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Thread: Hey LA! This one's for you!

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    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

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    This ought to be good......

    I remember posting in a thread a year or two ago now, where LA was trying to justify that a structure was not occupied if there were no cars in the driveway, or garbage cans or something like that, etc etc. I believe my reply was something to the effect of kids playing around in/doing whatever in vacant structures all the time....

    Hmm....
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

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    You really think he's going to give a schit?

    Taking bets on how many pages this one hits......I say at least 7.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    But that don't/can't/won't happen in LA.


    I'm in for 12 pages.

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    And besides, LA'll note that he didn't create the problem, and won't loose any sleep anyway.

    Fifteen pages, at least.

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    In before LAFE justifies letting people die.....

    I'll go 9 pages...this topic just went several pages so this one wont get that far.

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    five and a lock
    ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by slackjawedyokel View Post
    five and a lock
    What lock? You need a webteam for that.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    true that ----
    ?

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    What's to lock? All I did was post a story...Seems 100% innocent to me.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    What's to lock? All I did was post a story...Seems 100% innocent to me.

    Then change your name to CHRISTMAS GOOSE!

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    Imagine that.

    I think he's taking the weekend off, which means he flits around on the computer all day while he's at his (for lack of a better word) job.
    Chenzo likes this.
    IAFF

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    I'm in for 8 pages.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    I'm in for 8 pages.
    I don't know bro, maybe we should post up a pic of an ultra dangerous conflagrating all hands metal trash can fire in a 2 million square foot vacant warehouse, just to spice things up a bit.
    IAFF

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    Imagine that.

    I think he's taking the weekend off, which means he flits around on the computer all day while he's at his (for lack of a better word) job.
    No, I was at an LSU-FETI officer's training class Friday night and Saturday.

    Amazing given that I don't give a hoot about training.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    No, I was at an LSU-FETI officer's training class Friday night and Saturday.

    Amazing given that I don't give a hoot about training.
    There are people that attend training in order to learn and share and those that attend training to build their resume.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    No, I was at an LSU-FETI officer's training class Friday night and Saturday.

    Amazing given that I don't give a hoot about training.
    Oh, you give a hoot about training alright, take all the classes you can, gets you far enough away from the department in case a call comes in.

    Be honest, you refuse to fight any fire unless it has an "Emergency Gas Shut Off Valve" built into it.
    IAFF

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    No, I was at an LSU-FETI officer's training class Friday night and Saturday.

    Amazing given that I don't give a hoot about training.
    I don't give a hoot where you were, respond to the thread. How is it possible that one teenager died, and another were injured in a VACANT building?

    Come on LA, explain it. Justify why you don't search vacant buildings. I'm not letting you walk away from this, because you've adamantly opposed operating interior, let alone on a vacant structure. Where's your logic and reasoning? Come on, back up your position.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    I don't know bro, maybe we should post up a pic of an ultra dangerous conflagrating all hands metal trash can fire in a 2 million square foot vacant warehouse, just to spice things up a bit.
    I got this..........

    Name:  boil44.jpg
Views: 1030
Size:  54.4 KB
    scfire86 likes this.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    I got this..........

    Attachment 22869
    You guys handle that without going inside, that warehouse that was built with bricks from Kuala Lampur, it could come in at any time. I'll be heading out taking a class on helo water drop crew disagreement mitigation.
    IAFF

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    I'll be heading out taking a class on helo water drop crew disagreement mitigation.
    Finally! I won't be the ONLY one...
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    I don't give a hoot where you were, respond to the thread. How is it possible that one teenager died, and another were injured in a VACANT building?

    Come on LA, explain it. Justify why you don't search vacant buildings. I'm not letting you walk away from this, because you've adamantly opposed operating interior, let alone on a vacant structure. Where's your logic and reasoning? Come on, back up your position.
    My department is not in Vegas. We don't have the problem of abandoned or vacant buildings being occupied by squatters. We also don't have a significant issue with abandoned or vacant buildings being utilized by kids to hangout in.

    In our area there is simply NO reason to commit interior to abandoned buildings to conduct searches. life safety is simply NOT an operational issue.

    If you want to drive down here, and find a reason why I need to be concerned about this in either my combination or volunteer districts, I'll put you up in my spare bedroom and feed you, but you'll be wasting your time because you simply will not find this to be an issue.

    That, my friend, is the reason.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    My department is not in Vegas. We don't have the problem of abandoned or vacant buildings being occupied by squatters. We also don't have a significant issue with abandoned or vacant buildings being utilized by kids to hangout in.

    In our area there is simply NO reason to commit interior to abandoned buildings to conduct searches. life safety is simply NOT an operational issue.

    If you want to drive down here, and find a reason why I need to be concerned about this in either my combination or volunteer districts, I'll put you up in my spare bedroom and feed you, but you'll be wasting your time because you simply will not find this to be an issue.

    That, my friend, is the reason.
    Until the day it happens and you burn to death a group of kids for not even taking a look...
    Chenzo, RyanK63 and Truck-10-VES like this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    My department is not in Vegas.
    Thank god for Vegas.
    We don't have the problem of abandoned or vacant buildings being occupied by squatters. We also don't have a significant issue with abandoned or vacant buildings being utilized by kids to hangout in.
    Until it happens. Until you reach the day where there is a squatter, or a couple kids, hanging out in a vacant house and cause a fire. What happens that day? Do you shake your heads and say "NO, that's not possible, it's never happened before so how could it happen now?

    In our area there is simply NO reason to commit interior to abandoned buildings to conduct searches. life safety is simply NOT an operational issue.
    So... Let me get this straight. Saving property; not important. Saving Live; not important.... What exactly do you do then?
    If I recall correctly, the mission of the fire service is to "Protect lives and save property" is it not? Sooo...What exactly do you do then? If property and lives are unimportant to you, WHAT DO YOU DO?


    If you want to drive down here, and find a reason why I need to be concerned about this in either my combination or volunteer districts, I'll put you up in my spare bedroom and feed you, but you'll be wasting your time because you simply will not find this to be an issue.
    Give it time, it will happen. Do you think West Texas expected that fertilizer plant to blow up? Do you think Boston expected two bombs to be set off during a marathon? Do you think anyone expected 9/11? That's why you don't get it, man. It's not about what you have encountered. It's about what's POSSIBLE, not what always happens or has never happened.

    That, my friend, is the reason.
    I'm not, will not, nor have I ever been, your friend.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

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    Thank god for Vegas.

    Vastly different community where squatting and utilizing empty buildings for this type of thing is the norm.

    Also vastly different resource set where likely they put at least 15-20 members on scene on the first alarm within 6-8 minutes.



    So... Let me get this straight. Saving property; not important. Saving Live; not important.... What exactly do you do then?
    If I recall correctly, the mission of the fire service is to "Protect lives and save property" is it not? Sooo...What exactly do you do then? If property and lives are unimportant to you, WHAT DO YOU DO?

    Yes, both of those are important. I have no issues committing to save lives when viable and necessary. At this time it's simply not necessary to commit to interior operations on abandoned buildings, or even vacant buildings to protect lives as the risk does not exist at a statistically significant level.

    As far as property we've discussed this before. i will not commit members to abandoned buildings with unknown structural issues, that the owner has decided to not maintain. Our lives are simply too valuable.

    Vacant property which is till maintained has a higher value, and given viable savable property in association with the correct training, experience, manpower, resources and water supply for the structure, I have no issues committing interior manpower. Given problems in any of those areas, again, our lives are too valuable to commit interior simply to save property,


    Give it time, it will happen. Do you think West Texas expected that fertilizer plant to blow up? Do you think Boston expected two bombs to be set off during a marathon? Do you think anyone expected 9/11? That's why you don't get it, man. It's not about what you have encountered. It's about what's POSSIBLE, not what always happens or has never happened.

    As far as West, given they had pressurized tanks on site combined with fertilizer, they should have considered that possibility.

    Given Boston, I am sure that they were very well aware that they were a possible target and have no doubt that they had plans for such an event. I am very sure that they knew that it was simply a matter of time.

    Funny thing is that my combo department covers a miliatary facility with a civilian explosives manufacturing component, and my VFD is the primary mutual aid department. My combo department covers a refinery with significant potential, and my VFD is the primary mutual aid department for a much more volatile low-flash point refinery in the district to our north.. And both my combo and VFD covers a very busy interstate, so we know all about planning and preparing for "possibilities".

    Will there be a day that we may have victims in a vacant or abandoned building when we arrive? Likely, yes. When will that day be? Who knows. But I do know that at this time, it's an unlikely possibility, and i will not commit members interior on abandoned building fires based on that outside possibility without some external reason to prompt me too. We simply are too valuable.


    I'm not, will not, nor have I ever been, your friend.

    That''s too bad. I'm a lot of fun at parties.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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