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  1. #26
    ADSN/WFLD
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    While not on the front bumper one of our rigs carry 100' 1 1/2" flat loaded in a well on our side step. I can't see why it wouldn't work just as well on the front bumper. I have to agree with oz10engine if it's just for rubbish fires who cares how it's packed.

    I've got a question for LHS, just what department are you an active member of? You just showed us a department from CO. to me it seems a little bit of a long commute to NV. Just curious.

  2. #27
    Eng522ine
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    NozzleHog... Sorry if I came across as having an attitude, it was not intended. No ruffled feathers here. LOL... takes a LOT more than anything that could be said in one of these forums to get me going.

    Also, as far as the higher flow rate of the inch and a half goes, we have most of our vehicle fires on or near the interstate that passes through town and we're stuck using tank water only on them. Not for nuttin but 500 gallons goes a lot further through a booster.

    As far as my reference to kinks and flaking out hose goes, I was again referring to our usual "side of the highway" car fire. The state troopers here generally don't buy into the whole "safety lane" concept. We've actually had troopers threaten to lock up drivers for stopping too far from the fire(50-75' before) and also for trying to take a safety lane.

    Dr inferno... I didn't say that the old timers had EVERYTHING right... I was referring to booster lines. I have personally used booster lines on many vehicle fires and have found them plenty capable of doing the job safely. I have only come across 2 vehicle fires that required more than a booster line (one was multiple cars in a parking lot, the other was an 18 wheeler with the cab fully involved). As I said in my original post "Just like anything else you have to know when it's appropriate to use and when it's not." In other words, "little fire... little water... big fire ... big water." I'd never tell an experienced firefighter NOT to use what he was comfortable using. I personally am comfortable using a booster line on ALMOST every vehicle fire and I have done so safely and effectively as recent as yesterday. Just my opinion though.

  3. #28
    LHS*
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    Post

    //You just showed us a department from CO. to me it seems a little bit of a long commute to NV.

    Gee lots of towns have me help them with their apparatus. I just hop on a plane. The Colorado FD and a Texas FD gave me complete control of thier fleets so I didn't need to go there. I designed the rattlesnake rigs bumper for 5' tall firefighters working in heavy snow.

    Some of the folks on line here I've helped recently include: Buck fd 13 rigs, SFDD 13 rigs, SCooks FD 11 rigs, Station2 rigs (Stafford 2 and Houston 85), BFD 8 rigs, LVFD3 4 rigs, bigpauley 22 rigs, rattlesnake 3, fallon 4, berthod 8, AVFD 9, AMCO 21, some towns in NJ 6 rigs, NC, FL, CO, NV, CA not over 60 right now.

    No biggie really, lots of folks let you help them with their rigs if you help them get the money to buy whatever they want.

    //what department are you an active member of?

    Gee I try not to be an active member of any one department, I think 12 or 13 departments are paying me right now though. I think that is more fun than belonging to just one FD.

  4. #29
    ADSN/WFLD
    Firehouse.com Guest

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    So if you aren't an active firefighter anywhere, how do you get to try out and evaluate new tactics and products? Do the departments you consult for let you ride along and give you the nob?

    What a bunch of great guys.

    I know by me we wouldn't let a rider take the nob from us.

    I've found that what works well on paper or at a drill doesn't always work as well under the stress and conditions found on at a real incident.

    Flash, try whatever load you want at drills then if you can, put it on the rig for a trial period. Let several people in on the evaluation process and see what works for you and your department.

  5. #30
    ONTFF
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    dont have a front bumper line, just angle in so we can pull a crosslay (need 1.75" for MVA's now anyway), also gives you some protection on the road, what would be nice is a front mounted booster line like phoenix has on their engines, any phoenix ff's offer thier opinion on front booster line?

  6. #31
    Jay Sonnenfeld
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    Post

    I think everybody has their own valid points on this subject and whatever works best for each company don't change. I just want to ask one question.I was always under the impression that any hose under 1 1/2 is considered a booster line or trash line. (1" vinyl or 3/4 rubber ) used mainly for trash or brush and yes in days of old MVA washdowns.My question is just because its mounted on the front bumper why is it called a trash line especially if you carry 1 1/2 or 1 3/4 at lengths of 100' or 150'. This same line can be used for interior operations? I'm not being sarcastic I just want other opinions and answers because I teach class on this and I've ask this question before and didn't really get a answer. I would greatly appreciate any help. Thanks and be safe

  7. #32
    ADSN/WFLD
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Our "trash line", in Addison, is a total of 150' 1 3/4" in two 75' sections. The reason it has a different designation is that it is a heavy duty nitrile jacketed hose, like LDH.

