you go through an FFL there would be a required 48 hour waiting period (It may be longer in some states) when you purchased a pistol. There is currently no federal waiting period for long guns or shotguns. What would have to end is private sales at gun shows and that could easily be handled through an on site area with FFL dealers to do the paperwork, for a fee of course, or being paid by the gun show organizers to be there.
    I have no problem with that.

    Initially, what you tried to broad stroke as assault rifles.
    No, I claimed that semi-auto rifles previously used by the miltary could have been considered the assault rifles of their era.

    Okay, perhaps generic blather was a bit harsh. Your accepted dictionary is NOT using firearms industry correct defintions for specific types of firearms. You know like the newspapers calling SCBA oxygen masks.
    This is relevant if one believes the firearms industry is the final arbiter in weapons vocabulary.

    Duh, it was just as ridiculous as you comparing legal firearms ownership to explosives and rocket launchers. Thanks for helping bolster the point I was trying to make.
    I'm not the one who brought up the hypothetical someone using nukes.

    Again, your knowledge of current firearms laws makes discussing any of this with you very difficult. A fully automatic shotgun would require an FFL Class 3 license, a mountain of paperwork, extra fees and a $200 tax paid to the feds. You can't just walk into a gun store and buy one, anymore than you could go in and buy a select fire M-4, Ak-47, FNFAL, M14, Thompson submachine gun, Uzi, MP5, etc. The law, maybe you should do some research before you try to speak on a topic you clearly have zero knowledge of. Or are the laws as irrelevant to you as the proper nomenclature for the types of firearms?
    I'm not sure what point you are making here. I'm not the one advocating making it easier to own fully auto weapons. Though your description of what it takes to own one only shows the 2nd Amendment is not an absolute and that restrictions are very much capable of being enacted.

    It's not hypothetical. A shotgun with buckshot is chosen by police departments and militaries the world over for its close range killing ability. The shotgun is also a favorite for home defense because of that same ability.
    It was a hypothetical in the context you used it. The context was the ability to kill numerous individuals at one time

    You said no one needed an assault rifle...and then defined an assault rifle as a bolt action '03 Sringfield, a semi-automatic M1 Garand, and semi-automatic military styled rifles...And your chapion Feinsteain has declared my squirrel hunting .22 as an assault rifle...
    Funny. I stated those weapons would have been considered the assault weapons of their era. At which time you immediately broke out a new definition.

    Yet you have said repeatedly that if the Sandy Hook shooter had had a smaller capacity magazine in his rifle, that may have been left in the trunk of his car, it would have been possible for him to be jumped by bystanders and stopped...So which is it? Case specific to Sandy Hook or just another diversion to support your ban of magazines from law abiding citizens?
    Both. A smaller capacity magazine would have allowed potential victims to stop the shooter. While that didn't happen in Sandy Hook it has happened in other instances. For some reason you refuse to believe that is a possibility despite it having been done.

    I haven't posted a single hypothetical other than to show how absolutely ridiculous most of the nonsense you post is. Nice try though, no points will be awarded.
    Sure you have. Several times.
    Your turn. This is fun watching your positions change and become more extreme.
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  12. #452
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Another moving target. The .223 will penetrate a 1/4 inch of steel at 700 yards. That factoid was given to me by an Army Ranger. How much more power does a projectile need to be considered "high power?"
    Really? That's pretty interesting since reports out of Afghanistan had our troops being outgunned at ranges exceeding 300-500 meters. In fact the M-14 was brough back out of mothballs and many squads were issued 1 or more for a "dedicated marksman" to deal with longer range targets.

    Sorry, not buying this story from you either.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    I'll take my chances of getting away from someone with a knife any day.
    As a Patrol Sgt., I will tell you that I'm more afraid of someone armed with a knife than a gun. I have been shot at without result, but have been "cut" with a knife. Some may call me lucky, but I would argue that anytime I get hurt, I was unlucky.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Even with extrapolation of comparing their homicide by firearm rate to the US, they are still significantly lower.

    I'm not going to argue this point with you, because you obviously don't care about statistics. I will however, agree that the homicide by firearm rate in Australia is lower. However it still proves that gun restrictions aren't the answer.

    That makes an assumption the pro-gun crowd is open to any type of regulation. They are showing that isn't the case.

