11-21-2001, 08:55 PM #1
- Join Date
- Dec 1999
- Swanton Fire Dept. Swanton, Vermont
Globe vs. Janesville Turnout Gear
We are presently looking at replacing our turnouts. We are looking at Globe GX-7 Advance and Janesville (Lion) With Advance shell. What have you seen with these companies and materials??
11-21-2001, 09:07 PM #2
- Join Date
- Sep 2000
Cannot speak for the Advance, But we wear the GX-7 in Nomex. Can't beat the fit and the wear is excellent.
Chalk one up for Globe.
11-22-2001, 08:33 AM #3
Wore the Globe for about 5 years and the stuff we had seemed to unravel a lot at the seams, not to mention the fit wasn't that good (the fit was probably more from the guy measuring us)
Have work Janesville for the last 8. The fit is great and it seems to hold up better.
I did get a steam burn while wearing Janesvillem but, it was a hot day already so I was sweating as soon as I put the gear on. And the fire I was in was extremely hot, hot enough to melt the faceshield off my helmet and cause damage to my mask. Only a 1st degree steam burn though, so I think it held up very well.ftm-ptb-rbp
11-22-2001, 07:04 PM #4
I _LOVE_ my janesville gear, I find it very comfortable, holds up great, dries quickly. Just very nice overall!
11-22-2001, 09:31 PM #5
- Join Date
- Nov 2001
- Salem, NH
Chalk another one up for Globe,
Im a fire explorer and my dad is a 29yr Vet who now has Globe, They have always had globe. For a few years they had janesville but my father did not like them at all and eventually the dept. switched back to globe. I now have their old gear (janesville) and its alright, but i would love to have Globe, Their gear is lighter and their technology is better.
11-24-2001, 05:44 PM #6
- Join Date
- Nov 2001
We have used both, Janesville does offer a few better options like a 29" coat, and the ugly green knee both of which a excellent, but overall they are fairly equal in wear and service life.
11-25-2001, 10:59 AM #7
- Join Date
- Jan 2000
- Watchung, NJ USA
Have you looked at Morning Pride?Kevin M. Fitzhenry
Captain, Rescue Company 1
City of Bayonne (NJ) Fire Department
11-25-2001, 12:25 PM #8
I have quaker nomex, make fun of it as much as you'd like but it's affordable, it's durable and it's made right here in Pennsylvania...
My department however is debating buying cairns basofil and I would support the decision if it were made, that stuff is down right comfortable to wear!There are three truths in life:
1. Jews do not recognize Jesus as the Messiah.
2. Protestants do not recognize the Pope as the leader of the Christian faith.
3. Two Baptists do not recognize each other in the liquor store.
11-25-2001, 03:59 PM #9
- Join Date
- Nov 2000
- Glasgow, KY.
Sometime take a look at your smaller companies making gear. All the materials comes from the same places (like Southern Mills for the majority of US gear mfg's). It is all in how it is stitched together. Another consideration in using a smaller company is the fact that their custom options are easier to incorporate. Still a third thought is that the customer service should be exceptional as these companies want to get a bigger piece of the pie, they will take better detail to their work.
11-25-2001, 04:28 PM #10
- Join Date
- Mar 2001
- Camden, ME USA
Have your Globe dealer quote Cairns - made on the same assembly line by the same people
They have the same options
Cairns is less expensive!
Check out their stock gear - no 100 day wait and the gear is the same as special orders.
11-26-2001, 10:26 AM #11
Fireman387 is right....Look hard at quaker...thier seams are lock stiched and surged. Wont unravel if cut. Also use 8-12 stiches/inch as opposed to most who use 6-8. And...as he said...it is all in the construction as most companies buy from southern mills or dupont.... Quaker has great customer service....and gear is custom fit and delivered in 5-7 weeks. You are measured....not asked for your sizes and sent stock gear....CUSTOM MEASURED AND CUSTOM FIT.