    We could use it for structure fires but chose to just use it for autos, dumpsters, etc. The advantage is that it can be rinsed off at the scene and repacked wet. It is only taken off while it is being tested. At that time we usually give it a good washing also.

    Hope that helped

  8. #33
    RescueCoFireman
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    Post

    I agree with Jay Sonnefield's response and question as to what you consider a "trash-line" You fellas mention having 100', 150' of 1-3/4" line. Why so much? I mentioned earlier if anyone has a booster reel on their pumpers. But if not, pulling 50' of hose is more than enough. Let me ask how far away do you park the pumper from a car or dumpster fire? We pull, well pretty much within 50' of it. As ENGINE522 agreed with me, 500gal will last a while when your using a booster reel. You don't need to hook into a hydrant. Besides, in my area there are no hydrants on the highways so we have no choice but to draw from the booster tank. If we drain the booster tank we call another pumper. For these types of fires we don't get well involved as to hooking in a feeder to a hydrant. If you can't put out a dumpster fire or a car fire with 500gal of water you need to better manage the use of your water supply. Now if there was a compactor fire or a car fire in a parking garage. Then different steps are taken. But for basic outside rubbish/dumpster fires and car fires a simple booster line will work fine.

    Not that I am against any of your tactics guys but it seems from some of you overkill. Example: "Drop a 4" feeder and lay in from the hydrant, pull 150' of 1-3/4" line and flake it out. Pull another 150' feet of 1-3/4" line as a back up". It seems more of the work is not putting the fire out but taking up, breaking down and repacking the hose. On a busy highway I wouldn't want to do that whether the PD is there or not to control traffic.

  9. #34
    ADSN/WFLD
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    To some extent I would have to agree with your overkill statement but, I think it is much better to assume that something could go wrong at that car or dumpster fire and park accordingly. I feel that 50' is to close if something does go wrong. ie Bad stuff burning in the dumpster, fuel tank failing in a car.
    A few times a year we have a dumpster fairy that keeps us quite bust and during that time you will often see a roll of 1 3/4" with a nozzle so we don't have to pull the trash line. This is the exception and not the rule.

  10. #35
    dr inferno
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    You may call it overkill I call it Firefighter safety. The reason for all these lines are to protect the firefighters as a car fire is usually a "write-off" anyway. As well it does take longer to pack up and get back in service but that is still a lot less time then it takes for burns or other injuries to heal. Not pulling the lines for safety purposes, I think is laziness and that is a word and trait that I DON'T associate with the fire service!

  11. #36
    RescueCoFireman
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    Dr. Inferno,

    My tactics have nothing to do with laziness or lack of firefighter safety. I do take safety precautions at all incidents. But I guess for an incident such as a car fire or trash fire I don't see putting in a whole lot of effort into it. As far as having a back up line, instead of pulling off another pre-connect, why not wait unitl you need it if necessary then pull it? Even you stated that the car on fire is a loss anyway. And nothing will be salvaged from a dumpster. Being within 50' isn't bad...consider the reach of the water stream.

    The trashline concept is a good idea. I guess I am just an advocate for having a booster hose reel instead. The concept of having trashline or a quick attack line for small fires is nothing new. It is just a spin off of what the the booster reel was there for.

  12. #37
    Eng522ine
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Thumbs up

    dr inferno... I agree 100% with your motivation. But lets remember, using an elephant gun on a mouse is not inherently safe, in other words by using an inch and a half line on a car fire doesn't guarantee safety. I mean c'mon now, IF the fuel tank does blow, are you safer holding an inch and a half line?? I think not. Hey, if we want to sanitize firefighting why don't we do deck gun knock downs on car fires? Totally unrealistic but, hey, I guarantee you nobody will get hurt doing it!

    The long and short of it is simply that we all do dangerous work and there's very few times while on any scene that we're very safe. It's my opinion that any measure of safety that using an inch an a half may give you, on a car fire, is greatly out weighed by the reduced amount of time that you're on the scene when using a booster line. Whether it's on a town street or an interstate highway, the cars driving past you are the greatest danger at a car fire. The less time that you're exposed to that danger, the safer you are. A booster line, operated at appropriate pressure, will give you plenty of water to knock the car fire down and extinguish it and the fact that all you have to do is rewind the reel and clear the scene is where you become safer using a booster line. You're not out on the side of the highway rolling hose waiting for some nutcase to tag you with his car because he's trying to get through the traffic faster.