    To be brutally up front and honest, no I'm not open to any type of additional regulation. I think there is already plenty of regulation on the books. The root problem, that the anti-gun crowd seems to always fail to acknowledge, is the fact that criminals are criminals because they don't follow the law. Any one who thinks more gun control is the solution to this sort of incident is a fool. If criminals followed the law, there wouldn't be any murders to begin with, now would there?


    Yowza!! Even if they don't know where they are located via registration, what difference is it going to make? Do you really believe a citizen's group armed with AR-15's is going to stand much chance against a modern military force armed with nuke subs, fighter planes, and smart bombs?

    Do you really believe that soldiers in the US Army, Marines, Navy, Air Force, Coast Guard, whatever, is going to turn their guns on their own country? If you do, you're more foolish than I thought. Do you know anyone in the armed forces? Ask them if they would turn their guns on American civilians. The military's bottom line goal is to defend the constitution, not assist in the destruction of it.


    I've stated repeatedly we should examine what other industrialized nations do to reduce gun violence. So far any idea has been met with adamant oppostion and is labeled as being completely "anti-gun."

    And in those other industrialized nations, GUN violence may have dropped, however other forms of violence are significantly higher. Your ideas have been met with opposition and you have been labeled anti-gun because you see no problem in stripping law abiding citizens of items they use to LEGALLY participate in their hobbies.


    Good to know you have no faith in your government. Do you work for the government? Should others have as much faith in you as you do in the government you now claim is inept?

    It's not necessarily a lack of faith in my government, but I definitely question every move they make, and I am suspicious of every move they make. Nope, I don't work for the government. And yes, others should ALWAYS question their government. Anyone who follows anything with blind faith is a fool. Remember, they're a government for the people. We are NOT a people for the government. Label me as a tin-foil hat wearing nutjob, I don't really care. I will continually question what they are doing, and always be suspicious of their actions.

    You want an extreme example? Look at Germany. They trusted Hitler, they gave up their guns. It ended up costing 6.6 million Jews their life.

    Sorry if my lack of trust in the government makes me crazy. I sure won't be a victim. And no, your label that I have "no faith in my government" did NOT start recently, so don't try and turn this into me having no trust because they don't want to take my guns.



    Well goody. I'm always impressed that someone likes to point one exception to claim another is completely uninformed.

    Jesus dude, do you want me to find more?
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    It was nice to see you addressed my post about the definition of assault weapon. THAT'S why you're labeled as anti-gun, you don't want to listen to facts.
    Last edited by Chenzo; 01-14-2013 at 12:55 PM.
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    Forum Member Chenzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Both. A smaller capacity magazine would have allowed potential victims to stop the shooter. While that didn't happen in Sandy Hook it has happened in other instances. For some reason you refuse to believe that is a possibility despite it having been done.
    Columbine happened during the last AWB, which included the magazine capacity limit.

    Harris used a 12-gauge pump sawed off pump shotgun, which was fired 25 times, and a Hi-point 995 carbine with 12 ten round magazines, that was fired 96 times. Which proves magazine capacity doesn't mean squat.

    Klebold had a semi-auto Tec-9, with a 52, 32, and 28 round magazine, which was shot 55 times, and a sawed off shotgun. Which proves that people who are going to commit crimes will NOT follow gun restrictions.

    They murdered 12, and injured 21, during a weapons ban. They also had close to 100 IED's with them.

    Tell me again how gun restrictions stop criminal activity with firearms?
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Another moving target. The .223 will penetrate a 1/4 inch of steel at 700 yards. That factoid was given to me by an Army Ranger. How much more power does a projectile need to be considered "high power?"
    That fact may be true under the right conditions, but is disingenuous at best, given the use of "high powered" as an adjective implies that the weapon is of greater power than many or most others, when in fact most typical hunting rifle cartridges are far more powerful. Anyone with a HS education should be able to understand the basics of a cartridges relative power is based in it's mass, then velocity. Given the range of common cartridges goes from .22 up to .50, with a pretty decent dispersment along the way, clearly one can see the .223 is on the low end. But don't let facts spoil your fear mongering.
    Last edited by RFDACM02; 01-14-2013 at 01:33 PM. Reason: keyboard caused misspelled words
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Another moving target. The .223 will penetrate a 1/4 inch of steel at 700 yards. That factoid was given to me by an Army Ranger. How much more power does a projectile need to be considered "high power?"
    Here's a little ballistics lesson for you.