Also...look hard at your liner system as this is closest to you and most important. Suggest you consider a CALDURA (5% filament liner)as it is the best whicking liner out. Then for your vapor barrier use STEDAIR 2000.
Quaker is Definitely affordable...expecially comparing Janesville and Globe....EXPENSIVE!!!!!!!
What outer fabric are you using now? PBI, NOMEX ADVANCE???? If in PBI...take a look at BASOFIL.....comparible and still affordable...
Watch out for those that will sell you gear with a Aquatech or breathtex liner in them. Because they will not meet the upcoming washing requirement in the standard, W.L.Gore has removed them from the market. It is not compliant in the 1971 standard for the 2000 edition. Anyone selling you that liner style "cheap" is unloading non-compliant gear. Look closely at your label and make sure it meets NFPA 1971, 2000 edition09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
IACOJ Minister of Southern Comfort
"Purple Hydrant" Recipient (3 Times)
The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.
01-10-2002, 08:40 PM #12
- Join Date
- Aug 2001
- L.I. N.Y.
Any company you buy from gets there material from the same place as the other manufacturers, or at least has that option, Nomex, Pbi etc. If you don't at least look at MORNING PRIDE you are making a huge mistake. If you stopped at there booth at any of the trade shows and then went to Globe, Janesville or any other vendor it would be no contest, Morning Pride hands down. They seem to be very willing to listen to the people who wear there gear, when they get feedback they check it out good and bad, and innovate accordingly. Our department switched over about 11 years ago. We went to bid and Morning Pride under bid Globe by about $50.00 for a full set of gear [Boots, bunker pants, coat, gloves and hood.] My point is they are in the same ballpark. There service is excellent, and they are very consumer friendly, it started as a family operation and you can still talk to the owners. They gave us a complete set of gear for a field test, our choice of material, with every one of there options, at no charge, or obligation. We gave it to a member who was also an NYC firemen so he could put it through its paces at work. Our feeling was if it held up there it would be a sure thing for us. One of there big selling points are very innovative designs to relieve stress, there by not tiring you out as quickly [They actually have over 2 dozen U.S. patents on there gear]. Our guy worked in a busy truck company in hi-rise projects. He noticed almost immediately how he was not tiring with the rest of his company but was able to go further because he wasn't as fatigued. They wore great, we chose PBI, with Goretex liners. It was a no brainier. About 5 years later after fielding testing many brands FDNY also chose Morning Pride for there gear. We like to think they followed our lead [lol]. I don't sell there gear or anyone else's, but with all the options out there it would be ashamed to not check something this good out especially with such a large purchase, which you should have over a long period of time.
01-10-2002, 08:59 PM #13
- Join Date
- Sep 2001
you really should look into Morning Pride. That's some GOOD STUFF.my set of gear(guessing) is about 5 years old.I've had it for 4 years and it was a "hand me down" from another big guy in the dept. It's holding up fine. We even have Morning Pride Helmets. our liners are Nomax. But like CFD said there customer service is AWESOME they are based out of Ohio (chief told me this story) We didn't even request a sales rep we we're calling around for prices and information about the gear. They came to our meeting(and they weren't like most salemen at meetings where there SUPER PUSHY to buy it) they said alright here's our product here's the features, here's why we think our prouduct better. Then i think within a week we placed a order for all new red Morning Pride gear(except mine which is Tan)
Almost all the departments around here run Morning Pride. I say it's all about how good the product is and how you treat the customers.
but overall on a scale of 1-10 I'd give them a 9.5
11-04-2009, 01:23 AM #14
- Join Date
- Sep 2003
- Northern Virginia, Washington DC area
Globe gear vs other brands.
I have worn Globe for over 30 years, since 76. Wearing the old heavy tradtional style with the neoprene moisture barrier is much heavier then the ones in use today. Our department has bought other brands and field tested them in comparison to Globe and has stayed with Globe. Today to the best of my knowledge all paid departments in the Washington DC Metro area and Northern Va area use the same spec, wearing the Globe Xtreme in PBI matrix, and as far as I know even paid departments in the surrounding Maryland counties use the same spec gear, and that's from visiting and training with other departments or seeing them on scene. So I think that says alot about Globe. Of course Cairns is now part of Globe so you're getting the same product with a different name.
