anyone know the do's and don'ts of using a PPV fan inside of a structure. IE... carbon monoxide build up etc... ?
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Thread: using a PPV fan
05-31-2001, 12:40 AM #1WASIE205Firehouse.com Guest
using a PPV fan
05-31-2001, 03:15 AM #2FireloverFirehouse.com Guest
In our department, we don't use any PPV fans inside a building. We'll use the ejection fans to help build the pressure.
If you sent us to HELL, WE'D PUT IT OUT!!
**And of course these are only my opinion and only mine. Don't take it out on anyone else but me.**
05-31-2001, 08:25 AM #3TheChronicFirehouse.com Guest
We never bring any gasoline or mixed-fuel powered fans inside the structure - but we will not hesitate to bring in the electric ones especially for basement (almost always) and sometimes (rare) for an attic.
05-31-2001, 09:20 AM #4Truckie5553Firehouse.com Guest
You never take anything that will produce CO inside a structure. You are only removing the smoke and replacing it with CO, therefore not really making any progress. Secondly, you can not use anything that is capable of emitting sparks in any IDLH atmosphere.
Set up the fan outside the door and pressurize the structure. If you are doing it correctly, you will never even thinking about taking it inside.
Hope this info helps.
Captain James Collier
McMahan Fire Rescue
KCTCS Area 6 Instructor
05-31-2001, 09:59 AM #5George Wendt, CFIFirehouse.com Guest
PPV fans inside a building is bad for two reasons.
1. Bringing a gasoline-powered device into a building will jeopardize any investigation into a possible arson fire. The debris samples will be useless because of crime scene contamination.
2. The CO level will be dangerous. My partner and I investigated a fire in the basement of a hotel. PPV fans were running in exterior stairwells that were 8-10 feet below grade. I arrived 45 minutes after my partner. When I found him, he was flushed red, slurring his speech and stumbling. We evacuated the building and conducted some air-monitoring. The CO level was many times in excess of the safe level.
05-31-2001, 10:13 AM #6TCFireFirehouse.com Guest
Agree with the other responders. Not a good idead to bring a PPV into a building. Besides the CO consideration, it defeats the whole purpose of PPV by having it inside. If you need a fan inside for some reason use a smoke ejector.
05-31-2001, 11:22 AM #7wrongWAYFirehouse.com Guest
I've seen it done many times, but I don't like the idea of setting up a PPV fan (even electric) anywhere inside. We have and utilize an electric 'spark-proof'(?) fan for basement fires and for confined spaces that has a long (25 foot) very flexible 8 inch hose - but we still keep it outside and just drag in the hose.
05-31-2001, 11:47 AM #8engine121Firehouse.com Guest
My fd has used the ppv to some success. It is one of the first things we set up after water supply and initial attack have started. It cools the building down some and icreases visability ans life safety for any trapped ocupants. What works for us may not work for your fd. Try it to see what works best for you.
05-31-2001, 01:05 PM #9eCappyFirehouse.com Guest
If the original question pertains to using gasoline powered fans inside a structure the answer is clearly NO. Even if they're set up 'safe' outside all gasoline powered units should have an exhaust gas deflector or exhaust extension hose to keep CO out.
BUT if you're lucky enough to have one of those big and QUIET 'always start' electric fans that can move air just as well as the gasoline powered units do, and you absolutley, positively, no ifs ands or buts, need, NEED it inside - say for example inside one of those old large sprawling manufacturing facilities that has been converted into several smaller businesses that are actually buildings within buildings within buildings, or to pressurize a stairwell in an old highrise building - and if your cord reel reaches, then use it.
Be carefull, always monitor the air you're working in and remember nothing is "Spark-Proof!"
I prefer the electrics we have over our gasoline units because they are very VERY quiet (especially our new RamFans), they always 'start', no gas cans are needed, no refilling hot motors - and YES they move just as much air as the gasoline units. (Nice watermist attachments for rehab too).
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