    A .223 with a 55 grain bullet (common), which exits the muzzle at right around 3,200 feet per second, with about 1281ft/lbs of energy. At 700 yards, the velocity has dropped from 3,200 FPS to 918 FPS, and the energy has dropped from 1281 down to 118ft/lbs.

    The "benchmark" for effective energy needed to drop a deer is 1000ft/lbs of energy. Which the .223 drops below after 100 yards.

    What I'm trying to say here, is I'm calling bull****, unless your Army Ranger friend has some of the weakest steel on the market. I can't prove this without doing it myself, however neither can you, as you heard it from someone, you didn't actually do it yourself.

    But, what makes my post different than yours is I backed it up with facts and numbers.
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    I don't know. Who says their fair market value will be $50?

    History has shown with EVERY SINGLE GUN BUY BACK ran by a governmental unit that the amount paid out was no where near the market value of many of the guns turned in. Do some research on that. You always like to tell others to do that and you spout off not knowing a damn thing about this.


    I've never advocated banning any type of semi-auto firearm. Sadly, you continue to claim otherwise.

    There in lies the problem with your improper use of nomenclature. You DID call for elimination of "assault rifles" in the hands of civilians. Then refused to admit your definition, which according to the firearms industry, was wrong when you included semi-auto military styled rifles in that category. Then going on to include the '03 Springfield and M1 Garand as "assault rifles" further proves your refusal to use proper terminlogy. So in fact YES YOU DID call for banning some semi-automatic rifles.

    I always enjoy the paranoid ramblings of extremists. If the government did become as tyrannical as you believe could happen, you are delusional in believing that a militia armed with AR-15's is going to stand much of a chance against a military that has nuke subs, fighter planes, and smart bombs.

    Then you must absolutely LOVE reading the absolute BS you post. Because you are the leading political mouth piece extrremist on this entire forum.

    Let me say this about your nuke subs, fighter plans, and smart bombs...How long has the war lasted in Afghanistan against peasants and jihadists? Over a decade now. I see on the news they are still managing to kill our troops and at this point our answer is to leave. We are fooling ourselves if we believe we have won anything there because as soon as we leave it will be exactly as it was with the extremists back in power, either officially or by use of terror to control the populace.

    Your premise also assumes that a majority of the military will follow orders to fire upon the very citizens they took an oath to protect. Quite a quandry really. Follow an unlawful order and conduct military actions inside the US against its own citizens, or disobey an unlawful order and be subject to military justice. Things that make you go hmmm...



    How is restricting magazines to a lesser amount punishment?

    Really, it is an assault on rights previously held by law abiding citizens. The problem is the whittling away of rights from law abiding citizens and the passive agreement of those that feel it is okay or they feel unaffected by others losing their rights. If you take away something from someone that has done nothing wrong it is in fact a punishment. When previously that something was legal and the law abiding users had done nothing wrong to cause them to lose it.


    I have no problem with that.

    You however, will most likely NEVER end private sales of guns from neighbor to neighbor, friend to friend, and so on.

    My son just helped a friend of his sell a pistol. He ran prospective buyers through the state's online criminal history check and found one of them was not the kind of guy that he wanted to sell a gun to. So, you see, some people will run their own checks, even if the law doesn't call for them.



    No, I claimed that semi-auto rifles previously used by the miltary could have been considered the assault rifles of their era.

    Yes, you incorrectly said that. But you also early on called for not allowing civilians to own what you incorrectly identified as "assault rifles." Hence, banning them.


    This is relevant if one believes the firearms industry is the final arbiter in weapons vocabulary.

    Okay, now you are just being obtuse. Of course the profession that makes and uses something is the final word on what those items are called. Seriously you sound like a complete moron here when you say ridiculous things like the firearms industry isn't the expert on the firearms they manufacture.


    I'm not the one who brought up the hypothetical someone using nukes.

    No, you brought up ridiculous comparisons like how purchasing potato chips is regulated as to type and quantity you are allowed to possess, comparing explosives to firearms, and then playing the race card by introducing a different shooting incident that has zero comparison to Sandy Hook. Yep, you have stayed right on topic.