I have seen a one piece overall gear used by the US Navy made by Janesville which looks like something I would be interrested in using, but have not been able to find it on the market, not sure if it's specialty item for DOD.
In talking with paid firefighters in Frederick Co Va they are also using Globe GX7 in the "Fairfax Spec" now called "NOVA Spec" also, but thier volunteer department is using gear made by Morning Pride which they claim is more comfortable and user friendly then the GX7, but they have not been issued Globe Xtreme yet, like other Northern Va departments so they can't compare it. I have worn and used both, I like both, the GX 7 and G-Xtreme are simular in feel to me, the G-Xtreme is lighter in wieght then the GX7. Now there is the G-xcel, which according to Globe is less stressful to wear then their other products. Cairns has the Reaxtion gear, which compares to the G-Xtrem, The Cairns RS-1 compares to the GX7 by Globe and finally the new Cairns RSX is the same as the Globe G-xcel, so they are virtually the exact same product with different names. It just depends on which on eyou can get a better deal on. But check it out yourself www.globefiresuits.com compare the booklets on both and go from there.
I'd like to see Globe bring back the Astra gear with the 28 inch coat, and bib style pants. I have a set I bought in yellow nomex I got in 1986 and it still looks fairly new and held up well, it cost me about $600.00 for a complete set. now a days you can't buy a nomex traditional coat for that. Having said that the cairns version of the Astra is still made , called Aegis, with very slight differences in specs.
Just realize Nomex has lower thermal protection rating then PBI but a longer shelf life. PBI is sensitive to sunlight and has a shelf life of about 5 years, which isn't a long time considering the cost. So if you can afford to budget $2000-$2500.00 every 3-5 years to replace your gear and want the higher temprature protection get the PBI/matrix. If you have a budget where you can spend $1200-$1500 every 5-10 years get the nomex/advance. Basofil (Alessandra yarn) costs more then the PBI...and offers even greater protection then PBI.
Your turn out gear is the most important tool you have. you need to know exactly what your gear is made of and the rating for it. I am amazed all the time when teaching how many firefighters have no clue what thier gear is made of, how old it is or the history on it. If your gear has been exposed to hydroarbons, fuel spills etc. it is a walking wick and can never be properly cleaned to reduce the hazard, even when sent to a cleaning and decon company. This information comes from the product litiure included with a new set of gear. Never use soap to clean your gear, a liquid laundry detergeant such as Tide is what Globe has listed on thier information booklets. Many firefighters take for granted thier department will protect them and know what they are buying or using. I have come accross many departments that thought they bought PBI in new Globe Gx7 when in fact they got Nomex/advance in Tan and had no idea until I pointed out the PRODUCT label inside the front of the coat. READ it! It tells you what your gear is made of and when it was made. If it is PBI and older then 5 years it's time to replace it, regardless of if it's been used or not. You have to know what your gear is, how old is it and what the specs are for it, nothing more in the your career as a firefighter does you life and safety depend on then your gear. You can not go by the color today to tell if you have nomex, pbi or Basofil they all come in a tan/ or gold color. PBI and Nomex come in Black. Only nomex comes in other colors like red or blue, or natural (white). Again you can't go by color. read the label, know your gear. I would stay away from on line auctions, most listings of gear on there that I have seen have no idea about the history maufactor date or product information on turnout gear. the ones I have written haven't been able to answer these basic important questions. If you see new gear or something certified as being safe and get written documentation from the seller of that, shop somewhere else. It's your life and your safety, a so called "good deal", may cost you way more in the long run, your life, permanent disabilty. Unless you are buying something strictly for winter warmth, non- fire related training or a halloween custome stay away from on line auction sites. Rememebr the old saying, "better safe then sorry". Is on line auctions savings worth the cost of a funeral or hospital stay or loss income for you and your family?
