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  1. #1
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    Default Safe Firefighting To all.

    Safe firefighting to all.

    [ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: the researcher ]


  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber E229Lt's Avatar
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    This is all under investigation and not somethimg any member who operated should or would comment on in this forum.

  3. #3
    Forum Member PAVolunteer's Avatar
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    Default

    Coincidentally, the January 1999 (if you can find one) issue of Firehouse Mag. has an outline for FDNY's High-Rise Strategy. If it is still accurate, this may give you a good place to start for an idea of the plan of attack that may have been followed. Also, if you go to
    http://vincentdunn.com/dunn/newslett...ust/August.pdf

    you can see Vincent Dunn's High-Rise attack plan. This may give an idea also.

    Stay Safe

  4. #4
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    Do the research, get an idea of what may have been going on. But whatever you do, don't armchair quarterback it and say well they shoulda done this or shoulda done that. Bad karma...
    ...if you put the handline in the right spot, you won't have to jump out the window...
    -Andy "Nozzles", SQ18, 9-11-01

  5. #5
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    FDNY follows certain high rise ops outlined in Vincent Dunns articles and their guidebook.But like e299 said it is under investigation.They did what SOPS told them to do.It was an act of war that killed these members not a bad job by the FDNY.They did what needed to be done.

  6. #6
    District Chief distchief60b's Avatar
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    I am with the rest of you. E229Lt has a good point. Dont go asking questions because it is under investigation. Besides...Who the hell are ya gonna blame anyway. All our brothers and sisters are dead. Osama did this....an act of war!

    When I first started reading the post I thouht..."damn...it sure did not take long for someone to start second guessing." As others have said....if this is your direction...then drop it.

    If not....do the research and put out the facts. Dont second guess or monday morning quarterback.
    09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
    ------------------------------
    IACOJ Minister of Southern Comfort
    "Purple Hydrant" Recipient (3 Times)
    BMI Investigator
    ------------------------------
    The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.

  7. #7
    Forum Member PAVolunteer's Avatar
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    Absolutely agree w/ the Monday Morning QB'ing. Don't do it. I took researcher's question as exactly that, a research question - NOT as a right or wrong, should they have done this or that. Whatever they did, they saved thousands of lives.

    Stay Safe

  8. #8
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    Fellow Brothers,

    I apologise if there has been a misinterpretation of my study topic. My fire service responds to an an area that services numerous high rise buildings, in several major cities. I was amazed at the tremendous work performed by the FDNY crews at the WTCs, particularly given the potential for massive loss of civilian life that they averted, under what were undoubtably the most horrendous and extreme firefighting circumstances ever to confront firefighters. Due to my countries strong stand in support of President Bush's war against terrorism, including the sending of our troops to Afghanastan to support the USA, there have been numerous threats made to attack our city buildings; In my subject, I was genuinely seeking to learn a little more about the firefighting operations that saved so many lives.

    For the referall to Vincent Dunnes notes, I thankyou. They were very useful and we are studying them carefully. In regard to the investigation, of course you are right. As to any criticism of FDNY; on Sept 11 they allowed us all to proudly stand tall as firefighters; I can only stand humbly in admiration of their actions.

    Again, I apologise for any misunderstanding my post may have caused.

    Safe Firefighting, Always.

    Your brothers in Australia

    [ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: the researcher ]

  9. #9
    Senior Member kfd232's Avatar
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    As usual there is Irish blood running through the veins of every American Firefighter
    For some reason we all get a little excited over things and sometimes jump to conclusions.
    I appreciate your clarification on what you were wanting, and I also pray you never have to face a situation like the one FDNY did.
    Researching every incident is one of the most important tools we have to better ourselves in the future. I know that WTC is a touchy subject for many, but the fact remains...
    Those guys did some incredible things in an extremely new type of incident. This is going to HAVE TO BECOME the textbook case study for WMD involving AV fuel and building construction, along with many other rescue/firefighting/response issues. We are going to find out that if faced with a similiar situation (GOd Help US ALL!) there are things we can do to help facilitate the greatest number of saved/rescued, while maintaining the best level of safety for emergency personnel. While this incident is still under investigation, it doesn't prevent us from trying to learn as much as possible right now. We will continually find out new things about this incident that will change the way we respond to certain incidents.
    I am looking forward to studying and learning from it. I know that every one of our brothers and sisters who died that day would be saying, 'Just because I died in this incident doesn't mean it is off limits! Learn from what happened, because maybe someday it will save your life.'

    Blame will never be pointed at FDNY as far as I am concerned. We ALL know that our job can be deadly and we GLADLY go to work each shift! This was a new environment, one that had a new set of rules that we have not ever encountered before, and once again FIREFIGHTERS stepped up and kicked ***! Thousands of lives saved!! THOUSANDS!!! It hurts that we lost so many, but we must profit in the fire service from this loss. Profit not in money! But in knowledge.


    be safe brothers
    Be safe brothers

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