Thread: Houston LODDs, Bush and the Flag
03-06-2001, 09:31 PM #1mongofire_99Firehouse.com Guest
Houston LODDs, Bush and the Flag
I wonder if we can settle this once and for all. Every time Bush and the fire service are mentioned (which is a lot lately) somebody comes up with a snappy comeback line like "THE HOUSTON FIRE DEPARTMENT REQUESTED THAT THE AMERICAN FLAG BE FLOWN AT HALF STAFF IN HONOR OF THE FALLEN FIREFIGHTERS. HE REFUSED TO DO SO. BUT WHEN TOM LANDRY THE FORMER COACH OF THE COWBOYS DIED, BUSH ALLOWED THE FLAG TO BE FLOWN AT HALF STAFF." (thanks for the quote REBCHIEF)
Well guess what ladies and gentlemen, you've been spun into the ground if you bought this. Here are the facts:
US flag code that does not allow for lowering of the flag in this instance:
UNITED STATES CODE TITLE 36 - PATRIOTIC SOCIETIES AND OBSERVANCES CHAPTER 10 - PATRIOTIC CUSTOMS
The flag shall be flown at half-staff thirty days from the death of the President or a former President; ten days from the death of the Vice President, the Chief Justice or a retired Chief Justice of the United States, or the Speaker of the House of Representatives; from the day of death until internment of an Associate Justice of the Supreme Court, a Secretary of an executive or military department, a former Vice President, or the Governor of a State, territory, or possession; and on the day of death and the following day for a Member of Congress. The flag shall be flown at half-staff on Peace Officers Memorial Day, unless that day is also Armed Forces Day.
Gov. Rick Perry, then Lt. Governor, was acting governor and ordered the flags lowered for Landry, not governer Bush. Perry was acting as governor as Bush was out of state.
If you have any questions regarding this, the Texas Governors Office should be happy to answer them, just give them a call at 1-800-843-5789.
And as I said previously, I do believe the flags should be half-staffed for LODDs.
03-07-2001, 12:19 AM #2johnusn971Firehouse.com Guest
If you go by exact Federal Flag codes, then the lowering of the flag for the Challenger shuttle, or the dead on the Cole was illegal and wrong. The President of the United States can order a flag half masted. A governor can order the United States flag flown from State buildings only for deceased members of that state. Just like the NY governor has NYC flags half masted at Police precincts or firehouses when NYPD or FDNY members are LODD.
03-07-2001, 01:05 AM #3CatchFirehouse.com Guest
I must once again applaud you mongo. I was looking for information on this particular ordeal. Apparently I didn't find the look in the right places. Nice to see someone who comes informed to the forums.
03-07-2001, 03:39 AM #4mongofire_99Firehouse.com Guest
If you go by exact Federal Flag codes, then the lowering of the flag for the Challenger shuttle, or the dead on the Cole was illegal and wrong. The President of the United States can order a flag half masted.
If the President can order the flag half-masted, then why is it illegal and wrong for the Challenger and the Cole?
And why didn't he order it for all LODDs during his term? If anyone from the DCFD is reading thts, did clinton order it for your LODDs?
A governor can order the United States flag flown from State buildings only for deceased members of that state.
The code does not allow 'for members of the state.' It clearly states the governor may lower the flag In the event of the death of a present or former official of the government of any State, territory, or possession of the United States...
Just like the NY governor has NYC flags half masted at Police precincts or firehouses when NYPD or FDNY members are LODD.
I can find no provision in Texas law that allows the governor to lower the US flag (state flag yes). As unfortunate as it is, it seems firefighters do not fall into the US Code definition of 'a present or former official of the government of any State.'
03-07-2001, 04:38 PM #5Neptune 33Firehouse.com Guest
If a Firefighter in our area or surrounding area would dies, I know for a fact that our flag would be lowered. It's our flag, we elect to put it up, so if we want it flown at half staff for a firefighter who died serving his community, trying to preserve lives and property, it's coming down and that's that.
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