Last edited by firechief10; 02-19-2013 at 12:09 AM. Reason: SAFETY
11-04-2009, 01:29 AM #15
Arise and walk! It almost 7 years old, but what the hell.
“Guys if you get hurt, we’ll help you. If you get sick we’ll treat you. If you want to bitch and moan, then all I can tell you is to flick the sand out of your slit, suck it up or get the hell out!”
- Capt. Marc Cox CFD
Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.
11-04-2009, 03:46 AM #16
I have used Lion Advance for the several years. It has held up very well compared to many other brands out there.
I do not recommend Lion Helmets, as they will not hold up - weak head bands and tighteners, weak shields. I only use Bullard Helmets.
When you choose boots, make certain that your guys can get their calves into the uppers of the boots. We had an issue with several guys that could not get a fit with anything other than Rangers, so we chose Rangers for continuity.
When we selected our most recent gear, we looked at Advance, PBI and PBX, from 6 different companies. Advance is only the outer shell material and is available from Southern Mills.
Part of the process was that each vendor had to provide actual gear for evaluation. We provided specs and sizes for the evaluation. Then I gave it to the seasoned crews for their evaluation. 9 out of 10 chose the Lion, for a host of reasons.
Delivery time was not an issue with us, but you should consider this if time is critical to you. We received every piece at one time, but it did take about 6 months due to some custom sizes and features.
It is all about what you want. Take the time to get what works for you and don't get in a hurry. Be prepared to deal with a long window if you have many special fits or other issues. And don't put pressure on the vendor or manufacturer. That will most likely cause additional delays.
As far as the vendors making gear available for your evaluation: If a company makes an excuse why they cannot provide a set of gear, pass on them in the evaluation. You will only have issue with these guys if you have defects or need to return something. The vendor that makes excuses that early in the process is not a real player for your business. They have to pay to play, so to speak. The vendors that provide evaluation pieces without issue or comment are most likely the guys you want to do business with.
I recommend that you select a specific time for the evaluation process. Give all vendors notice of the process and schedule well in advance so they can meet the timeline. Look at your people and specify sizes that are average for your group. Only expect one or two sets so make it fit where you can get your best evaluation. As the sample come in, have the vendor mark the pieces in some manner that there can be no mistake of what came from who. Again, have the salesman/vendor put his mark (a number or code) on the gear he provides. Then put everything aside until all evaluation pieces are in.
Once you have received all of the evaluation specimens, begin your process by letting your most experienced people taste them, wear them, sleep in them if they wish. Have them go through the motions of what they will be doing. Then let your newer people play with the gear. The Command Staff should be the last guys to evaluate the equipment so as to keep an open mind. Once the command staff and Chief begin to do their accessment, they can weigh what they hear with what they know. You should have enough data for selection within a week.
Pay particular attention to seams, zippers, velcro closures, wristlets, thumblets, under arms, kness and leg cuffs. "Things" that draw your attention most likely is a warning.
When your done with the evaluation process, note how the vendors react when you give the evaluation pieces back to them. If they make any comment about the dirty condition, you can tell them "Our guys train the way they fight... is that a problem for you?" With the cost of turnout gear continuing to rise, you are entitled to get the best that you can afford. You are entitled to evaluate what your going to wear. You are entitled to satisfy yourself that this product will hold up when your guys need it. Any vendor that is nervous about your evaluation process is not sold on his product, Period! You don't buy a car without driving it.
You have to get this purchase right...most departments cannot replace their turnouts as frequently as they want to due to the high cost capital expenditure. But do include your people in the selection process to some degree... they have to wear it so let them evaluate it.
I have seen Chiefs make this important decision in solo mode that forget to take into account that he most likely WILL NOT BE be the one running, crawling, rolling, heating-up, etc. Let your people put it on and try it out. Hear what they tell you. You may be suprised. While you can only make it comfortable to a degree, there is no reason it should not fit or be like wearing a tent.
