Why register? ...To Enhance Your Experience
+ Reply to Thread
Page 31 of 32 FirstFirst ... 212829303132 LastLast
Results 601 to 620 of 622
Like Tree379Likes

Thread: Lt. Ray hits another home run!

  1. #601
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    9,974

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    And nowhere did I say that I would let them die. I did say that performing the rescue would be MY responsibility before the fire department arrived.

    But I clearly would try to disawaid the incident commander from making entry and risking members lives if clearly there was little chance of survival. Yes, my wife is the most important person in my life, but those members are also the most important person in their wives and children's lives, and placing them in danger if there is significant risk is not the right thing to do.

    If the chances are minimal and there is a significant risk of injury, I am not selfish enough to put my needs ahead of what is right for them, and more importantly, for their families.


    This isn't about me, or what I would do, but it is about what is right for the members, and more importantly, the families of the members of my combo department
    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    No, actually I wouldn't.
    And that's why even your family would be better off being served by a six year old or an Australian dog.
    FyredUp and Chenzo like this.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."


  2. #602
    Forum Member IronValor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Richmond, Kentucky
    Posts
    210

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    And that's why even your family would be better off being served by a six year old or an Australian dog.
    What if.. The 6 Year old HAD an Australian dog?

    Mind.. Blown
    Do not let the ghosts of our fallen brothers gaze upon you and ask " What have you done to my profession?" FTB DTRT EGH

  3. #603
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Bossier Parrish, Louisiana
    Posts
    10,373

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IronValor View Post
    What if.. The 6 Year old HAD an Australian dog?

    Mind.. Blown
    Would it make any difference if it was a 6 year old Australian boy and a non-Australian dog?
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  4. #604
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    9,647

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Would it make any difference if it was a 6 year old Australian boy and a non-Australian dog?
    Either way anyone would stand a better chance with them...
    scfire86, FireMedic049 and Chenzo like this.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

  5. #605
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    9,974

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Would it make any difference if it was a 6 year old Australian boy and a non-Australian dog?
    It makes a HUGE difference if it is one of them instead of you and your VFD idiots.
    FyredUp, FireMedic049 and Chenzo like this.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  6. #606
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    SW Missouri
    Posts
    1,133

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I get it. And when I was younger, I used to believe it.

    But I guess as I have grown older, my perspectives and my beliefs have changed.
    Then get the **** out because your pussy beliefs have no place in the fire service.
    FyredUp likes this.

  7. #607
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    1,880

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rm1524 View Post
    Then get the **** out because your pussy beliefs have no place in the fire service.
    Hey don't hold back -let him know how you really feel.
    FyredUp and rm1524 like this.
    ?

  8. #608
    Forum Member ToDaRoof's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    The Old Dominion
    Posts
    170

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rm1524 View Post
    Then get the **** out because your pussy beliefs have no place in the fire service.
    99.99% of the fire service approves of this post.
    FyredUp and rm1524 like this.

  9. #609
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    9,647

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rm1524 View Post
    Then get the **** out because your pussy beliefs have no place in the fire service.
    I wish I wasn't too shy to post something like this.
    rm1524 likes this.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

  10. #610
    Forum Member snowball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Just North of South Central
    Posts
    2,731

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    I wish I wasn't too shy to post something like this.
    In your own words,

    "BWHHAAAAAAAAAAHAAAAHAAAAHAAAAA HAAAAAAHAAAAAHAAAAAHAAAAAHAAAA A!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!"
    IAFF

  11. #611
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ToDaRoof View Post
    99.99% of the fire service approves of this post.
    The .01% will take this and twist, turn, divert, discombobulate, skew, alter and flat out lie about what the 99.99% thinks in an effort to legitimize the .01%'s beliefs.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  12. #612
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    68

    Default

    I just finished reading Col. B. P. McCoy's book, Passion of Command. In the conclusion he writes the following:

    " . . . the leader must look squarely in the mirror and gather the moral strength necessary to order his men into harm's way, to see them killed and maimed, to look into the eyes of the wounded and upon the faces of the dead, yet not lose his fighting spirit. Moreover, the true test is to look oneself in the mirror after young men who trusted their commander are killed and maimed, and do it all over again without losing the will to violently close with the enemy."

    There will be moments, hopefully very few, where Fire Service Leaders will need to live by these words. And to discount the possibility is to abdicate your responsibility and moral authority as a leader. No one, soldier or firefighter, wants to see their people injured or killed. But it will happen. And if we don't fulfill our duty, innocents suffer and die instead.

    That's the difference.
    Last edited by MBarnes; 07-13-2013 at 04:15 PM.

  13. #613
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MBarnes View Post
    I just finished reading Col. B. P. McCoy's book, Passion of Command. In the conclusion he writes the following:

    " . . . the leader must look squarely in the mirror and gather the moral strength necessary to order his men into harm's way, to see them killed and maimed, to look into the eyes of the wounded and upon the faces of the dead, yet not lose his fighting spirit. Moreover, the true test is to look oneself in the mirror after young men who trusted their commander are killed and maimed, and do it all over again without losing the will to violently close with the enemy."

