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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by WVFD705 View Post
    Is there money outside of AFG?
    Not a lot - but scads from AFG. One of the priorities now for AFG is basic firefighter training to get people to state standards. In fact, if you don't show that you are trying to get your people to those standards, and don't present a plan to do so (and ask for funds to do it if needed) then you are not going to be competitive for any AFG grant. The SAFER is a great one also, but that needs to be written for any college level classes, not just firefighter. IE, you don't put the emphasis on firefighting classes in the SAFER, but in the AFG - but the SAFER funds can be used for firefighter training. And SAFER is 100% money, no cost share.

    Remember also - reimbursement for time off work, travel money, even per diem can be reimbursed. They get paid to go to training!
    Last edited by LVFD301; 05-08-2013 at 10:39 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I would be curious to find out where all this money is.
    I would be curious to know what you would do with it - surely not get certification. Anyways, look at my post above this one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    I would be curious to know what you would do with it - surely not get certification. Anyways, look at my post above this one.
    On my VFD, you're right.

    We have more other pressing training needs, like a training facility.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    On my VFD, you're right.

    We have more other pressing training needs, like a training facility.
    Have you looked at an AFG grant applicaion lately? One of the direct questions they ask is about your FDs efforts to move towards certification for your firefighters. Youe line of nonsense would not bode well in that regard.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    Not a lot - but scads from AFG. One of the priorities now for AFG is basic firefighter training to get people to state standards. In fact, if you don't show that you are trying to get your people to those standards, and don't present a plan to do so (and ask for funds to do it if needed) then you are not going to be competitive for any AFG grant. The SAFER is a great one also, but that needs to be written for any college level classes, not just firefighter. IE, you don't put the emphasis on firefighting classes in the SAFER, but in the AFG - but the SAFER funds can be used for firefighter training. And SAFER is 100% money, no cost share.

    Remember also - reimbursement for time off work, travel money, even per diem can be reimbursed. They get paid to go to training!
    I am working on those grants again this year. I'm still holding out some hope that we can get enough interest to have Kurt Bradley come give us a class in June. I'm reading and learning as much as I can, but I'm not very good at the FEMA grants as they are all fairly new territory for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    On my VFD, you're right.

    We have more other pressing training needs, like a training facility.
    Why on Earth do you need a training facility? Don't you have a fire hall? Can't you put chairs in there for lectures? Can't you use tables, plywood, and other materials for mazes? What are you looking for, car fire training props? The closest one to here is almost 3 hours away. Are you looking for a flammable liquids training prop? Cut a 150 gallon fuel oil drum in half.

    Normally I try to see if there is a deeper point that you are making about rural operations and a lack of manpower, which we have. I have even brought up some points in the past that bolstered your position. But the notion that you need a training facility more than actual training is absolutely ludicrous. We make due with our hall, parking lot, some vacant land, and every 3 or 4 years, a house that is being demolished. Would it be nice to have a full training facility, sure, but we cannot afford the extra maintenance on additional facilities.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HuntPA View Post
    Why on Earth do you need a training facility? Don't you have a fire hall? Can't you put chairs in there for lectures? Can't you use tables, plywood, and other materials for mazes? What are you looking for, car fire training props? The closest one to here is almost 3 hours away. Are you looking for a flammable liquids training prop? Cut a 150 gallon fuel oil drum in half.

    Normally I try to see if there is a deeper point that you are making about rural operations and a lack of manpower, which we have. I have even brought up some points in the past that bolstered your position. But the notion that you need a training facility more than actual training is absolutely ludicrous. We make due with our hall, parking lot, some vacant land, and every 3 or 4 years, a house that is being demolished. Would it be nice to have a full training facility, sure, but we cannot afford the extra maintenance on additional facilities.
    At this point we are looking to have a very basic facility.

    Just to bring it up above the point where it is constantly flooding would be a start. That's close a grand worth of dirt, stone and grading just to do that.

    We already have a couple of burn pans once we raise and level the ground. Then we want just a car and truck on site that we can load to burn, as well as a small burn building - likely 2 Conex's plus a burn cell.

    The fact is that it costs us $150 per night to simply use the state fire training agencies burn facility about 8 miles from our station, and that is without instructors.

    This would give us the ability to utilize some live fire on-site without having to shell out $$$$ to the state training agency just to use their props.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 05-09-2013 at 04:03 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Have you looked at an AFG grant applicaion lately? One of the direct questions they ask is about your FDs efforts to move towards certification for your firefighters. Youe line of nonsense would not bode well in that regard.
    That would a problem for the Chief, who fills out the grant apps.

    That being said, we have had 2 members get their FFI within the past 2 months utilizing LSU FETI's on-line class.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    That would a problem for the Chief, who fills out the grant apps.
    You never fail to pass the buck, do you.
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    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    You never fail to pass the buck, do you.
    The Chief, in the end, determines the training policy.

    The Chief, in my VFD, is also the one that fills out the grant apps.

    That's not passing the buck. That's identifying the member that will have the responsibility for completing the application.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    The Chief, in the end, determines the training policy.

    The Chief, in my VFD, is also the one that fills out the grant apps.

    That's not passing the buck. That's identifying the member that will have the responsibility for completing the application.
    It's just funny that whenever someone points out anything on here about they way either of your departments do things, your answer is always "That's not my job."
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    It's just funny that whenever someone points out anything on here about they way either of your departments do things, your answer is always "That's not my job."
    So how is it "my job" if I don't make the final training decisions or write the grants?

