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Thread: Preconnects...

  1. #1
    MB1213635
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post Preconnects...

    I'm just curious as to where your department runs its preconnected lines on the engine companies; crosslays or off the rear. Also, which do you prefer and why. I'll start.

    My department runs with all of our lines coming off the back of the wagon. I prefer to have my lines coming off the back because they will not block any of the pump panel, thus making the chauffeur's job a little easier. Also, it is a little bit easier to pack lines in the hosebed rather than a crosslay. Finally, you can generally pack more hose in the section of bed for an attack line than you can a crosslay.


  2. #2
    Jake295885
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    MB, How come no mention of lines off the front of the wagon? I think the busiest engine, and arguably the best has a 150' & a 100' attack line off the front of all 5 of their hose wagons.

    I too like them off the back as opposed to the crosslays, but the front kicks A%$ too.

  3. #3
    MB1213635
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Sorry Jake forgot to mention that. I do like having a line off the front bumper. Unfortunately the current pumper has no front bumper attack line...just a soft sleeve suction.

  4. #4
    ac52
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We run three 1 3/4" (2 - 200' & 1 300') and two 2 1/2" (both 250') in our crosslays with a 100' 1 1/2" trashline in the front bumper and a 3" bombline on the rear bumper. It can be a little hectic if numerous lines ar pulled.

    I always liked the 2 1/2" coming off the rear of the truck. It gives you more room to pull it out and doesn't cludder up the pump area. The trashline location is perfect. Easy to pull on tight streets and on a highway the apparatus can provide crew protection.

    The idea of placing preconnects on the front bumper is not common in my area, but, I have seen them at shows and publications. It does seem to have some advantages ( ease of pulling and packing, out of pump operator area, etc.) My Dept. will be specing a new piece in the near future and we have already agreed to rethink our preconnect situation. We'll research all the ideas, I'm sure!

  5. #5
    Firelover
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Exclamation

    We have 1 3/4" lines coming off the crosslays. I think this is great because if you park on the side of the road, you can take your line of the truck and go to the fire in no time. (this is all on the Engine and ladder truck) On our tanker/pumper, we have it set up to come off the back of the bed.

    ------------------
    Joel

    If you sent us to HELL, WE'D PUT IT OUT!!

  6. #6
    bfdzeke
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We have specified your "normal" crosslays on all of our trucks, and we really have not had any problems as of yet (Murphy's Law will take effect right after I post this). We are currently bidding out for two pumpers, and we are shooting for the low shelf crosslays, which are under the top mount pump panel so you don't have to climb eleven feet off the ground to reload them, so that is an interesting twist. We are getting away from the bumper mount preconnect due to budgetary reasons, basically too much money to run the piping (approx. $1500 on the low end). That was against my better judgement, safety wise, but hey, what can you do.Anyway, it's just my opinion. Be safe and enjoy.

    ------------------
    Oh pretty good...

  7. #7
    fire127797
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We have two 1 3/4" crosslays 200' and one crosslayed 1 1/2 trashline 100'. They don't interfere with the pump operator becuase we utilize a top mount pump panel with a fully enclosed cab.

  8. #8
    lumpy649
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Wink

    Our older E-one pieces carry the following compliments of preconnect attack lines:

    100' 1-3/4" TFT on front bumper
    2 200' 1-3/4" TFT crosslays
    200' 2-1/2" smooth bore blitz line from rear
    200' 3" leader line with gated wye from rear

    Our new (not yet in service) Pierces carry the identical lines, with the exception of one of the crosslays that will utilize a smooth bore nozzle. Another department here on the east end does utilize rear attack lines, and I do have to admit I like them immensely, for several reasons...

    1. Interstate vehicle fires: firefighters can stretch line without pulling a normal crosslay out into traffic. It keeps them on the shoulder or in the affected lanes. It's much safer that way.

    2. On our narrow residential streets, the driver is forced to pull past the house for a decent stretch, thereby allowing the incoming truck or tower plenty of operating room where they need it most... RIGHT IN FRONT!

    3. The driver has only one place to look to see which lines have been pulled.

    I have mentioned this to personnel on our spec committees, but the idea wasn't taken too seriously. Oh well, maybe next time...

  9. #9
    firecat1524
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We have all of the above, crosslays, rear loaded and front bumper hose trays, and they all have their place. In the area we cover we have a lot of narrow driveways, so at times if we went with strictly rear preconnects we would lose 30 ft of hose just to clear the truck. The crosslays are our primary lines, the front bumper line is a short, 150' line mainly used for car fires, etc, and the rear preconnect has a 4' long piercing nozzle on it. There is a spare fog nozzle in the engineer's compartment for the rear line, but we rarely use it. In fact, most of the time we may only use a couple sections of hose off of it to extend other lines.Your comment about the crosslays getting in the way of the engineer are somewhat true, but if you stress to the troops that if at all possible they need to pull from the opposite side, this problem is eliminated. This is one of those thousands of things in the fire service that falls under the "What works for you probably wouldn't work for me" catagory, and there really isn't a right or wrong answer.

  10. #10
    MPreb362
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    the crosslays never seem to bother me much. much of the newer eng./quints/ext. are pretty well color coded. if your at or near the pump panel, as any engineer should be during a job, in case of an emergency you can see the lines your working with instead of running around to look at the lines your guys are using. when you need to shut down the blue or red nozzle, you know which one it is. the most important thing is to know your equipment (what lines come from where) and know your discharges. if your guys know that, then i would say it's just a matter of preference and how your eng. is configured to work best for your needs. see ya and stay safe.