    There will be moments, hopefully very few, where Fire Service Leaders will need to live by these words. And to discount the possibility is to abdicate your responsibility and moral authority as a leader. No one, solder or firefighter, wants to see their people injured or killed. But it will happen. And if we don't fulfill our duty, innocents suffer and die in our place.

    That's the difference.
    Bing-freaking-o!
    rm1524 likes this.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  14. #614
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    SW Missouri
    Posts
    1,133

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by slackjawedyokel View Post
    Hey don't hold back -let him know how you really feel.
    I can't.....it would be to many of these ****** to make any sense.
    slackjawedyokel and conrad427 like this.

  15. #615
    Forum Member conrad427's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Just south of Canada
    Posts
    526

    Default

    Like this? ****************************** ****************************** ****************************** ****************************** ****************************** ****************************** **************************?
    The fire service is about service to our fellow man.
    There is a trust that must not be broken and we are the keepers of that trust.
    Captain Dave LeBlanc

  16. #616
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    611

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MBarnes View Post
    I just finished reading Col. B. P. McCoy's book, Passion of Command. In the conclusion he writes the following:

    " . . . the leader must look squarely in the mirror and gather the moral strength necessary to order his men into harm's way, to see them killed and maimed, to look into the eyes of the wounded and upon the faces of the dead, yet not lose his fighting spirit. Moreover, the true test is to look oneself in the mirror after young men who trusted their commander are killed and maimed, and do it all over again without losing the will to violently close with the enemy."

    There will be moments, hopefully very few, where Fire Service Leaders will need to live by these words. And to discount the possibility is to abdicate your responsibility and moral authority as a leader. No one, soldier or firefighter, wants to see their people injured or killed. But it will happen. And if we don't fulfill our duty, innocents suffer and die instead.

    That's the difference.
    I've got to say I don't much like the analogy between combat and firefighting. I believe it is an apples and oranges situation. Yes, fire ground commanders know there is a possibility of firefighters dying but it is really an abstract piece of knowledge. They don't really EXPECT firefighters to die. Military commanders not only expect it but pretty much KNOW it's going to happen. There is a world of difference. Firefighters die at the rate of about three deaths per 100,000 fires, with almost 3/4 of them being cardiac or MVA while responding. I'm not dismissing those deaths as less worthy or important, but these are not part of the hazard an IC expects when he orders firefighters into a burning structure. I don't know the rate at which veterans are killed in combat, but I suspect it is significantly more common than our firefighting deaths.

  17. #617
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    9,647

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    I've got to say I don't much like the analogy between combat and firefighting. I believe it is an apples and oranges situation. Yes, fire ground commanders know there is a possibility of firefighters dying but it is really an abstract piece of knowledge. They don't really EXPECT firefighters to die. Military commanders not only expect it but pretty much KNOW it's going to happen. There is a world of difference. Firefighters die at the rate of about three deaths per 100,000 fires, with almost 3/4 of them being cardiac or MVA while responding. I'm not dismissing those deaths as less worthy or important, but these are not part of the hazard an IC expects when he orders firefighters into a burning structure. I don't know the rate at which veterans are killed in combat, but I suspect it is significantly more common than our firefighting deaths.
    I don't think we are supposed to take the analogy directly as meaning to send men to their death as firefighters. I think the point is simply this, if you are not willing as a fireground officer to send firefighters into harms way to attempt to rescue trapped civilians, or in an attempt to extinguish the fire, you probably don't belong in a leadership role. I am not saying we order people to make suicidal charges into building fully involved or on the verge of collapse. I am saying if an officer is unwilling to send firefighters into life viable rescue situations, or into fire conditions where we can make a difference and save a structure, they have no business at all being in that position.
    rm1524 and fotowun like this.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

  18. #618
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    611

    Default

    I agree that it absolutely is a part of the leadership role, just at a different level than military. Very necessary for IC to be able to do it, and if he can't he should not be in that position.

  19. #619
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    9,647

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    I agree that it absolutely is a part of the leadership role, just at a different level than military. Very necessary for IC to be able to do it, and if he can't he should not be in that position.
    Dude, do we actually agree on something?
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

  20. #620
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,554

    Default

    Originally Posted by captnjak

    I agree that it absolutely is a part of the leadership role, just at a different level than military. Very necessary for IC to be able to do it, and if he can't he should not be in that position.
    Posted by FyredUp
    Dude, do we actually agree on something?
    It appears you have...
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. The Quint hits the UK
    By SteveDude in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 10-13-2005, 04:37 PM
  2. I know this isn't a firefighter but it still hits home
    By Itsmy6 in forum Line of Duty: In Memory Of
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-06-2005, 01:02 AM
  3. LODD Hits Home
    By scfirewife41 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 06-01-2005, 09:20 AM
  4. Lutan1 hits the big 30!
    By NJFFSA16 in forum The Off Duty Forums
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 11-12-2002, 02:34 PM
  5. When fire hits home
    By ADSNWFLD in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 08-30-2001, 10:28 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts