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Thread: Lt. Ray hits another home run!

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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    It isn't the reality that people die and sometimes we can't do anything about it. What is so appalling is your azzhole, cavalier, whoop dee freaking doo, who gives a dam(n) somebody died in a fire it ain't my problem time for bed MOTHER F***ING pathetic disgusting inhumane why the hell are you even a firefighter attitude. There is no excuse for it. We all know people die, but none of us are yawning and acting like it doesn't mean a God Damned thing because none of your VFD members got a boo boo. I really wish some of your citizens would read the absolute horse schitt you post here. Because I think whatever stature you believe you have would be gone in a blink of an eye. Guys like you pretending to be firefighters just make me want to puke up my entire intestinal tract.
    So how should I think about it?

    Should I be in grief even though I have no connection to the folks who were killed?

    Should I spend time thinking about my actions even though I could have had no effect on the outcome of the incident?

    Yes, it's unfortunate and is painful for the friends, families and relatives, and certainly I see it as an unfortunate event, but exactly how do you want me to feel as somebody completely disconnected from the victims?

    Yes it sucks, but yes it happens, and always will happen. And as much i do not want to see folks die in this way, there is little or nothing that the suppression side can do to prevent it.

    And throwing our members into ultrahazardous environments and accepting firefighter injuries and deaths is not the solution.

    We have the right to go home after every call, and if that means not taking the risks for victims that some see as acceptable, which may sacrifice a civilian on occasion, so be it.

    Until we see fire prevention, not suppression and response, as the solution, and fund it as such, we will continue to lose an unacceptable number of civilians.

    As far as pretending, most that I have served with would disagree.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 07-10-2013 at 08:58 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post

    And I will not accepting seeing my brothers being hurt or injured to attempt to save my family.
    You have more compassion for firefighters than you do your own family? I clearly remember you telling me that you're not a "brother" and you're just fine with that, so I'm having a hard time following on this.

    Have you told your family that you'll prevent the fire department from trying to rescue them if they're trapped?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post

    Because firefighters should not be injured or killed doing the job. It's not complicated.
    FEMSA gets it: "Firefighting is an ultra hazardous, unavoidably dangerous activity."

    Injuries are going to occur. And, unfortunately, deaths will also occur. It's the nature of the job. The public expects the fire department to put themselves in a reasonable amount of danger in order extinguish fires and rescue citizens. It's really that simple.

    Where is it your place to refuse to accept that yes, the citizens ARE right to expect this from us?
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    LA, you're a piece of ****, and no brother of mine. With that attitude, I'm surprised you even have a family. No wonder you're a narcissistic basement dweller. You need professional psychiatric help.
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    Originally Posted by LaFireEducator

    And I will not accepting seeing my brothers being hurt or injured to attempt to save my family.

    Sociopathic behavior at its finest...
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoxAlarm187 View Post
    You have more compassion for firefighters than you do your own family? I clearly remember you telling me that you're not a "brother" and you're just fine with that, so I'm having a hard time following on this.

    Have you told your family that you'll prevent the fire department from trying to rescue them if they're trapped?

    Funny thing is that live within my combination fire district.

    I am outranked by the Captains and Chief officers, so the operation will be their call not mine. If I feel that the operation is too hazardous, I will express my opinion, but in the end, they will be the IC.

    The fact is that I live in a manufactured double-wide. The chances of fire conditions in this type of building being survivable after more than 5-8 minutes is highly unlikely.


    FEMSA gets it: "Firefighting is an ultra hazardous, unavoidably dangerous activity."

    Injuries are going to occur. And, unfortunately, deaths will also occur. It's the nature of the job. The public expects the fire department to put themselves in a reasonable amount of danger in order extinguish fires and rescue citizens. It's really that simple.

    Where is it your place to refuse to accept that yes, the citizens ARE right to expect this from us?
    You accept that. I don't. And I will not as IC employ tactics that put them at risk of injury or death. If I do not meet the citizens expectations, I will deal with that, and deal with any consequences that result. But I will not accept injury to volunteers that do not have wage protections under LA Workman's Comp.

    The citizens do not have the right to expect this from us, especially from volunteers with no wage protection.

    If they wish those expecatations they have the right to increase thier fire taxes by 3-4x to hire full-time members.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyChiefGonzo View Post
    Originally Posted by LaFireEducator



    Sociopathic behavior at its finest...
    Really?

