Brunacini quote

[jcbmedic]

I was told awhile back that Brunacini once said something along the lines of "the modern day fire department is an EMS provider that occasionally puts out fires". Has anyone heard this before and if so I need a some info on when and where? Thanks

[ADSN/WFLD]

I see an East VS West post starting.

I never heard that quote before, it may have been taken out of context.

Try the east meets west videos from FDIC

[joejoe33]

I was sent to one of Brunacini's seminars here in Texas. He preaches on the high end of "Customer Service", but I do not recall him making the remark you refered to.

joejoe33

These statements and opinions are mine and do not represent the organization I am affiliated with or IAFF Local 3358

[iresq]

I've heard him quoted as saying "I spoke with God and She said all Fire Engines were to be Red and have CAFS"

[ 06-28-2001: Message edited by: iresq ]

[CaptLou]

Hi,

Haven't heard him say that one about EMS, but I did hear him say at a seminar:

"beware of chiefs who say, don't do anything until I get there."

[nsfdjr]

I dont remember him saying that, but he was up in out county for a seminar. He is really a great speaker, and defiantly knows what he is talkin about!

[jcbmedic]

Thanks for the post, everybody. I'm still researching.

hey iresq: green?

[hot DAMN]

Al Brunacini is a disgrace to the fire service and is one of the many people out there attempting to ruin the fire service.
We can never eliminate fires, or the danger associated with them, so all we can do is BE GOOD AT IT. Which as the years go on, it gets harder and harder to do.

[gah74]

I don't see how Brunacini is ruining the fire service. Personally, I like him...but I don't see that he really started anything.

ICS existed before him and is a good thing anyway. All this customer service stuff was going on long before Brunacini, he just applied a name to it.

So how is it that Brunacini is ruining the fire service?

[Double_Local]

Well, for one thing, dumb@ssess like Ronnie Few follow his word like the gospel, and generally foul everything up.

You can't put the cart before the horse...quality customer service begins with quality SERVICE...efficient fire suppression. If you can't do that, do not pass go, do not collect $200...go back to the academy and try again.

Anyone who runs a department that can take a a trash fire in the rear of a building, and wind up with a dead fireman, might need to rethink the department's priorities.

(God bless our brother's soul)

[gah74]

With all due respect, Double, it's pretty cowardly to post on this site without so much as stating where you work in your profile...and then insinuate that Brunacini is responsible for the death of this firefighter. Especially when you present just enough of the story to make it sound like the first engine there was fighting a trash fire. Yes, the person who called 911 reported a trash fire, but that isn't what they had...an alarm was put on the call before the first unit arrived simply because of the smoke conditions that could be seen distant from the structure.

Phoenix isn't the only fire department that has lost a firefighter. I guess we could name some more departments if you want to. I'm not really sure that is necessary though. Is Brunacini's influence somehow responsible for their deaths also?

Do you know the priorities of the Phoenix FD? Are you familiar with their training academy and continued training? If you are, then by all means share your information and tell us what you think the deficiencies are. ...But I have a whole lot more respect for someone who isn't afraid to be visible and will talk openly and honestly about his department then someone from anywhere, anyplace, anytime.

[ 06-30-2001: Message edited by: gah74 ]

[Double_Local]

Washington, DC

Well for one, I work for the worst fire department in the country, according to "Dr." carl holmes. By his measure, the best fire department in the world is the Phoenix fire department.

My department has killed more than its share of firemen, and likely will continue to do so...all of our "out of service" training for the last year has consisted of "tyra hunter diversity training", "customer service training", "ems form 151 training", and possibly something else I can't remember.

The problem with my department, and many others, is that we have chiefs that are far more concerned with creating a resume for working the speaking circuit than they are about taking care of their department. Hell, sometimes i think they make up $hit just so they can write an article in some magazine.

My dumb***** chief, Ronnie Few, has basically no management skills, but he can take a few ideas from the "fire god" a brunacini and think he's doing a good job.

I have no Idea what the phoenix fd's priorities are, but I'm pretty sure that a brunacini's priorities are fattening his pockets on the lecture circuit.

I don't know exactly what they had on arrival, but I know that they found the poor bastard who died FOUR times, and left him in there three of them. Fourth time was a little too late. Seems like a problem to me.

I doubt my department is incapable of doing something equally ludicrous, but I'd like to think so.

In short, A brunacini may well be a great chief, but I wished he'd quit trying to sell HIS way as THE way to other stupid chiefs.

[Trkco1]

In short, A brunacini may well be a great chief, but I wished he'd quit trying to sell HIS way as THE way to other stupid chiefs.

I couldn't agree more with this statement.

