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Thread: Method for a raise lower system?

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    Forum Member Fairfield's Avatar
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    Default Method for a raise lower system?

    What is your company's preferred method for raising and lowering a load? Or your personal liked way of doing so? Looking to see what the average way the majority of us are going about.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfield View Post
    What is your company's preferred method for raising and lowering a load? Or your personal liked way of doing so? Looking to see what the average way the majority of us are going about.
    For me, lowering would normally either be a brake bar rack or an MPD. Raising would be either a 3:1 Z-Rig or a 4:1 Block and Tackle although I sometimes use a complex 5:1 haul system. It depends on what the load is, how heavy it is, how far it has to be moved, how many trained people are available, etc.

    Mike
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    Forum Member Fairfield's Avatar
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    Let me expand the question a little as well. Understandably there is a whole lot of variables to this question (countless really). Also let me ask if you had a perfect number of team members what would it be? Obviously all of use would want 50 guys just to haul on a line to raise something. In truth though to have too many team mates would mean a loss of control to a certain extent. For me, I would have 5 rescuers. Combine them with a clean and simple rigging practice by taking away the need for one person to sit on a belay line to lower or raise,and take away the person lowering any rescuer. Rescue climber would descend and ascend on his/her own. Unless doing a pick-off where then they would be raised by the team. Also I would intend on using a counterbalance rescuer when able.

    Then again perfect worlds are nice places

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    Ideal # of bodies varies a lot from my perspective. For my world the amount of gear (ropes, litters, etc.) combined with distance, terrain/difficulty of access/evac, and weather are big factors. More people to haul gear long distances = usually a good thing.

    A litter-based rescue in an other than vertical environment is likely going to have 2 rescuers over the side w/the patient and litter (1 if vertical or a pick-off of a non-litter victim). 2 people rigging the anchors (they are muscle for the raise) + 2 doing system set-up (1 person per line - we use parallel systems (usually 3:1s or 4:1s on raises)) and running the system (controlling the lower, resetting on the haul, etc.). Add bodies for muscle on raises as approp. 1 person in charge.

    Things get complicated when we're dealing with multiple lowering or raising stations, complex anchor or over-the-side situations, etc. I have found having someone acting as scribe top side is very helpful in many situations.

    Totally OK to have rescuers waiting quietly out of the way until needed for a task. The bodies are great when looking at a couple of miles of wheelout via litter. 10, 12, 15 people are great to manage patient care, rotate on/off the litter and belay/haul lines, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnRsq View Post
    Ideal # of bodies varies a lot from my perspective. For my world the amount of gear (ropes, litters, etc.) combined with distance, terrain/difficulty of access/evac, and weather are big factors. More people to haul gear long distances = usually a good thing.

    A litter-based rescue in an other than vertical environment is likely going to have 2 rescuers over the side w/the patient and litter (1 if vertical or a pick-off of a non-litter victim). 2 people rigging the anchors (they are muscle for the raise) + 2 doing system set-up (1 person per line - we use parallel systems (usually 3:1s or 4:1s on raises)) and running the system (controlling the lower, resetting on the haul, etc.). Add bodies for muscle on raises as approp. 1 person in charge.........
    Ok, much different in my situation. #1 = no mountains. The levee on the river is 50 ft elevation above sea level. 99.99% of what we do is in an industrial setting. Easy access, thousands of good solid anchor points, almost never a need for litter tenders or sending someone over the side to do a pick off. Triple wrap a prusik on their lanyard, haul a couple inches to release their snap hook then lower them to safety. We deal a lot with confined spaces and rescues from elevated areas but some of these areas have elevators for access. We can get by with less trained people and use the willing bystanders for muscle, tag line ground personnel, etc. A 2 or 3-person rescue team per shift is the norm, not the exception unfortunately.

    Mike

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    MPD and IDs up and down. Simple 5 or drop a grab at the anchor for a complex 7 if needed. We rarely need more than that. While trying to keep to the (MA)(# of haulers) not exceed 18 "rule"

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    Forum Member MichaelXYZ's Avatar
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    Never used anything above 5:1, too many resets, and too much stress on the gear.

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    I agree with bottrigg. I spend a lot of time in industry and with small crews as well. Use simple and efficient modern systems based off IDs or MPDs. I like our gear to be setup as light and fast as possible.

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