When you are ready to order, order the stuff and forget it until it arrives. After you receive the new gear in, take note of any issues or defects before you finalize issuing to your people. Anything that isn't right goes back and you withhold the money until it is right.
I wish you luck. There is nothing that compares to putting your people in new gear. Well maybe Christmas comes close.
11-04-2009, 11:33 AM #17
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
11-04-2009, 11:56 AM #18
- Join Date
- May 2007
11-04-2009, 03:00 PM #19
- Join Date
- Jul 2009
Does anyone have any thoughts regarding FireDex gear?
11-04-2009, 03:27 PM #20
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
11-04-2009, 04:26 PM #21
fireinfo10: Sorry to offend you friend. But you take me way too literally.
The point that I am trying to make is if we are going to spend $100,000 for new gear, we want to know what we're getting. And yes we will evaluate it. And yes we will take care of it. And yes we will clean it up.
I'll even buy the SAMPLES if I can use them at that moment and they meet the specs. When the new stuff comes in, we usually pass our 'very well taken care of gear' to someone that doesn't have our replacement budget. Well we used to have a replacement budget; so I guess I have to really be careful now when I buy something.
Providing Samples is part of the cost of doing business. Any company that builds stuff, has to get it out there to promote that stuff.
Lessons Learned: We bought some equipment bags several years ago. Not a big purchase or a big deal. But when the seams began to unravel and the zippers pulled out, it became a big deal. The warranty wasn't worth the paper it was written on. The vendor, who we had just spent $85,000 with two months before, said he couldn't change them out because the manufacturer would not take them back.
Over a 2 year period we had spent over $300,000 for turnout, hose, and stuff with that vendor. The bags were just 2 months old when the issue began to develop. I don't care about who stands behind the product. I do care that someone does stand behind it to take care of this type of issue.
The salesman called on me recently after finding out that we awarded a $54,000 bid to his competitor. He asked me why I didn't send him a bid package so he could bid. I told him that his company had made it clear that they didn't need our business. So that vendor sacrificed a huge customer for a $1000 defect. That is the definition of BS.
So yes... everything is evaluated.
And when I plan on buying equipment, the salesmen line up and want to be the lucky guy.
Have a nice day.
11-04-2009, 10:08 PM #22
I will chime in here-
Janesville- I have had TWO sets of Janesville gear and I have to tell you, as much as I beat the hell out of them, they held up awesome. Really durable, long lasting and cleaned up well. I did not expect this from either set of turnouts, but I would have to stick with them.
Now Globe was the opposite. The tan "Extreme" were too big, bulky and didnt fit well. The black Globes I had just didnt fit well either. I was not impressed with either set.
Honest answers for anyone who wants to know.
11-04-2009, 10:31 PM #23
- Join Date
- Jan 2005
Stay away from PBI it is not holding up as well as it shoould from what I have been told. I would recommend getting gear with advance outter. I have worn both janesville and globe. The janesville that we had lasted 15 years no problems. Only had globe 3 months and I like them. I would buy either one because there is a reason they are #1 and #2 makers of turnout gear. carians is made by globe and have a stock progam so you get your gear quicker. Globe boots are comfortable as tennis shoes.
11-04-2009, 10:50 PM #24
- Join Date
- Sep 2009
Jump in here as well
Fyrepel Turnout Gear is made by lakeland industries and is a good set of gear for a good price. Check them out. And here is my disclaimer i do work for a company part time as a sales rep and Fyrepel turnout gear is one of our product lines. I am a career and vol. and have used globe, janesville and now fyrepel.
11-05-2009, 07:53 PM #25
Have been using Janesville for years, both on the job, and when I teach live fire at the State Academy. Both have held up extremely well and I have no complaints.
My department just went to Morning Pride, and while I haven't had the chance to evaluate them in a fire, the gear is by far the most comfortable I've ever had on.
FGIACOJ.... "Carpe Elkhartem"
(Seize the Nozzle)
"Victorious warriors win first,
and then go to war,
while defeated warriors go to war first,
and then seek to win."
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