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Thread: Report from Engine Co. 82 video

  1. #21
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    The fact that it is two different worlds has no relevance on the level of Brotherhood and commitment needed or expected.

    Brotherhood is developed through spending time together, either on shift, or in the case of a VFD, thorough training and runs.

    The fact is, with holidays, we have less than 50 training nights together and a handful of runs. In that limited amount of time it's far more difficult to develop the brotherhood associated with a career department, or even a busy VFD, such as my previous VFD.

    Given the very limited number of runs that we do mutual aid, it's almost impossible to develop any level of brotherhood with the mutual aid departments.



    So you're members in podunk Louisiana shouldn't have the same level and belief in the Brotherhood as though from a larger FD?

    See above .. Less training and far fewer calls = fewer opportunities to spend time together as a department.

    Furthermore, the community depends on you to show up and mitigate there emergency, and you call for a lower level of commitment?

    I have discussed this before. Down here the fire department is much smaller part of the members lives than it is in some VFDs in some parts of the country. Yes, they are committed, but not to the level that some may expect.

    So, if your members don't commit to being a member or the fire department, why do you even have a "fire department?"

    Your idea of commitment and mine are very different.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.


  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Your idea of commitment and mine are very different.
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    .............................. ............
    conrad427 and HFD50 like this.
    "A fire department that writes off civilians faster than an express line of 6 reasons or less is not progressive, it's dangerous, because it's run by fear. Fear does not save lives, it endangers them." -- Lt. Ray McCormack FDNY

    "Because if you don't think you're good, nobody else will." -- DC Tom Laun (ret) Syracuse

  3. #23
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    I am not a regular contributor on the Firehouse Forums so I'm sorry if it seems like I am intruding however, does anyone know of another place on the internet where I can read forums about firefighting? This is no longer the place for education and open discussion about such topics as firefighting or anything remotely related to the job.

    All this place is anymore is a bash on LA site. This topic was a deliberate call out to him so more people can rip on his opinions. Don't call me an LA apoligist, but come on people, grow up. Stop feeding the flames and talk about things that matter to other real firefighters. If you all stop calling him out, maybe....just maybe, he won't bother you all so much.

    I'm sure many of you are very knowledgeable and have a lot to contribute. Why not give it a try instead of speding time and brain power on him.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by SFD FF7 View Post
    I am not a regular contributor on the Firehouse Forums so I'm sorry if it seems like I am intruding however, does anyone know of another place on the internet where I can read forums about firefighting? This is no longer the place for education and open discussion about such topics as firefighting or anything remotely related to the job.

    All this place is anymore is a bash on LA site. This topic was a deliberate call out to him so more people can rip on his opinions. Don't call me an LA apoligist, but come on people, grow up. Stop feeding the flames and talk about things that matter to other real firefighters. If you all stop calling him out, maybe....just maybe, he won't bother you all so much.

    I'm sure many of you are very knowledgeable and have a lot to contribute. Why not give it a try instead of speding time and brain power on him.
    I'm relatively new here too and I've also felt the frustration you're feeling. It's friggin endless. And pretty pointless. There's a handful of guys who just can't seem to agree to disagree with eachother. It's OK for guys who live a thousand miles apart to go about their business and perform according to the guidelines of THEIR departments without getting hung up on some other department. I'm all for meaningful debate and disagreement on certain strategies or tactics, but this has gone way overboard.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by SFD FF7 View Post
    I am not a regular contributor on the Firehouse Forums so I'm sorry if it seems like I am intruding however, does anyone know of another place on the internet where I can read forums about firefighting? This is no longer the place for education and open discussion about such topics as firefighting or anything remotely related to the job.

    All this place is anymore is a bash on LA site. This topic was a deliberate call out to him so more people can rip on his opinions. Don't call me an LA apoligist, but come on people, grow up. Stop feeding the flames and talk about things that matter to other real firefighters. If you all stop calling him out, maybe....just maybe, he won't bother you all so much.

    I'm sure many of you are very knowledgeable and have a lot to contribute. Why not give it a try instead of speding time and brain power on him.
    This is a site for learning; unfortunately, a certain individual always posts his opinions contrary to the spirit, the tradition and the mission of the fire service.

    He is quick to criticize, yet cannot take criticism.
    Chenzo likes this.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyChiefGonzo View Post
    This is a site for learning; unfortunately, a certain individual always posts his opinions contrary to the spirit, the tradition and the mission of the fire service.

    He is quick to criticize, yet cannot take criticism.
    Maybe a good way to learn would be to listen to viewpoints and opinions that differ from your own. I'll admit that the individual you refer to appears to let a crippling standard of safety dominate his fireground, but that's for the powers that be down there to decide, not us.
    I think it is overly harsh to state that his opinions are contrary to the "spirit, tradition and the mission of the fire service". You alone don't define those things any more than he does.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Maybe a good way to learn would be to listen to viewpoints and opinions that differ from your own. I'll admit that the individual you refer to appears to let a crippling standard of safety dominate his fireground, but that's for the powers that be down there to decide, not us.
    I think it is overly harsh to state that his opinions are contrary to the "spirit, tradition and the mission of the fire service". You alone don't define those things any more than he does.
    I say ****ing on the memory of brave men that died in the line of duty is "contrary to the spirit and mission" -writing off victims without trying is contrary - he can do what ever gets him through the day down there, but don't try and pass off being a coward as some new wave safety. And SFD FF7 -don't let the door hit you.
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    ?

