Fire Fighting Vehicles on N.J. State Contract

[Woodbridge]

The State of New Jersey, for the first time is offering fire apparatus to be purchased without needing to go out to bid. Seagrave, Ferrara, and Kme, are on the contract Schedule 23V GSA ,which can be found on the state treas. dept listed under co-op purchases , the contract is good untill the year 2017. I know that Pa, Ohio, Florida, offer the same type of program!

[BoxAlarm187]

One of the largest in the US is the HGAC (Houston-Galveston Area Council) with scores of firefighting apparatus. The Florida Sheriff's Association also has a number of fire apparatus on their state contract as well.

[Woodbridge]

Most of the fire apparatus that are listed on the state contracts are " base Models " then you have to add about $ 50,000- $ 60,000 worth of options to meet your departments specs. You may save a few thousand dollars on the vehicles with- out having to go to bid, sending RFP's, Lawyer fees, bid openings, etc !

[Squad46]

Woodbridge; As a person in the know, the KME proposals for the NJ State Contract are far from bare bones. There are several options that have been included in each of the 47 units that have been submitted to the state.

Stay safe, and Happy New Year to all of my NJFF Brothers and Sisters!

[Woodbridge]

The other two contracts from Seagrave & Ferrara, are " Base Model " apparatus with a few pages of options. It looks like Kme, is the only company who included option into there prices !

[islandfire03]

just a way for departments to avoid having to write a spec and allow them buy from who they want. As long as you want a KME, Seagrave, or Ferrara.

[FyredUp]

just a way for departments to avoid having to write a spec and allow them buy from who they want. As long as you want a KME, Seagrave, or Ferrara.

What is wrong with that? Especially if you can save money in the process.

[LaFireEducator]

Most of the fire apparatus that are listed on the state contracts are " base Models " then you have to add about $ 50,000- $ 60,000 worth of options to meet your departments specs. You may save a few thousand dollars on the vehicles with- out having to go to bid, sending RFP's, Lawyer fees, bid openings, etc !

Not necessarily true.

We order all of our apparatus from Ferrera off the LA state contract and have to add very little for them to be very functional.

About the only thing we add to our commercial chassis is a slightly upgraded light package and side-mount water tank level indicators - usually less than 2K.

We just purchased a new custom at our staffed station and added less than 15K.

[Woodbridge]

A 10k PTO generator as a option will cost between $ 18-20k, a 6" front suction $5,500, bigger Hp motor other than a 330HP will cost $ 20,000, or more .The cost of a base unit is a stock apparatus, don't get me wrong a base apparatus will do the same job as a $ 500,000 rig!!

[islandfire03]

What is wrong with that? Especially if you can save money in the process.

State bid pricing packages, don't guarantee you will save money over competitive bidding process with multiple bidders. In many cases state bid price points are higher.
Doesn't matter whether your buying cases of toilet paper or fire engines.

[Bones42]

State bid pricing packages, don't guarantee you will save money over competitive bidding process with multiple bidders. In many cases state bid price points are higher.
Doesn't matter whether your buying cases of toilet paper or fire engines.

Exactly. They set a price at 1 point during the year and then keep that regardless of market changes the other 364 days. Only time we have used state bid prices was when we were too lazy to look for better prices....and that was extremely rare. We don't even bother looking at the state bids anymore.

And even better...you can go to the vendor that has the state bid and get better prices than their state bid offer very often.

[Woodbridge]

I think that the State of New Jersey started the fire apparatus contract co-op awards to stop fire truck vendors from writing the specs for fire departments, so only there chassis cab could meet the specs and that would eliminate other builders from bidding on the apparatus!
This contract from the state claims a 4% discount on apparatus, and more on options .

[FyredUp]

Let me be brutally blunt here...ANY fire department that doesn't write at least their own basic spec is fooling themselves. They are getting what the salesman wants to sell them.

I was very open about my days of trying to be a fire truck salesman here so I believe I can speak with a little inside knowledge. If you had a competitor write your spec, and it is obvious by proprietory items only they have, the company I sold for wouldn't waste time writing a spec or trying to get your business. Why? Because your choice was obviously made and the sending out of bid requests was a sham to say you met the requirements.

Look, to me the answer here is obvious. Look at the state bid apparatus. If it meets your requirement and an save you money go for it. If not go the traditional route and requests specs and bids from competing manufacturers.

[Bones42]

I think that the State of New Jersey started the fire apparatus contract co-op awards to stop fire truck vendors from writing the specs for fire departments, so only there chassis cab could meet the specs and that would eliminate other builders from bidding on the apparatus!
This contract from the state claims a 4% discount on apparatus, and more on options .

Yup, results of the SCI investigation a couple years ago.

[Chief1FF]

A quick note to those that think buying off state contracts save you money! Working in the apparatus business I can tell you at least with PA state contract COSTARS that you will pay on average 20K to 30K more than if you went out to bid. It does save you money up front on lawyer fees and advertising fees to the tune of what can be 10K here in PA and it is quick, however in the long run you end up paying more! It also allows departments to purchase what (brand name) they want without going through the “fake” bid process!!!!

Chief 1 FF

[Woodbridge]

Why would a apparatus purchased from a state contract cost 20K-30K more than going out to bid ?
Don't most state fire apparatus contracts save the buyer up to 4% on a vehicle plus options .

[BoxAlarm187]

Why would a apparatus purchased from a state contract cost 20K-30K more than going out to bid ?
Don't most state fire apparatus contracts save the buyer up to 4% on a vehicle plus options .

Not all state contracts offer a percentage discount. Furthermore, they're often not competitive bids, they're simply pricing schedules that may not provide the same savings that bidding would.

[Woodbridge]

If a fire department is not happy with the state contract price of a apparatus, they can then go out to bid and award a contract to the builder who meets there price & specs!

[Woodbridge]

Pierce Fire Apparatus , is also now on the New Jersey State Contract for fire fighting vehicles with a 5 year contract award. You can choose from Seagrave, Ferrara, Kme, & Pierce !