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Thread: Another pay for spray debacle

  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by rm1524 View Post
    I would guess that is the way just about every fire department started. Someone or several someone's saw a need for fire protection, started with pretty much nothing and built themselves up to where they are today.
    I agree, but it's much more complicated today with regulations covering just about every single aspect of a fire departments operations.

    I think the toughest thing today is that in the past, much of the population would contribute to or at least support the department through taxes, without much complaint for the good of the community as a whole. You honestly see very little of that today, and that IMO, is the biggest challenge of any start up fire department or district.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  2. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I agree, but it's much more complicated today with regulations covering just about every single aspect of a fire departments operations.

    Are you kidding me with this statement by you? Heck man your combination FD violates FEDERAL LAW every single time you force, and you do force them, your paid guys to volunteer back without pay. Your blatant disregard for training standards set by the NFPA and other agencies makes your entire statement about as hypocritical as you have ever been.

    I think the toughest thing today is that in the past, much of the population would contribute to or at least support the department through taxes, without much complaint for the good of the community as a whole. You honestly see very little of that today, and that IMO, is the biggest challenge of any start up fire department or district.

    Frankly, anyone stupid enough not to explore the fire protection, ems delivery, and police protection of where they intend to live before moving there gets no sympathy from me. I am so tired of hearing the citizens won't pay the taxes for a fire department. BS. If it is part of the tax bill they will pay it. Fire protection is one of the primary public services that need to be provided. Time for the fire service to stop being both a chump and the barely thought of red headed step child. Further if the community as you say won't support or fund the FD, SHUT IT DOWN! I have no responsibility to serve a citizenry that cares so little about the fire department, and me as a firefighter, that they expect me to protect them with inadequate training, equipment and funding. You can call me a mercenary, or any other name you wish, but the truth is the cops don't fundraise for guns, bullets and squad cars, the DPW doesn't fund raise for trucks and equipment, so why should we suffer along doing it and having old junk for equipment? Sorry everything other than funding fire protection is a feeble excuse.
    Just more of the same old tired rhetoric from you LA.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
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  3. #128
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    Are you kidding me with this statement by you? Heck man your combination FD violates FEDERAL LAW every single time you force, and you do force them, your paid guys to volunteer back without pay. Your blatant disregard for training standards set by the NFPA and other agencies makes your entire statement about as hypocritical as you have ever been.

    My statement had nothing to do with my FD.

    Was simply referring to the fact that in the past a new department could pick up a used engine, some used SCBA and some used gear without worry6ing about compliance, and the donating department didn't have to worry about liability and being sued down the line if the donated equipment failed. members didn't have to have FFI in some states. Insurance requirements were not as tight and insurance was not so ungodly expensive.

    The fact is that that all this regulation and standards have made starting an FD difficult.

    And once again, LA has no minimum training standards so not requiring FFI for our members is not in voliation of any requirement.



    Frankly, anyone stupid enough not to explore the fire protection, ems delivery, and police protection of where they intend to live before moving there gets no sympathy from me. I am so tired of hearing the citizens won't pay the taxes for a fire department. BS. If it is part of the tax bill they will pay it.

    The trick is these folks probably live where they live so they can avoid paying very much in taxes. There are folks that move out into the rural areas and continue to live in a rural area because the taxes are low, and that is exactly what they want. many to most of them are fully aware of the limited services but have no issues in rolling the dice that they will never need fire. LE or EMS.

    And I agree .... If the time comes that they need these services they get what they pay for and have no right to complain.


    Fire protection is one of the primary public services that need to be provided.

    If the community decides as such. In the end, they are the ones that make the choice. If they vote it down, that is the communities' choice.

    Time for the fire service to stop being both a chump and the barely thought of red headed step child. Further if the community as you say won't support or fund the FD, SHUT IT DOWN! I have no responsibility to serve a citizenry that cares so little about the fire department, and me as a firefighter, that they expect me to protect them with inadequate training, equipment and funding. You can call me a mercenary, or any other name you wish, but the truth is the cops don't fundraise for guns, bullets and squad cars, the DPW doesn't fund raise for trucks and equipment, so why should we suffer along doing it and having old junk for equipment? Sorry everything other than funding fire protection is a feeble excuse.

    Agree.

    We provide the level of service they pay for.

    I would likely not leave if the funding to my VFD was reduced but I would tell the Chief my the amount of risk that I take will reflect what support the community is willing to provide.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

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    If that community wanted to get a volunteer fire department going, they would probably start out, with a pumper. I doubt there are any hydrants for a fire protection water supply, so a minimum of a 1,000 gallon water tank would be needed.

    Even if this newly organized volunteer fire department cannot make interior entry to structures, they still can do some good by: 1) Extinguishing small fires (initial attack) before they become bigger. 2) Attempt to keep a freeburning structure fire in check, until another FD arrives. 3) Protect exposures, such as adjoining structures and vegetation, from becoming involved. 4) Protect any trapped occupants in a vehicle crash from a fire, until an extrication team arrives, etc..

    If they can keep the FD going and keep honing their training, they can later add a water truck and other apparatus.

    Its their community. Its up to themselves to help themselves.

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