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Thread: Alcohol and fire trucks...not a winning combo...

  1. #21
    Forum Member WVFD705's Avatar
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    I disagree completely. The issue is the alcohol, not the management of the alcohol. The fire service exists to perform a mission, and alcohol in no way, shape or form aids us in performing that mission.

    Having people drink at a fire hall likely means people are drinking at the fire hall then going home. If that includes driving, then we are endangering the very citizens we are supposed to protect. I just don't see any benefit there.


  2. #22
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    The problem is not the alcohol in the firehouse.

    The problem is the management of the alcohol in the firehouse.

    I have no issues with the member shaving a beer or two in the firehouse after a drill as long as it's clear that they will not be making runs.

    And I have been on departments where that was perfectly clear.
    This speaks volumes of your "character" or lack thereof.
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    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  3. #23
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    Don't drink and respond. Its that simple.
    I'll quote myself. It's still that simple.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  4. #24
    Forum Member Chenzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    The problem is not the alcohol in the firehouse.

    The problem is the management of the alcohol in the firehouse.

    I have no issues with the member shaving a beer or two in the firehouse after a drill as long as it's clear that they will not be making runs.

    And I have been on departments where that was perfectly clear.
    Did your mother drop you on your head when you were a child? Did she run you over with the lawn mower or something? Jesus man....

    Fighting fire, saving lives, protecting property is bad...

    Informing and being upfront with the community that your fire department may or may not be able to meet their expectations when you show, potentially causing the loss of life and property is bad...

    Deceiving the community by NOT informing them that you don't really even have a fire department, but a couple guys who may or may not show up and spray water is okay....

    Having beer in the firehouse, and potentially giving off the image that the fire department is a bunch of drunks is okay though....

    Oh... Okay....
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    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chenzo View Post
    Did your mother drop you on your head when you were a child? Did she run you over with the lawn mower or something? Jesus man....

    Fighting fire, saving lives, protecting property is bad...

    And where exactly did I say that it was "bad"?

    I did state that it comes after that we have assured our safety on the fireground, but never referred to it as something that we should not do.


    Informing and being upfront with the community that your fire department may or may not be able to meet their expectations when you show, potentially causing the loss of life and property is bad...

    And again, I have no doubt that most of the members of our community understand the limitations of the emergency services as a whole in the rural areas of the parish.

    Given that you do not live here and know nothing of the community ....


    Deceiving the community by NOT informing them that you don't really even have a fire department, but a couple guys who may or may not show up and spray water is okay....

    I would strongly debate that statement.

    Yes, there are times that our abilities are limited due to manpower but there are also times that we have more capabilities than just about any other rural department in the parish.


    Having beer in the firehouse, and potentially giving off the image that the fire department is a bunch of drunks is okay though....

    And yes it is OK if the department uses the rental of the social hall as a community service and a way to raise funds or if the consummation of a beer or two after drill is monitored with firm and hard prohibitions on emergency response.

    Would I want it in my firehouse? No. But I will not condemn it in other places if there are controls on response.



    Oh... Okay....
    Funny how you twist and contort.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  6. #26
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Funny how you twist and contort.
    You should know.. you are a master at it.
    Chenzo likes this.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  7. #27
    the 4-1-4 Jasper 45's Avatar
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    And, he defends and condones drinking in the firehouse. Brilliant.

    He is now completely in the same category as hottotter.

  8. #28
    Forum Member conrad427's Avatar
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    I wonder if a lot of these depts. would be better off if the "social hall" was turned into a "training hall"?
    Beer after training? What about after a run? Non-responding members? Jackets and shirts for everyone? I am starting to see why some career guys get so mad when we volunteers call ourselves "Professional Volunteers." Good grief. Please don't lump me in with these Martians!
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by conrad427 View Post
    I wonder if a lot of these depts. would be better off if the "social hall" was turned into a "training hall"?

    I guess that depends on if they can operate without the lost revenue, which in some cases, in pretty significant.

    In the cases of the two previous VFDs that i was on that made some income off renting the space, they were used for both purposes.


    Beer after training? What about after a run? Non-responding members? Jackets and shirts for everyone? I am starting to see why some career guys get so mad when we volunteers call ourselves "Professional Volunteers." Good grief. Please don't lump me in with these Martians!
    Some of us don't really care what those career guys think of us.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  10. #30
    the 4-1-4 Jasper 45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Some of us don't really care what those career guys think of us.
    Obviously you do. Other wise you wouldn't have to prattle and dance and try to justify your existence to them. It's obvious that it matters a lot to you.

  11. #31
    Forum Member ToDaRoof's Avatar
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    Wait a second, don't you work for a career department? "Those" career guys? Taking more pride in your volunteer agency than the one that pays your bills? Something's not adding up here...

  12. #32
    Forum Member Chenzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToDaRoof View Post
    Wait a second, don't you work for a career department? "Those" career guys? Taking more pride in your volunteer agency than the one that pays your bills? Something's not adding up here...
    Nothing he posts adds up!

    He's consistent at one thing, diverting the argument when he knows he's losing... That's it.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

  13. #33
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Some of us don't really care what those career guys think of us.
    As a matter of fact...we do; as well as your call and volunteer brothers who do the job the right way while people you try to drag it down. Thank God or what ever deity one worships or not that you are in the extreme minority.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToDaRoof View Post
    Wait a second, don't you work for a career department? "Those" career guys? Taking more pride in your volunteer agency than the one that pays your bills? Something's not adding up here...
    I have a tremendous amount of pride in my combination department.

    And yes, I do have more pride in my volunteer department, because they are volunteers.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  15. #35
    Forum Member ToDaRoof's Avatar
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    Pathetic... :rolleyes

  16. #36
    MembersZone Subscriber tree68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by conrad427 View Post
    I wonder if a lot of these depts. would be better off if the "social hall" was turned into a "training hall"?
    In a lot of them, that's exactly what the room is used for when it's not being rented out.

    This isn't an either/or thing. It is possible to have a competent, well-trained fire department that has a banquet facility where alcohol can be served. And that's precisely the case in many places.
    Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

    Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ToDaRoof View Post
    Pathetic... :rolleyes
    So why is it so pathetic to have more pride in my volunteer agency than my career gig?
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  18. #38
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    Talk about a posterchild for abortion.
    Chenzo likes this.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Funny how you twist and contort.
    I totally understood where he went with that post. You seem to take things in the literal sense that most people can smell the sarcasm. Do you take Ritalin?
    Chenzo likes this.
    IAFF

  20. #40
    Forum Member snowball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    So why is it so pathetic to have more pride in my volunteer agency than my career gig?
    You're not seriously asking for an explanation here are you?
    IAFF

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