    I fully accept that my family could die in a number of ways. And just about all of them are unpreventable, or even with reasonable pre-cautions, are often caused by uncontrollable actions of others, and cannot be prevented.

    And death by fire is no different. We live in a open plan double wide, which will burn quickly. To expect my brother firefighters to take unreasonable risks is selfish, and unfair to thier families and children who have the right to expect their members to come home unhurt and alive.

    It's not fair to expect firefighters to die or suffer serious burns for my family to live.

    Rescuing my family is my responsibility.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 07-10-2013 at 09:53 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Really?

    I fully accept that my family could die in a number of ways. And just about all of them are unpreventable, or even with reasonable pre-cautions, are often caused by uncontrollable actions of others, and cannot be prevented.

    And death by fire is no different. We live in a open plan double wide, which will burn quickly. To expect my brother firefighters to take unreasonable risks is selfish, and unfair to thier families and children who have the right to expect their members to come home unhurt and alive.

    It's not fair to expect firefighters to die or suffer serious burns for my family to live.

    Rescuing my family is my responsibility.
    Yes, really... the defitintion of sociopath is as follows...

    so·ci·o·path [soh-see-uh-path] , noun Psychiatry.
    A person with a psychopathic personality whose behavior is antisocial, often criminal, and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyChiefGonzo View Post
    Yes, really... the defitintion of sociopath is as follows...
    Accepting the responsibility for the consequences of buying a double-wide with significant fire behavior potential and not expecting others to die or become seriously hurt because of our decision.

    Understanding that escaping from a fire is the responsibility of the us, the occupants, not the fire department.

    And understanding that it is in the end, it is not the responsibility of firefighters to be killed because the we, the occupants have failed to take responsibility for our own own escape.


    Sounds like accepting responsibility for my actions to me.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 07-10-2013 at 10:29 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Accepting the responsibility for the consequences of buying a double-wide with significant fire behavior potential and not expecting others to die or become seriously hurt because of our decision.

    Sounds like accepting responsibility for our actions to me.
    Where was anything ever mentioned about accepting responsibility for one's actions? You were called a sociopath and provided a definition, which you completely ignored. But hey, if the shoe fits...
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Accepting the responsibility for the consequences of buying a double-wide with significant fire behavior potential and not expecting others to die or become seriously hurt because of our decision.

    Sounds like accepting responsibility for our actions to me.
    You are only proving my argument... you are not only a a sociopath, but a narccisistic one at that. Oe of my nieces is going for her Master's degree n psychology.. she could you you as her thesis....
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    Why is it that everytime I read a post by LA I want to punch something?
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    So how should I think about it?

    Should I be in grief even though I have no connection to the folks who were killed?

    Should I spend time thinking about my actions even though I could have had no effect on the outcome of the incident?

    Yes, it's unfortunate and is painful for the friends, families and relatives, and certainly I see it as an unfortunate event, but exactly how do you want me to feel as somebody completely disconnected from the victims?

    Yes it sucks, but yes it happens, and always will happen. And as much i do not want to see folks die in this way, there is little or nothing that the suppression side can do to prevent it.

    And throwing our members into ultrahazardous environments and accepting firefighter injuries and deaths is not the solution.

    We have the right to go home after every call, and if that means not taking the risks for victims that some see as acceptable, which may sacrifice a civilian on occasion, so be it.

    Until we see fire prevention, not suppression and response, as the solution, and fund it as such, we will continue to lose an unacceptable number of civilians.

    As far as pretending, most that I have served with would disagree.
    Thanks for proving my point, you are a very, very, sick man. There is absolutely no reason you should have any position of responsibility or authority over firefighters. You have proven you are a heartless, cold, unfeeling turd of a human being. Frankly, any man, firefighter or not, that wouldn't give his all to save his own family from their house on fire doesn't deserve to be called a man.
    Last edited by FyredUp; 07-10-2013 at 11:53 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rm1524 View Post
    Why is it that everytime I read a post by LA I want to punch something?
    Because those of us with an IQ greater than that of a rock get frustrated when the simplest things elude some people...
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Really?

    I fully accept that my family could die in a number of ways. And just about all of them are unpreventable, or even with reasonable pre-cautions, are often caused by uncontrollable actions of others, and cannot be prevented.