    I'm not sure what point you are making here. I'm not the one advocating making it easier to own fully auto weapons. Though your description of what it takes to own one only shows the 2nd Amendment is not an absolute and that restrictions are very much capable of being enacted.

    The facts are that the 2nd Ammendment mentions no specific types of firearms at all. One could just as easily make the case that ANY law restricting firearms from private citizenship is a violation of the constitution.

    I have not advocated making the owning of fully automatic weapons easier. Although the facts how that legally owned fully automatic weapons are NOT used in criminal activities. Only 2 murders have been committed with legally owned machine guns since the new regulations went into effect in 1934. One of those murders was committed by a police officer using his personally owned sub-machine gun. Add to this the fact that there are over 240,000 legally owned machine guns in the country, roughly half by civilians and half by law enforcement. So once again, LEGALLY OWNED firearms and NOT the problem.

    It's not hypothetical. A shotgun with buckshot is chosen by police departments and militaries the world over for its close range killing ability. The shotgun is also a favorite for home defense because of that same ability.
    It was a hypothetical in the context you used it. The context was the ability to kill numerous individuals at one time


    Funny. I stated those weapons would have been considered the assault weapons of their era. At which time you immediately broke out a new definition.

    And you were wrong then, wrong now, and you will be wrong forever. Further if you still believe the drivel you spewed then you support Feinstein's attempts to ban those sporting rifles. THANK YOU FOR FINALLY OPENLY ADMITTING IT.


    Both. A smaller capacity magazine would have allowed potential victims to stop the shooter. While that didn't happen in Sandy Hook it has happened in other instances. For some reason you refuse to believe that is a possibility despite it having been done.

    Nice HYPOTHETICAL situation. The fact is if the shooter hadn't stolen the guns, killed his mother, stole her car, broke into the locked school, killed students and teachers in violation of laws you fail to see criminals and the mentally ill simply don't follow we wouldn't even be discussing this...Would we.


    Sure you have. Several times.

    Only to point out the ludicrous nature of your hypotheticals.


    Your turn. This is fun watching your positions change and become more extreme.

    Not extreme at all. It's too bad that being consistent is seen as extreme. Where your tactics of making up stories, lying, using idiotic, rambling, irrelevant comparisons to assault potato chips and explosives, refusing to see that the industry that manufactures firearms is in fact the expert on firearms nomenclature, and diverting into a completely irrelevant shooting so you could play the race card, have danced all over the place and shown how extreme your anti-gun stance is.
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  19. #459
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BULL321 View Post
    As a Patrol Sgt., I will tell you that I'm more afraid of someone armed with a knife than a gun. I have been shot at without result, but have been "cut" with a knife. Some may call me lucky, but I would argue that anytime I get hurt, I was unlucky.
    I saw a police officer training video in which a trained, veteran officer was up against a man with a knife. This was all gun with a fake pistol and a rubber knife of course. The results were if the man with the knife was within 21 feet of the officer, and the offcier's gun was in his holster, the man with the knife won every time. No matter was defensve moves were made by the officer. The man with the knife got multiple stabs in before the officer had a chance to draw his weapon.

    I can tell you this has always tainted my thought process about any violent encounter I may find myself in. My dad always said anyone that pulls a knife in a fight knows how to use it, most shooters aren't as good as they believe they are.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

  20. #460
    MembersZone Subscriber BULL321's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    I saw a police officer training video in which a trained, veteran officer was up against a man with a knife. This was all gun with a fake pistol and a rubber knife of course. The results were if the man with the knife was within 21 feet of the officer, and the offcier's gun was in his holster, the man with the knife won every time. No matter was defensve moves were made by the officer. The man with the knife got multiple stabs in before the officer had a chance to draw his weapon.

    I can tell you this has always tainted my thought process about any violent encounter I may find myself in. My dad always said anyone that pulls a knife in a fight knows how to use it, most shooters aren't as good as they believe they are.
    Your dad was right! Most people with guns rely on the gun itself, and less on their skill. Subjects with knifes, more than less of the time, know what they are doing. Don't ever let your guard down because the suspect is "just armed with a knife.
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    Bull


    “Guys if you get hurt, we’ll help you. If you get sick we’ll treat you. If you want to bitch and moan, then all I can tell you is to flick the sand out of your slit, suck it up or get the hell out!”
    - Capt. Marc Cox CFD

    Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.
    -WINSTON CHURCHILL

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