[gah74]

Hey Double...Fair enough, good reply back by the way.
gah

[Jake295885]

Can anyone say CULT OF PERSONALITY? Bruno has been traveling the country speaking to groups of willing sycophants who do everything short of throwing their panties onto the stage. And thats what most Fire Chiefs that think Alan is all knowing wear......PANTIES

I saw him speak in 1983 and thought he applied sound business practices to the fire service. I was spell bound until the toluline tank incident, followed shortly by the carpet warehouse captain almost offing himself. His department makes mistakes just like we all do. But he's too busy traveling the globe selling snake oil to the locals and making a handsome profit doing so to fix them.

Yep, I've seen these spell bound Chiefs who think bruno knows all.........Most are college educated, and lack a spine of their own. They travel the country doing five year stints as alleged fire chiefs, mucking up the waters just enough to escape to the next town to do the same again.

The REAL PROBLEM lies with the city and county managers who play these fools like the punks they are...... Thats my opinion and i'm stickin to it..........Jake

[gah74]

Originally posted by Jake295885:
And thats what most Fire Chiefs that think Alan is all knowing wear......PANTIES
...

Wow. Great insight!

Yep, I've seen these spell bound Chiefs who think bruno knows all.........Most are college educated, and lack a spine of their own.
...[/qb]

Oh no...not a college educated fire chief. Say it isn't so!!

The REAL PROBLEM lies with the city and county managers who play these fools like the punks they are...[/qb]

Riveting. So you don't like him, right?

[ 07-01-2001: Message edited by: gah74 ]

[ALSfirefighter]

Hahaha! That's pretty good Gah!!

I have to say this, I have also seen Chief Brunacini, speak, and I have to say overall, I like what he says and stands for. Now before you go and start to post anything, finish reading my post from here. Like I said, overall I like what he says and stands for. Not all of it, but I have to give him credit, he stands up for what he feels is the right way for his dept. to run. And I find it funny that so many of you bash him, when he's doing something that numerous other chiefs, Capts, LT's, and FF's are doing at a gagillion expo's we have now.

The fact is he speaks on what he did, is doing, and what he believe's in. Instead of like 98% of all other Chiefs in this nation that allow their departments to run by accident. It's actually fairly simple, if you like him, listen to him and absorb it. If you don't find someone else who you do. I don't see anyone else complaining about Vinnie Dunn (who is my main fire god), Tom Brannigan or any of the others who are out there. And to be honest with you I'd listen to Brunacini for 7 days straight then listen or have to look at another individual (*) if that rings a bell for 5 minutes.

============================== ============
The above is my opinion only and doesn't reflect that of any dept/agency I work for, deal with, or am a member of.

[Chief 66]

I'm a personal friend of Brunacini, and it has been one of the greatest things that have ever happened in my life. I say that because I'll put my name and personal friendship and affiliation right upfront, instead of hiding behind a phony handle like some of the other posters.

If this forum topic is going to turn into a Bruno-bashing session, then the bashers should have the courage to identify themselves. It's only fair.

As for the original topic about Bruno's quote about FD's being EMS service agencies that occasionally go to fires...what's your problem?

He said it, and guess what, its true. I hear fire folks complaining about it all the time, but the fact is that most career fire departments have become heavily involved in some form of EMS service delivery. Fires runs are down, EMS runs are up, and all that Bruno said was identifying the obvious. You gonna get mad at him for that?


Now a couple of other points mentioned here:

I got a question for you...if I gave you an opportunity to go to a lecture and listen to Ben Franklin speak about his thoughts about the US Fire Service, I'd bet you'd rush out to get to the lecture.

I got some news for you, our modern day Ben Franklin is Brunacini, and you should get a chance to meet him before he decides to stay home for a weekend or two in a row. For your information, there were a bunch of folks who didn't think much of Franklin in his day, either.

Not that he needs any defending from me, but for the last 25 years, Bruno and a bunch of others have devoted their weekends and other days to traveling around the country to get the word out about firefighter safety, incident command and management, leadership and a bunch of other topics. NFPA 1500, the basic of firefighter safety today, began during his watch. He has had just a little bit to do with the way almost every FD in the US does business today, whether you like him or not.

Knowing Alan and his family, how much do you think its worth to literally spend 60-70% of your weekends all around the country teaching and working with other departments? Anyone out there willing to do it for free? I bet you got paid at work today! Got a problem with him getting paid? I'll bet good money that he never strong-armed anyone into paying him to speak.