    Long Live Red Rubber Hose!!

    Be safe.

  13. #38
    oz10engine
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    Post

    This is a reply to Jay Sonnenfeld's question. At the place I work at we have a line on the front bumper which we call the trash line. It's 2 - 50' sections of worn 1-1/2" hose that may have a pinhole here and there or the outer jacket was torn, and that isn't suitable for interior ops. We painted the couplings to tell them apart from the other 1-1/2". All we use it for is outside stuff like autos,trash,etc. A place that I vollie at from time to time has 2 lines on their front bumper 150' 1-1/2" each, they use these for their main interior attack lines and it works good. They are referred to as the bumper line or the 150 (they have no other 150' line on the piece).On another subject the only reason for using 1-1/2 instead of booster line on trash and stuff is more water. Instead of using a booster line on a deep seated trash fire and screwing around for 20 minutes, pull the trash line and flood it, you'll be out of there sooner. I also have used my preconnected deck gun (deluge gun,wagon pipe) on dumpsters numerous times. Just pull up to it, fill it up and leave.

  14. #39
    148champ
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    Our newest engine came complete with a booster line mounted in the rear compartment behind a nifty roll-upo door - space that could have been used for a multitude of functions/apliances! The chief said it had to be there - would work great on car fires, etc! Now our small car fires can become big car fires!!! besides taking up valuable space, it added more weight to the rig and also several thousand extra dollars!! it could have been worse - he wanted to have it mounted on the extended front bumper initially!!!! Yikes!!!!! Would have been a conversation piece on parade day, that's for sure!!! Sorry to say - booster reels went out with leather lungers!!!! Both of these antiquated fire service 'standards' can get you killed!!

  15. #40
    ONTFF
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    148champ, yes i do agree that maybe it wasn't the greatest spot (the rear) but lets look at it this way, maybe it could have been on top of the truck and more of a pain to pull the line, and a booster can be used quite effectively in the right conditions, if it doesn't flow enough sure pull our almighty 1 3/4 but for a small rubbish or car fire its plenty, and easy pick up too, used 'em on chimney fires, cars, brush, its all about having the OPTION, the front mounted position i think would be all right, on a small fire you could probably nose in on it fairly close and the truck provides you with all that protection

  16. #41
    Eng522ine
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Exclamation

    148champ... IF you know what you're doing with a booster line, and if you have someone that knows how to pump to one, you can EASILY put out a car fire with a booster line. This can be done long before a little car fire turns into a big one. If you're having problems with doing it successfully, ask around and see if people in your department or neighboring departments have experience using them successfully and ask them to drill with you so you can learn it. Just because you can't do it doesn't mean that it can't be done. I mean, hell, it's already on your truck so you might as well learn how to use it to your greatest advantage. I don't mean for this to sound like a put down or any kind of slam, but like you said you have it, so learn it. It IS a great tool, don't just chalk it up as an old man's folly. I'm no old man, 27, but I'll preach the usefulness of the booster line till I find it no longer works.

  17. #42
    oz10engine
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    148champ... So what line do you pull for a trash can fire,small brush fire,or a small or smoldering fire in the engine, or behind the dash, or in a seat, a 1-3/4" ? Yea right. Use some common sense.

  18. #43
    dcfdlt
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    You got to be kidding me...LHS thanks for your pics and your ergonomic concerns by putting everything but the kitchen sink on the front bumper, but seriously what the hell is your dept thinking?? Are these the attack lines? Are there crosslays on that piece. With the attack lines not preconnected, it reminds me of some of the European rigs, which take three times as long to get a line in service. With the TFT on the front of the bumper, I am reminded of a sniper putting his rifle together before he goes out to hunt.

    A recent trend has been to put extrication equip on the front bumper. While I like this concept of hydr lines/reels and electric reels, I don't find any convincing arguement for the combo tool. Yes, it's preconnected but God-for-bid you hit a pothole or even a fenderbender, you are going to wipe out about 10K worth of equipment. Nobody plans for accidents. Anyway, just my opinion. I admire the departmental creativity but not the efficiency of the solution.

    A thought on booster reels. Wash., DC specs them on our new Seagraves. Some companies go to several dumpsters, trash, etc. fires a day. Over the years we found it so much easier then pulling and repacking, pulling and repacking on B.S. several times a day (autos get an 1 1/2). The problem is the reels are on top mid mount. Evidently Seagrave couldn't put them on the back step, WHERE THEY SHOULD BE, because of the rear
    4 1/2 intakes (which we like as flexibility in addition to the front). If you can spend the money and don't need the equipment space, there a good option. Be safe.



