Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By RFDACM02

Thread: Tires on or off the ground

  1. #1
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    5

    Default Tires on or off the ground

    What do the experts say as to rear tires on touching the ground while the aerial is operating...what do the MFG's say????

  2. #2
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    Swanton Fire Dept. Swanton, Vermont
    Posts
    476

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fire325 View Post
    What do the experts say as to rear tires on touching the ground while the aerial is operating...what do the MFG's say????
    There will not be a single answer to this except to Read the manual specific to the truck in question.

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northeast Coast
    Posts
    3,862

    Default

    We take the bulge out of the tires. Of course we rarely set up on perfectly level ground, so the lowest tire gets the bulge taken out and the rest are up, when the operator is on the ball. When time is of the essence, firefighters are taught to "get the lights".

  4. #4
    Forum Member
    FWDbuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Pee-Ayy!
    Posts
    7,401

    Default

    I was always taught to take the tires off the ground, which ensures that all weight is off the frame and guarantees the torque box is rigid. This is what I have always done and have done so with "green lights" all the time every time. However I agree with ChiefDog- Do what the Mfr tells you to do!!!!
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  5. #5
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    TN
    Posts
    100

    Default

    We just received a new Pierce a couple weeks ago. The Pierce instructor that came down from Wisconsin said to just take the bulge out of the tires.

  6. #6
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Bryn Athyn, Pa.
    Posts
    1,619

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tbzep View Post
    We just received a new Pierce a couple weeks ago. The Pierce instructor that came down from Wisconsin said to just take the bulge out of the tires.
    Then that's what you do. Mack, on the other hand, wanted the tires completely off the ground on Aerialscopes. Don't know what Seagrave has to say about it.

  7. #7
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    252

    Arrow

    Quote Originally Posted by chiefengineer11 View Post
    Then that's what you do. Mack, on the other hand, wanted the tires completely off the ground on Aerialscopes. Don't know what Seagrave has to say about it.
    We operate our Mack Aerialscope with the tires off the ground most of the time, depending on the terrain, but the newer Seagrave scopes may need to keep the wheels on the ground since they have a tork box type ground ladder storage tube.

  8. #8
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    TN
    Posts
    100

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by chiefengineer11 View Post
    Then that's what you do. Mack, on the other hand, wanted the tires completely off the ground on Aerialscopes. Don't know what Seagrave has to say about it.
    That's why I indicated what we received.

  9. #9
    Forum Member
    FWDbuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Pee-Ayy!
    Posts
    7,401

    Default

    When I went to aerial school at MFRI, the instructor indicated on older scopes (especially single axle ones) "you just slam the jack and outrigger controls down and hold them until they all stop. Period."
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  10. #10
    Forum Member
    JayDudley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    1,272

    Default

    I'm with FWDbuff on this.....I was the Engineer on both the Mack Aerial Scope and Seagrave 100' Tillered Aerial and the manufacture stated to slam the outriggers to max and put safetys on.
    Respectfully,
    Jay Dudley
    Retired Fire
    Background Investigator
    IACOJ-Member
    Lifetime Member CSFA
    IAFF Alumni Member

  11. #11
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northeast Coast
    Posts
    3,862

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Woodbridge View Post
    We operate our Mack Aerialscope with the tires off the ground most of the time, depending on the terrain, but the newer Seagrave scopes may need to keep the wheels on the ground since they have a tork box type ground ladder storage tube.
    I'm not sure there would ever be a "need" to have the wheels touching, as this would not be possible in many places due to terrain, curbs, obstacles etc. You have to pick a low side then at least level up from there. I've heard the KME auto-level takes the truck to the highest point then levels down? For what it's worth my understanding is that any point of contact is more "traction" in case of slippage in icy conditions and less drop distance allowed if a total failure could/would occur. Taking the bulge out shows the operator beyond the electronic sensor mechanism, that the apparatus has shifted it's weight to the outriggers where it belongs.

  12. #12
    Let's talk fire trucks!
    BoxAlarm187's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    3,311

    Default

    We run all Pierce tower ladders at work, and we've been instructed to take the bulge out of the tires.