    And death by fire is no different. We live in a open plan double wide, which will burn quickly. To expect my brother firefighters to take unreasonable risks is selfish, and unfair to thier families and children who have the right to expect their members to come home unhurt and alive.

    It's not fair to expect firefighters to die or suffer serious burns for my family to live.

    Rescuing my family is my responsibility.
    I clicked on FH this morning around 6ish and noticed that you were also logged on. That puts it at about 8ish your time. I had my morning cup of coffee, checked out the sports section, woke up the wife, and headed off to work. I checked back in at noon and you were still here grinding away. Here it is 1930 and I just finished cleaning up the kitchen (I lost at zilch) and here you are. Now I know that you ride the pine all day getting paid by the citizens of your district to do whatever it is that you do. I know that Fyred is retyred, Gonz is on shift work like me, and I'm betting the others are sneaking in when they can. You seem to stay on here like its some sort of Internet dialysis. And after the poo poo platter that you served up today, I've come to the conclusion that in your 33 or whatever year stint of going to what you call "gig", the scenarios that you are given, and the total dooshbaggery that you respond with, that you have never been presented with anything close to making those decisions. And frankly, I'm relieved by the thought that you most likely never will.

    So g'head and puff up that chest, tell us what you'd do, paint yourself as someone in a position to make those decisions, and keep selling that cart full of manure to whoever will listen. Because in the end, the citizens will be ok mostly because you won't be the one pulling the hook and holding everyone out on the lawn to watch a perfectly viable structure get reduced to a pile of ash.

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    So the solution is to outlaw fires? By funding prevention? What about fires caused by mother nature? You gonna outlaw them too? Is it some weird conspiracy that revolves around holding the citizens hostage with non-existent fire protection for big money until they get sick of it and outlaw fires?
    My ancestors lived in igloos, about as fire proof as you can get, maybe you should look into that.
    Last edited by conrad427; 07-11-2013 at 12:01 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rm1524 View Post
    Why is it that everytime I read a post by LA I want to punch something?
    Join the club, we now have t-shirts!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToDaRoof View Post
    Join the club, we now have t-shirts!
    I'm a 3X tall if'n your taking orders.
    The fire service is about service to our fellow man.
    There is a trust that must not be broken and we are the keepers of that trust.
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    Quote Originally Posted by conrad427 View Post
    My ancestors lived in igloos, about as fire proof as you can get, maybe you should look into that.
    Actually, igloos aren't necessarily fire proof since they will melt if the fire is big enough.

    On the other hand, I guess that could be considered one of the first residential fire suppression systems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    I clicked on FH this morning around 6ish and noticed that you were also logged on. That puts it at about 8ish your time. I had my morning cup of coffee, checked out the sports section, woke up the wife, and headed off to work. I checked back in at noon and you were still here grinding away. Here it is 1930 and I just finished cleaning up the kitchen (I lost at zilch) and here you are. Now I know that you ride the pine all day getting paid by the citizens of your district to do whatever it is that you do. I know that Fyred is retyred, Gonz is on shift work like me, and I'm betting the others are sneaking in when they can. You seem to stay on here like its some sort of Internet dialysis. And after the poo poo platter that you served up today, I've come to the conclusion that in your 33 or whatever year stint of going to what you call "gig", the scenarios that you are given, and the total dooshbaggery that you respond with, that you have never been presented with anything close to making those decisions. And frankly, I'm relieved by the thought that you most likely never will.

    So g'head and puff up that chest, tell us what you'd do, paint yourself as someone in a position to make those decisions, and keep selling that cart full of manure to whoever will listen. Because in the end, the citizens will be ok mostly because you won't be the one pulling the hook and holding everyone out on the lawn to watch a perfectly viable structure get reduced to a pile of ash.
    Why is it "some sort of internet dialysis" for lafe, but totally OK for other guys? Other long time members who post at about the same rate of 1000 per year include DCGonzo and scfire86. Bones 42 isn't far behind them at about 850 per year. Double standard in play here? If I continue at the rate I've been going in my first couple of months, I'll be right there too (which REALLY troubles me).