  19. #44
    dcfdlt
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    MY APOLOGIES LHS AND RATTLESNAKE!!! My buddy showed be just two shots of your rig. I didn't think anyone was stupid enough to leave unconnected donut rolls on the front bumper. You got some big dough on the front of theat piece and now I look, it seems there's a lot of ingenuity. Sorry, for the haphazard opinion. DCFDLT

  20. #45
    LHS*
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    Thanks for your pics and your ergonomic concerns by putting everything but the kitchen sink on the front bumper,

    Actually, if you look around a bit on the site

    "http://www.geocities.com/Baja/Trails/7873/index2.html">

    you will see, the kitchen in inside the cab on the back wall of every rig. 21 cubic feet of food storage (fully stocked of course with everything from candy, to ready to eat complete meals), 11 gallons of drinking water, two coffee makers (decaf and caf) each with a capacity of 1400 cups per hour that can be used in the cab or portably, hot and cold cup dispensers, 140 cans of soda, napkin and paper towel dispensers, microwave, refrigerator, ice maker, two hot plates, your basic needs area (nail clippers, advil, tylinol, aspirin, tissues, toilet paper, comb brush, allergy stuff, cough drops, contact, etc.), and two video players and two color TV’s. Pretty basic actually, being a union fire department I‘m sure you have something much nicer.

    //Are these the attack lines?

    Yes two 200 to 250 foot attacks on the font bumper preconnected and three 400 footers on the rear bump plus a 150 footer.

    //Are there crosslays on that piece.

    Of course not.

    ///With the attack lines not preconnected, it reminds me of some of the European rigs, which take three times as long to get a line in service.

    I bet the boys from FDNY and LA City would argue that with you, they are not running preconnects.

    // With the TFT on the front of the bumper, I am reminded of a sniper putting his rifle together before he goes out to hunt.

    Cool, it is a 30 year bracket, it works well.

    //recent trend has been to put extrication equip on the front bumper. While I like this concept of hydr lines/reels and electric reels, I don't find any convincing arguement for the combo tool.

    We simply push on button, walk out of the cab grab the extra large combo tool and walk to the vehicle and go to work in less than 15 seconds. It is a cutter and a spreader. Having it preconnected means one less thing to connect or screw up. With 150 feet of working hose measured from the front bumper we can reach anything. I guess we could do like most fd’s have a pump, hoses and tools stuffed in a compartment (hopefully on the rig on scene, if not wait for it to arrive), and in 3 to 5 minutes (assuming no snow) and a lot of walking back and forth get it out of the truck, drag it to the scene, hook up all the hoses (hoping no one drops one in the dirt so it gets fouled and won’t connect), hook up the tools (unless of course someone shut the pump off with pressure on it so you can’t hook the hoses up), and hope the pump will start (and hope someone knows how to start it in the dark) and not run out of fuel during the operation.

    Another firefighter gets out of the cab approaches the vehicle with four step chocks, Another with an air chisel and air bags also preconnected to 150 feet of air line, Another with a preconnected foam line 200 or 250 feet, another is the inside guy with aluminized blanket and trauma kit, still another with a floodlight, a sawzall and a preconnected ram all three on 150 foot lines and the last member with a mess of cribbing. All of this occurring under the illumination of 9,750 watts of forward facing floodlights and the protection of dual foam master streams. We basically avoid the whole process of staging equipment, it shows up ready to use. If you add all the things we’ve preconnected and all of the tings we avoid by being preconected you’ll see there are hundreds of things that can bite you that we have avoided.

    Each member simply grabbed the tool they are assigned to by riding position and released a Velcro strap and walked off with the tool. Everything is attached to the appropriate reel. Everything from air bag controller, to pressure regulator for the air chisel, and foam setting on the foam meter are all preset. No throttling the rig up, turning on flood lights, engaging the generator…compressor…hydraulics etc, it all is off one button in the cab.

    Out here the front of the pumper arrives on scene first. Every engine is an extrication piece. Each rig can bring the same equipment to bear on an extrication and work together. We could have put all the stuff at the rear or side in a compartment, but that would add 20 to 40 feet of hose to every reel to get to the same place in front of the rig. It isn’t always possible to drive next to or past an accident, but nosing in always works.