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by slackjawedyokel View Post
    I say ****ing on the memory of brave men that died in the line of duty is "contrary to the spirit and mission" -writing off victims without trying is contrary - he can do what ever gets him through the day down there, but don't try and pass off being a coward as some new wave safety. And SFD FF7 -don't let the door hit you.

    Like I said, relatively new here. Can you enlighten me on the ****ing on dead brothers' memories?

  9. #29
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Like I said, relatively new here. Can you enlighten me on the ****ing on dead brothers' memories?
    Plain an simple, in the past upon the report of LODDs he has come on here and blamed the Brothers who died for their own deaths. This before any invrestigation, any findings, any final report. In fact he has gone so far as to do it the very day the deaths occurred.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

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    Care to rebut that LAFE?
    Last edited by captnjak; 07-01-2013 at 08:44 PM.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Plain an simple, in the past upon the report of LODDs he has come on here and blamed the Brothers who died for their own deaths. This before any invrestigation, any findings, any final report. In fact he has gone so far as to do it the very day the deaths occurred.
    thank you fyred up -that's exactly what I meant, before the fallen are even in the ground, long before the after action and NIOSH reports. He has pointed fingers, especially when it comes to making a primary search. I have tried to give him the benefit of the doubt for years, but the comment about the kids in the burning car was the straw.
    ?

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Plain an simple, in the past upon the report of LODDs he has come on here and blamed the Brothers who died for their own deaths. This before any invrestigation, any findings, any final report. In fact he has gone so far as to do it the very day the deaths occurred.
    This is fact. He has almost 10G worth of posts. Far to many for me to search. He also admonishes the IAFF and makes them out to be corporate crooks. He has stated that he would not render aid to anyone outside of his jurisdiction for fear of self injury.

    The hang up here is if even I were a moderator here I could not ban him as he does not do or say anything that goes against the terms of use. There are also those of us that strongly believe that he will try to influence young members into his way of thinking. The only backing that he has had so far is some stuffed shirt in a suit blathering on YouTube about how firefighters should not endanger themselves to rescue victims.

    Feel free SFD to search his posts, you'll find that he has done more trolling than what you have seen these past few months from everyone else.
    IAFF

  13. #33
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    One of my favorite parts of the documentary was the discussion scene when the firemen were talking about how the fires were mostly arson jobs and sometime the building would be booby trapped with holes or bags of gasoline that were intended to fall when a door was opened and engulf the firefighters. Then, the firemen talked about how when the people(who sometimes try to kill or injure them) have no one else to turn to for help the FDNY will always answer the call. Even if the cops wont. Pretty powerful.
    The fire service is about service to our fellow man.
    There is a trust that must not be broken and we are the keepers of that trust.
    Captain Dave LeBlanc

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Care to rebut that LAFE?
    Nope.

    When it's obvious, it's obvious.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    Nope.

    When it's obvious, it's obvious.
    And when you get your AZZ handed to you and you know we can prove what we say you clam up.

    Frankly, it was some of the most dispicable schitt I have ever seen posted.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Maybe a good way to learn would be to listen to viewpoints and opinions that differ from your own.
    I do have an open mind. I also have a BS detector that pegs into the red when lies, inuendo and crap gets posted.

    I'll admit that the individual you refer to appears to let a crippling standard of safety dominate his fireground, but that's for the powers that be down there to decide, not us.
    I have a feeling "the powers that be down there" do not know what he posts here or if they do, they choose to ignore it.

    I think it is overly harsh to state that his opinions are contrary to the "spirit, tradition and the mission of the fire service". You alone don't define those things any more than he does.
    I do not alone define the spirit, tradition and mission of the fire service... tens of thousands of my Brothers and Sisters do.
    Last edited by DeputyChiefGonzo; 07-02-2013 at 03:22 PM. Reason: spelling correction.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  17. #37
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Maybe a good way to learn would be to listen to viewpoints and opinions that differ from your own.

    I have done that my whole career. Sometimes I learn from them and sometimes they are nothing more than charlatans looking to destroy the fire service as we know it.

    I'll admit that the individual you refer to appears to let a crippling standard of safety dominate his fireground, but that's for the powers that be down there to decide, not us.

    And many of us here have agreed with that. The issue comes in when he tries to push his ideas as mainstream fire service when they clearly are not.

    I think it is overly harsh to state that his opinions are contrary to the "spirit, tradition and the mission of the fire service". You alone don't define those things any more than he does.

    No he doesn't but the majority of posters here define it in their own way and the vast majority allign with Chief Gonzo's definition than they do with LA.
    Don't be suckered in by LA, he is a cancer to the fire service.
    Last edited by FyredUp; 07-02-2013 at 04:50 PM.
    slackjawedyokel and Chenzo like this.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

  18. #38
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    CaptnJak, It's nice to know that I am not alone in my disgust of the state of the forum. I do happen to agree with most of you here that LA is annoying and not good for the fire service. I'm not sure you forum junkies are any better than he is. I am an occasional forum reader but I prefer hands on training and reading articles from known experts in the field.

    Yokel, thanks for the great idea. I will do my best to avoid the door hitting me on my way out. Thanks for the support.

    You should all do yourself a favor and not let LA, Captnjak or myself get your blood pressure up. It's not worth it and it's not worth my time either.

  19. #39
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    The Watch Desk is back up... Just significantly neutered.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by captnjak View Post
    Care to rebut that LAFE?
    He can't. Because if you search you will find multiple incidents of him doing that very thing. I don't know if you noticed or not but he has not come back to respond because he knows flat out denying it would just be another bald faced lie.
    “The person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing, is nothing, and becomes nothing. He may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn and feel and change and grow and love and live.” Leo F. Buscaglia

    This place gets weirder and weirder every day...

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