    Now don't get me wrong, I am not trashing your post. I've rarely felt doosh chills like the way I did reading some of lafe's more recent posts. Nor am I comparing the content of any of the above member's posts. Just pointing out some hypocrisy on your part concerning time spent here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Why is it "some sort of internet dialysis" for lafe, but totally OK for other guys? Other long time members who post at about the same rate of 1000 per year include DCGonzo and scfire86. Bones 42 isn't far behind them at about 850 per year. Double standard in play here? If I continue at the rate I've been going in my first couple of months, I'll be right there too (which REALLY troubles me).

    Now don't get me wrong, I am not trashing your post. I've rarely felt doosh chills like the way I did reading some of lafe's more recent posts. Nor am I comparing the content of any of the above member's posts. Just pointing out some hypocrisy on your part concerning time spent here.
    I have been here since 1999, which accounts for the number of posts I have. While the date joined says August 2000, firehouse.com's forum section severely "burped" in 1999 and a lot of posts from that point disappeared into the vast black hole known as cyberspace.

    I wish you could have read some of LA's earlier material... if you think you have "doosh chills" now....
    Last edited by DeputyChiefGonzo; 07-11-2013 at 08:25 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Thanks for proving my point, you are a very, very, sick man. There is absolutely no reason you should have any position of responsibility or authority over firefighters. You have proven you are a heartless, cold, unfeeling turd of a human being. Frankly, any man, firefighter or not, that wouldn't give his all to save his own family from their house on fire doesn't deserve to be called a man.
    I would give MY all.

    The key word there is MY.

    It is MY responsibility to save MY family and potentially die.

    It is not the responsibility of the members of the fire department who are responsible for their own families to save mine. And as such I do not have the expectation that any firefighter should take risks that will jeopardize that responsibility to their families.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 07-11-2013 at 11:08 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Why is it "some sort of internet dialysis" for lafe, but totally OK for other guys? Other long time members who post at about the same rate of 1000 per year include DCGonzo and scfire86. Bones 42 isn't far behind them at about 850 per year. Double standard in play here? If I continue at the rate I've been going in my first couple of months, I'll be right there too (which REALLY troubles me).

    Now don't get me wrong, I am not trashing your post. I've rarely felt doosh chills like the way I did reading some of lafe's more recent posts. Nor am I comparing the content of any of the above member's posts. Just pointing out some hypocrisy on your part concerning time spent here.
    Here it is, 0600ish, lo and behold who is at it again during their 8 hour "full time gig". I never got into post count up there and have not ever used post count or time here to judge someone's character. If that we're the case with me, I'd be on the short bus here with what I've accumulated.
    I was in a round about way commenting on him making FH, and responding to every post here, a priority over said "full time gig". You'll find that I'm the farthest thing from hypocritical. Post count and join date are status numbers that shouldn't even appear on forums. He'll, some forums have "respect/hate" gauges on them in the form of a points system awarded or taken away by fellow users. I have no need for that.
    I have enjoyed some of your posts, and respect your opinion and also respect the fact that, like me, you choose to keep your department and years on the job to yourself.
    I also think that your use of the word "hypocrisy", to summarize me, was a poor choice. Go back and read the last two pages of this thread, especially hims posts, and see if I was being hypocritical.
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    I was going to go back and edit out my rampant use of the word "here". I'm on my mobile device and can't see the whole screen. Please consider this my notification that I have addressed the "here" quota per post usage, and will concentrate on not using the word "here" here as much on here.
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    I stay logged in all the time.. And I have the window minimized in my iPhone bc I'm involved in a few hiring processes and I closely follow their proceedings..

    I guess since I'm logged in 24/7 I must not work or be productive..

    Who cares who is logged in or who has more posts.. There are many sub-forums on here that people may be intrested in besides this 1..just saying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Why is it "some sort of internet dialysis" for lafe, but totally OK for other guys? Other long time members who post at about the same rate of 1000 per year include DCGonzo and scfire86. Bones 42 isn't far behind them at about 850 per year. Double standard in play here? If I continue at the rate I've been going in my first couple of months, I'll be right there too (which REALLY troubles me).

    Now don't get me wrong, I am not trashing your post. I've rarely felt doosh chills like the way I did reading some of lafe's more recent posts. Nor am I comparing the content of any of the above member's posts. Just pointing out some hypocrisy on your part concerning time spent here.
    The point is LA is supposedly on the clock at his Pub Ed job during the day yet almost everyday he is in and out of here multiple times. If he is so busy doing Pub Ed, and training, and all the other stuff he says he does, how can he have so much time to be here?
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