    We err or simplicity. Who could ever forget your KME ladder on the cover of the magazine on its side. All the controls and options allowed the crews to outsmart themselves and destroy the ¾ million dollar ladder on a $80,000 dollar hose fire.

    //Yes, it's preconnected but God-for-bid you hit a pothole or even a fenderbender, you are going to wipe out about 10K worth of equipment.

    With only one paved road I doubt potholes will be an issue. In fact with all roads being gravel or dirt we probably know a lot about equipment mounting for this environment.

    You’re department certainly proved if you hit a tree you trash the crew and the KME cab. So let’s compare your fire departments bumper to ours, a fender bender with your rig, results in pushing the pump off the frame due to the rigid front suction piping. Ours requires calling the insurance company and ordering hose, tools, lights whatever, no pump work. Certainly our layout is much heartier for cold weather use. You need to run a heavy rescue or ladder to begin extrication whereas any engine can do the job here. You have a very limited hose compliment on the front bumper.

    You can’t pump and roll with your apparatus and we can. A large flammable liquid fire would require a foam rig at your place whereas each engine can support itself here. The height of your deck gun makes penetration into a ground floor building marginal, whereas our 5 foot high guns offer tremendous interior ground floor penetration.

    Other observations are: floodlighting is non-existent on your rigs (12 volting lighting in the 21st century??), the raised roof design limits the use of your deck gun…it is basically a right or left only gun, we certainly have a better ground ladder compliment, a lot more hose, offer better accountability, better crew safety, better situational awareness for the officer and crew, it would take us a lot less time to deploy almost any tool, it appears we could get a draft 17 times faster than your rigs, we can change out our valves days quicker, I’d be very concerned about the non-NFPA keystone on the front bumper of E-2..it could kill, all your preconnects are essentially the same length, thus you do a lot of make and breaks to get a long line in service versus us pulling the right sized hose and spraying water quicker, you can have your 7 foot high cross lays…we can load any of our bumper lines with just one firefighter, our bumper lines certainly pull better than yours and load easier, I like the Roto-Ray does it fight fire??, I’m sure we get around in the snow better with a 6 x 6 chassis, each of our engines has three times the foam capability of your dedicated foam unit, you run a rehab unit and each of our engines is a rehab unit, It appears we carry more of everything in our compartments and I do mean everything, it appears we could have foam flowing in one 30th the time, Overall your engines look very “Dear E-One or Dear Seagrave send us a basic off the shelf pumper”.

    //I admire the departmental creativity but not the efficiency of the solution.

    I agree you all are running Plain Jane’s without much if any innovation.

    //Evidently Seagrave couldn't put them BOOSTERS on the back step, WHERE THEY SHOULD BE,

    Gee couldn’t you get rear ended and spend $10,000 fixing the rig??? That rigid rear suction will knock the pump off the frame. A booster is a $3500 option that can be accomplished with two or three old lengths of hose

    /I didn't think anyone was stupid enough to leave unconnected donut rolls on the front bumper.

    You mean like the donuts you carry stuffed in compartments on your rigs? Yeah like the rip wraps of hose you carry on the running boards? Someone would ask out here why aren’t the hose packs setup for use as hose packs and preconnects?? Like I said above, not everyone agrees preconnects are the way to go. In fact if we look at the nation’s fire trucks we would find that the norm is 7 to 8 foot high attack lines 150 or 200 feet long, regardless of the length of attack lines really needed. Did you know LA County carries as many as 20 donut rolls of attack line on their engines?? Can you believe “they’d be that stupid?” Or is it possible you don’t understand their operations enough to make a comment like that?

    // that piece

    Actually the entire fleet is setup the same way.

    //it seems there's a lot of ingenuity

    A bit, but what do you expect with a lady chief?

    Obviously there are dozens of ways to skin a cat.

  21. #46
    ADSN/WFLD
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    DCFDLT, don't take LHS's comments to heart, he isn't even an active duty firefighter anymore. And he is certainly young enough to be doing the job.

    LHS, It's great that Fallon has such wonderful rigs, but like previous posts, the Fallon rigs wouldn't work everywhere.
    "but nosing in always works"
    I guess in the middle of the desert you don't have cars falling off of the expressway 200+ feet from the road, where the best way to the patient is by bringing the power unit and tools to the wreck.
    We don't need a kitchen in every rig. We aren't more than a half of a mile from a convenience mart any where in our, or our neighbors districts.
    As for two TV's, again we would prefer to do our job and go home, not live in our rig.
    400' lines with TFT nozzles, I'd love to see a flow meter while those are flowing.
    We also don't place all of our eggs in one basket, from the sound of it if Fallon's rig breaks down you can't run anything. No lights, No tools, Not even the coffee maker.