Now about the Phoenix fire that cost Brett Tarver his life this spring. Want to make snide comments about a "trash fire" that cost a firefighter and devoted father and husband his life? Cheap shot. That trah fire was a well involved commercial occupied retail store on arrival of the first Phoenix units. There were civilians coming out the front door with smoke behind them when the PFD got on the scene. That's not a trash fire. Want to make comments about 4 heroic rescue attempts to get a trapped firefighter out? You should have been at the funeral and seen the faces of those who tried to get Brett out. They called him "Bart Simpson on steroids". Real big guy. You try and get one of your biggest guys out of a working store fire and then you can make comments about Phoenix.

Here's what the Phoenix FD did after the fire. They took every member of that department and brought them through the fire scene for the next 2 weeks, I mean everyone associated with the department, the mechanics who fix the apparatus, the folks who deliver the mail, the dispatchers, the firefighters, the administration people...everyone. They are going to extraordinary measures to tell everyone and anyone how and why Brett died, and they are developing a new command and control procedure for big-box store fires. Then they will share it with every fire department in the country.

In the 22 years that Bruno has been Fire Chief in Phoenix, there have been 2 firefighter fatalities from exposure to fire products. Someone mentioned the tank explosion, and now, Brett's tragic death. That is 2 deaths (2 too many) in 22 years in one of the busiest FD's in the country...7th biggest in the country. The 1983 explosion was one of the most documented incidents of its day, and I dare say that most of you have seen the video and photos from that incident. You gonna knock a department that opens up their soul and lets you look into it after they loose a firefighter? You gotta be kidding.

Just two weeks ago, 3 brave firefighters were killed in the blaze in Astoria Queens. The FDNY Fire Commissioner has said it best, that sometimes, for no obvious reasons, buildings explode and firefighters get killed.

It's a dangerous business, and we can minimize the risk as much as possible, but never remove it entirely. What happened in Phoenix this spring at that market was a tragedy and an accident, and because of it, so much information will be diseminated that the next time that fire occurrs, there should be a different outcome. That is a fitting tribute to Brett Tarver and the members of the Phoenix FD.

Now, some of you blame Bruno for the situation in Washington DC? Really big stretch there...don't you think? DCFD has big problems, and its tough to imagine working in that situation. Must be tough to work there, and a number of people have tried to make it better. Don't blame Bruno, though. The situation is difficult and, if you knew and listened to Bruno at all..you'd realize that he preaches the basics of firefighting as the solution to 99% of firefighting problems. If you can't put out fires, you don't have to worry about customer service. Being a good boss and treating people nice (Bruno thought's) have nothing to do with bad firefighting. If some people have read his books or listened to his lectures and missed the key points...its not Bruno's fault.

I do think that the Phoenix FD is the best in the country right now. It is a result of a dedicated effort to figure out the needs of the customers and the best way to serve them. That includes some pretty damn aggresive interior firefighting, and I challenge anyone who thinks differently to take flight to Phoenix and ride with any of the busy downtown companies. They have an open riding policy, and will make you feel like one of the family.

You'd be welcome to stay and see how they do things, and its the extra stuff they do, besides really tough firefighting, that make the difference in the service they provide. Go see for yourself before your criticize a FD that you know little about.

Sorry for beig long, but it burns me up to see Bruno knocked for doing more for the fire service than most individuals could ever accomplish on their own. By the way, if you really had a problem with Bruno, you could call him up and ask him about it. His office is always open and anyone can walk in and say hello. Thats the way he does business, and if some folks care to focus on a few things he says and not the entire focus of his work...its not his fault.

[Chief79]

WOW CHIEF 66!!! It will be extremely difficult for anyone to knock him now.

I too have heard the man speak. Great speaker. I can think of no reason to speak ill of the man. I will attend any seminar he is involved with anytime I can.

[Jake295885]

Like I said, Its a CULT OF PERSONALITY. Its a good thing Bruno is trying to lead the fire service in the direction he thinks is correct, and not exterminate a race of people. You guys would be his storm troopers.

Stop and think about what you just said, you FEEL he is trying to do right................FEEL where the hell do feelings come into play. These over educated bozos tryed to cut into a flammable liquid storage tank and bank on the vapors to be too rich. WRONG, ONE DEAD SEVERAL HURT BAD..........Count me out of the bruno storm trooper club...

Now he's gonna preach safety, SAFETY..........We got people working in the fire service today that have never extinguished a pilot light, hiding behind SAFETY..........COWARD IS THE WORD THAT COMES TO MIND.......

The place that hosted his 83 speach burns buildings to the ground at alarming rates........the reason SAFETY..........hope you never live in a place like this............all your lifes work up in smoke because a one room fire is allowed to spread thru-out the building while "Firefighters" stand in the front yard and watch, so as not to take any chances at all.

Yes you guys are exactly who I was thinking of when I wrote my post. CHIEF..........Ya right........