    Please enlighten me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    That would a problem for the Chief, who fills out the grant apps.

    That being said, we have had 2 members get their FFI within the past 2 months utilizing LSU FETI's on-line class.

    You may want to let him know that I am quite sure it will come up if they get a grant award. Quite sure.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by WVFD705 View Post
    I am working on those grants again this year. I'm still holding out some hope that we can get enough interest to have Kurt Bradley come give us a class in June. I'm reading and learning as much as I can, but I'm not very good at the FEMA grants as they are all fairly new territory for me.

    Kurt is a great resource, with his and Brian Vickers help i have gotten millions in grants for my area. I would be more than happy to help you, just drop me a PM. You should also look at the forums here.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    So how is it "my job" if I don't make the final training decisions or write the grants?

    Please enlighten me.
    Not saying that this particular thing actually is your job. Quite honestly, as of late I'm starting to think you're just sitting in your basement playing with your Matchbox and Hotwheels fire trucks, but that's for another time.

    Here's your enlightenment: Regardless if someone on here says training, grant writing, getting cert classes for people to take, driving the truck, putting out the fire, etc, according to you its always someone else's job.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    Not saying that this particular thing actually is your job. Quite honestly, as of late I'm starting to think you're just sitting in your basement playing with your Matchbox and Hotwheels fire trucks, but that's for another time.

    Here's your enlightenment: Regardless if someone on here says training, grant writing, getting cert classes for people to take, driving the truck, putting out the fire, etc, according to you its always someone else's job.
    ummmmmmmmmmm... No.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    ummmmmmmmmmm... No.
    Um, YES. The fact is when you get cornered, and can't defend your BULL SCHITT, you ALWAYS and I mean ALWAYS, say some crap not "Not my job" or "Not my responsibility" or "That's above my pay grade."

    You have come on these forums and REPEATEDLY made it seem like you are some one of importance and influence in BOTH of your fire departments. Now, when it is no longer convenient for you to keep up that nonsensical premise you pass the buck.

    Seriously Bobby you are quite possibly the most pathological individual person I have ever met.
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  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    On my VFD, you're right.

    We have more other pressing training needs, like a training facility.
    You remind me of the guy that wants a $5,000 table saw , but hasnt taken the time to learn to read a tape. I would rather have good instructors and makeshift facilities than **** poor instructors and a taz mahol
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    Quote Originally Posted by WVFD705 View Post
    And I disagree with your last statement completely. Unless a training system is set up to support the standard, the state does not need to be setting a standard.
    I think you took my last comment other than intended. It sounds like Texas does not have a very VFD friendly training system.

    So what I meant by my comment is it would be more useful to try and have a rural training system put in place as part of any minimum training requirement.

    It is a very weak argument to fight training standards, but not that hard to make the points you've made and ask for support from the state to help meet these new mandates by changing the training to something reasonable for in house training or they can find buckets of money to send volunters away for school.

    I think they would favor #1.

    There are lots of states out there with workable volunteer standards and supportive certification systems. It doesn't have to be the all or nothing system that it sounds like Texas has adopted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HuntPA View Post
    ...Are you looking for a flammable liquids training prop? Cut a 150 gallon fuel oil drum in half...
    In NJ, this would possibly land you a short stay in jail and definitely some hefty EPA/DEP fines. Any/all live fire training is to be done at approved training facilities only. No, the back yard of the firehouse will not qualify as an approved facility.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    In NJ, this would possibly land you a short stay in jail and definitely some hefty EPA/DEP fines. Any/all live fire training is to be done at approved training facilities only. No, the back yard of the firehouse will not qualify as an approved facility.
    NJ is just a bit different on a few things than the rest of the world. "come on vacation, leave on probation".

    I just about had a gas station attendant want to fight about me trying to pump my own diesel - how was i to know it was illegal?
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Um, YES. The fact is when you get cornered, and can't defend your BULL SCHITT, you ALWAYS and I mean ALWAYS, say some crap not "Not my job" or "Not my responsibility" or "That's above my pay grade."

    You have come on these forums and REPEATEDLY made it seem like you are some one of importance and influence in BOTH of your fire departments. Now, when it is no longer convenient for you to keep up that nonsensical premise you pass the buck.

    Seriously Bobby you are quite possibly the most pathological individual person I have ever met.

    Yes, there are things that i have influence in, and things I do not.

    The Chief at my VFD sets training policy. Not the training Officer and not myself. He consults us and asks our opinion, and more often than not goes with our recommdations, but in the end, it comes down to his decision.

    The Chief also has decided that he writes the grants.

    How is that passing the buck?

    In my combo department the Chief and the deputy Chief sets training policy. They set policy reagrding operations. And yes, when there is an officer in the truck above me ... It's his truck, not mine.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 05-10-2013 at 02:07 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    NJ is just a bit different on a few things than the rest of the world. "come on vacation, leave on probation".

    I just about had a gas station attendant want to fight about me trying to pump my own diesel - how was i to know it was illegal?
    Funny thing is....NJ pays less per gallon than most states....and we have someone pump it for us!
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    On my VFD, you're right.

    We have more other pressing training needs, like a training facility.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3b97...ayer_embedded#!
    NO Excuses -this is from :lower Arkansas --soo
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    Quote Originally Posted by slackjawedyokel View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3b97...ayer_embedded#!
    NO Excuses -this is from :lower Arkansas --soo
    We have done the same thing. And as valuable as it is, you still need live fire.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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