    I would be really interested in hearing from someone on the Churchill / Fallon VFD, preferably some one who is an active firefighter.

  22. #47
    LHS*
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    ADSN/WFLD

    Yeah can’t possibly learn from anyone who works in 7 departments a week only from people who belong to one department??? Please explain.

    Sorry I retired, is that a sin?????

    //It's great that Fallon has such wonderful rigs, but like previous posts, the Fallon rigs wouldn't work everywhere. "but nosing in always works"

    I don’t know how to break this to you, BUT we are talking about apparatus from Colorado…DUH The out of context quote is quite clear saying “out here” nosing in always works.”

    //I guess in the middle of the desert you don't have cars falling off of the expressway 200+ feet from the road,

    If you go back and read the post, you will see it says “out here”, not anywhere else, so no, 200 foot expressways are not in the response district so why would they build the rig for that response??

    // where the best way to the patient is by bringing the power unit and tools to the wreck.

    However if you’d looked at the posted link you would have seen portable power units, hoses and tools for use away from the rig on every rig. So if your advice is to design apparatus for the call you’ll never have or someone else’s turf, I think that’s bad advice. But in this case they’d work just fine wouldn’t they? The rigs in question, from COLORADO, No Desert There! Are setup exactly for the calls they handle not anyone else’s.

    //We don't need a kitchen in every rig. We aren't more than a half of a mile from a convenience mart any where in our, or our neighbors districts.

    Good for you, did someone suggest you had to have one???? Nope!

    //As for two TV's, again we would prefer to do our job and go home, not live in our rig.

    That’s nice you don’t work in their environment and no one is suggesting you change a thing. The fact they have the same ISO rating as you without hydrants and the town you are slamming got you by 4 classes suggests they probably have more on the ball than you though.

    //400' lines with TFT nozzles, I'd love to see a flow meter while those are flowing.

    282 gpm enough for you???

    ///We also don't place all of our eggs in one basket,

    Gee, three identical rigs from three station is all your eggs in one basket? DO you even know what you are talking about?

    // from the sound of it if Fallon's rig breaks down you can't run anything.

    Oh really, please make your case if you can. Seeing as how you are off by over 1000 miles from the department being discussed.

    //I would be really interested in hearing from someone on the Churchill / Fallon VFD, preferably some one who is an active firefighter.

    Two guys from the department have tried to email you but your bogus email address on AOL come back with:

    The following problems occurred while processing your request:

    wfldfire@aol.com - This is not a known member.

    Feel free to post a real email address, and make a web page, we’d love to see what you run so we could all use good laugh.

  23. #48
    Eng522ine
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Thumbs up

    LHS*... great rigs... I love the innovation and creative thinking. My compliments to the spec committee.

    Just one question for ya... After you have some microwave chow and a few cups of coffee... ummmm.... where's the john on that rig??? You got a chemical potty shoved in a compartment??? Or atleast a couple rolls of TP some where?

    Good luck with them. Be safe.

  24. #49
    dr inferno
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Eng522ine: You can tackle any fire you want with the booster line but all I am doing is stating facts from the people who have studied fires and firefighter safety for a lot longer than 27 years. Car fires are no joke with the gas charged struts and bumper shocks becoming projectiles a second line should be pulled always to protect your attack team regardless of overkill concerns. What about that alternative fuel cylinder in the back of the pick up truck that is on fire, that was not noticed thru the smoke, that the fire has been impinging on? You think the booster reel alone can handle that safely? May be too late to deploy a second line now!! As for small car fires a pressure water extinguisher with a foam additive works great and has even less pack up time than the booster reel. As well don't you think you have to work your engine harder to achieve the psi required to overcome the friction loss in the smaller hose as compared inch and half hose? You guys do what you want but I think if your training to take on all car fires with the booster line then you guys are flirting with disaster.

  25. #50
    KEA
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    LHS:
    /400' lines with TFT nozzles, I'd love to see a flow meter while those are flowing.

    /282 gpm enough for you???/

    Just wanted to make sure I understand this correctly:
    400' of 1 3/4" hose with Automatic 100-psi nozzles and you are flowing 282-gpm or is that flow from the Smoooth bore Fallon tip made by TFT? If it is, what tip size?

    What engine pressure are you using to get that flow?

    Thanks

    ------------------
    Kirk Allen
    First Strike Technologies, Inc

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