  11. #11
    RescueCoFireman
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We have our hose feed from the back. Some pumpers have a trash line in the front. The reason for this is that we do reverse lays from the fire to the hydrant. Often the Chauffer is the only one hooking up to the plug. The engine pulls past the fire building anyway to allow room for the truck companies. It's easier to have the hose feed off the back. Though they aren't preconnected.

    GB

  12. #12
    benson911
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Attack lines come off the rear.

    1. Out of pump operator's way.
    2. Allow engine to drive past the building to see 3 sides and open front for ladder.
    3. Easier to load and unload.
    4. Allows for easier adding of more hose to extend a line, there's a big load of it next to the preconnect.

  13. #13
    RADFIRE
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We pull off the rear, but have both crosslay beds packed in case a situation occurs. The front bumper has trash lines.
    We have 150' of 1 3/4" preattached to gated wye on 3". One port is open to the 1 3/4", but the other is there in case a second line is needed. The "skid load" is shoulder carried to a approximate distance to allow for spreading out and taken to the fire area. Preconnects are rarely used....only if it's a guaranteed short stretch, a small area and we're close enough to back stretch to a hydrant if need be.
    Everything is on the discretion of the Captain-in-Charge.

  14. #14
    Inferno
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Talking

    Don't forget about the blitz line (pre-connect or not!) I would prefer a 200 ft. triple lay of 2 Ĺ. pre-connected in the rear hose bed. Everyone should have a blitz line for when your normal 150 g.p.m. attack line isn't going to cut it. Just remember, its not a blitz line unless it has a smooth bore at the end!!!

    ------------------
    When In Doubt, Blitz it Out!

  15. #15
    SBrooks
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    from the truckies perspective...the guys with crosslays just LOVE to park their little red wagons right infront of the sidewalk to the building (garden apartments mostly) usually right where I want to park my big red fire truck. The guys with front/rear lines stop short or pull past, just fine with me.

    from the engine troll's perspective...bumper lays, great i can reach them. New crosslays, great i can reach them. Old crosslays, damn, gotta stretch. 500 gwt rear lines, great, i can reach them. 750+ gwt rear lines, damn, better get a step ladder.

  16. #16
    BIG PAULIE
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Besides the standard 1-3/4" attack lines we have a 200' x 2-1/2" blitz line in a handline configuration. It has a 1-1/4" tip , a 2-1/2" nozzle valve with a 2" waterway and a short stream shaper.
    At 50 NP =325 gpm
    at 80 NP = 400 gpm
    at 115 NP = 500 gpm
    We have had some real good initial knockdowns both on tank water and with a hydrant.

  17. #17
    RADFIRE
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We pull off the rear specifically to allow for maximum work area for the truck. A benefit is that a 5" front intake just about guarantees enough water for handline usage of the initial line(s) for attack.
    I've asked the question of why we don't use smooth-bore nozzles for initial attack. The answer I got was that 1st) It's not my concern, because I'm too young and new, 2nd) We need to air the room out right after a knock down, and 3rd) Some guys like to attack with fog and others like a straight stream.
    I'm not new to this, though I am newer than the senior man who said that. Even so...an opinion of anyone may help the outfit.
    You can air the area out with a smooth-bore with a simple screw on fog tip. The nozzleman can carry that can't he?
    Why would you like to attack with a fog? I don't like to be lobsterized. That's why I do straight.
    Of all the benefits, the fact that operating pressure, therefore the reaction force is cut in half. The job gets done with less punishment taken by the engine guys.
    It's just my opinion. It just seems to make sense.

  18. #18
    Poin
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Our engine has the following handline configuration:

    Front Bumper: 1 200' 1" trash line
    1 150' 1" line w/ ProPak
    Crosslays: 6 total, 3 off each side,
    4 1 3/4", 3 150', 1 200'
    1 2", 200'
    1 1 1/2", 150' w/ foam inductor
    Rear: Warehouse Load, 200' 2 1/2" w/ gated wye and 1 150' 1 3/4" connected
    300' 1 3/4" to attach to gated wye if needed
    1 350' 1 3/4" handline "Barney Line"
    (it has a purple stripe in the hose)

    1 250' 2 1/2" preconnect


    [This message has been edited by Poin (edited 01-17-2001).]

  19. #19
    Joaquin Homen FFPM HMR-9
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We have the following on our engine...
    1 150 ' 1" trash/grass fire preconnect front bumper.

    2- 1 3/4 " (1) 150 ' (1) 200 ' perconnect crosslay
    1- 1 3/4 " 200' hotel pack non-preconnect crosslay
    1- 1 1" 150'forestry line preconnect

    Rear
    1- 2 1/2 200' preconnect
    1- 3/4 150' Preconnect hose reel in the rear compartment

    Top side rear LDH 5' 800' , 800' 2/1/2 Supply Lines.

    Engines are Pierce Arrows, Lance and Dash...Had a Javelin it was a bust good thing we only purcahsed one it is in reserve.
    Godspeed and Keep the Faith, jack

  20. #20
    Joaquin Homen FFPM HMR-9
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    We have the following on our engine...
    1 150 ' 1" trash/grass fire preconnect front bumper.

    2- 1 3/4 " (1) 150 ' (1) 200 ' perconnect crosslay
    1- 1 3/4 " 200' hotel pack non-preconnect crosslay
    1- 1 1" 150'forestry line preconnect

    Rear
    1- 2 1/2 200' preconnect
    1- 3/4 150' Preconnect hose reel in the rear compartment

    Top side rear LDH 5' 800' , 800' 2/1/2 Supply Lines.

    Engines are Pierce Arrows, Lance and Dash...Had a Javelin it was a bust good thing we only purcahsed one it is in reserve.
    Godspeed and Keep the Faith, jack

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