    A neighboring department run several 'Scopes, and they did what's been discussed above - slam the outriggers till they stop.
    Career Fire Captain
    Volunteer Chief Officer


    Never taking for granted that I'm privileged enough to have the greatest job in the world!

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    SCOOBY14B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    360

    Default

    I think it's going to depend on the manufacturer, which is where you need to get the correct procedure instead of an internet forum.

    Sutphen procedure is this: Extend and lower midship outriggers until the front tires are raised 1" off the ground. Extend the rear down riggers until the front tires are back in contact with the ground. Extend front axle/ cab jacks fully...operate 100%.

  14. #14
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northeast Coast
    Posts
    3,862

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SCOOBY14B View Post
    I think it's going to depend on the manufacturer, which is where you need to get the correct procedure instead of an internet forum.

    Sutphen procedure is this: Extend and lower midship outriggers until the front tires are raised 1" off the ground. Extend the rear down riggers until the front tires are back in contact with the ground. Extend front axle/ cab jacks fully...operate 100%.
    That's a great procedure for level ground, but how would an operator follow that when on an incline? Any of these procedures can be "best practices" for a perfect condition, but should have some indication as to the purpose or how one deals with the other 95% of the world that isn't flat.

  15. #15
    Forum Member
    SCOOBY14B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    360

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    That's a great procedure for level ground, but how would an operator follow that when on an incline? Any of these procedures can be "best practices" for a perfect condition, but should have some indication as to the purpose or how one deals with the other 95% of the world that isn't flat.
    Again, consult the manufacturer.

    Sutphen: Front to rear of 10 degrees...the process is the same.

    Side to side: Extend both midship outriggers. Lower outrigger on low side until it contacts the ground. Loweer high side until it contacts the ground. Raise both outriggers until low side is maxed out. Lower rear down riggers until front tires are in contact with ground (depending on angle, only high side may be touching. Extend cab/ front jacks until maxed out. Use inclinometer as indicated.

  16. #16
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    252

    Question E-one

    I have seen a 95' MM E-One platform set up with the front bumper almost 4 feet off the ground and the tires were 1.5' off the pavement, is that the normal for a E-one apparatus ? This took place at a trade show in Wildwood , New Jersey two years ago!

  17. #17
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northeast Coast
    Posts
    3,862

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SCOOBY14B View Post
    Again, consult the manufacturer.

    Sutphen: Front to rear of 10 degrees...the process is the same.

    Side to side: Extend both midship outriggers. Lower outrigger on low side until it contacts the ground. Loweer high side until it contacts the ground. Raise both outriggers until low side is maxed out. Lower rear down riggers until front tires are in contact with ground (depending on angle, only high side may be touching. Extend cab/ front jacks until maxed out. Use inclinometer as indicated.
    This to me reads much more logically, the "rule" of 1" wouldn't make sense or apply in far too many situations to be a good way to instructing operators, at least to my way of thinking.
    Skysthelimit likes this.

  18. #18
    Forum Member
    FFWALT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    357

    Default

    Woodbridge,

    I would venture a guess this was done to demonstrate the angle this apparatus could operate on. By being able to lift the apparatus that far up on level ground, it would show that the additional extension allows the apparatus to be leveled on terrain that its competitors may not be able to achieve level.

    Just my guess,
    Walt
    Train like you want to fight.
    www.kvfd.net

  19. #19
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    78

    Default

    I know I know, Chief I agree as many have stated here Consult the Manufacture, and if you can get it in writing this will eliminate all of the speculation.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. How to wear out new tires
    By snowball in forum The Off Duty Forums
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 12-30-2008, 07:03 PM
  2. GSA Tires
    By AFDFrank in forum Probie House: The Place for Newbies
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 06-24-2007, 08:01 PM
  3. Tires
    By westofd1 in forum Emergency Vehicle Operations
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 01-29-2007, 08:35 AM
  4. APPRATUS TIRES
    By WRENCH in forum Apparatus Innovation
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-30-2000, 03:27 PM
  5. How Do You Deflate Tires?
    By rmoore in forum University of Extrication
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 03-30-1999, 11:10 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register