Thread: ATTN FD EXPERTS

  1. #51
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    GODBLESS ALL THE BROTHERS OF THE FDNY

  2. #52
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    Hello everyone on the list! This is the guy that wrote the article for MFN (not MSN)!

    Since I'm obviously being judged and convicted over an article that I wrote, I thought I should come over and at least try to defend myself!

    Number one....MFN is The Maryland Fire Network. As the name implies, it's a Network of Maryland Firefighters! We are a pseudo news organization, that reports on Working Fires and Rescues in Maryland. Our medium of communication is Pagers and E-mail, which we send "Real Time" messages to. We also produce professional video tapes for training and other media purposes.

    I am a 17 year vet Firefighter Paramedic with a large Metropolitan Fire Department. I'm also an EMT-B and NREMTP instructor for Maryland. I'm telling you this, so you know where I'm coming from, not to look for more recognition!

    Number Two...I was working the day of 9/11/01 like a lot of people. My shift was 24 Hrs long. When I went home after that shift, it bothered me to know that hundreds of FF's in NY were not! When I arrived home, I decided to go to NY just to help out. NO GLORY, NO BS, just help. You know, serve coffee, whatever! What I didn't expect was to get in Ground Zero and help with the recovery efforts!

    When I wrote that story "MFN Responds to New York", it was meant to be a story of facts that occured during our trip. Words like "Strike Force" and "Dude" are words that we as a group, not the rest of the world, use in jest! Again it was the facts as they went down and I documented them!

    Believe me, AT NO TIME DID WE EVER LOOK FOR RECOGNITION! In fact, when I returned from NY a local paper had interviewed a guy that claimed to be there (and it was pure BS)! So much in fact, the paper wrote a retraction in the next issue. So I agree that a lot of BAD people are jumping in to look good.

    As for the Video...For what it's worth, all the money raised off the video goes to the NY FF Fund! Why? Because it was the right thing to do! It was something we did to help out with the little resources we had! So far we have sold 78 tapes.

    As for the pictures of the team, that too was not meant to be a "Hey look at me" it was to show our subscribers that MFN went to NEW YORK representing Maryland, not some Whackers trying to get a quick high! But in retrospect they could have been taken as "Glory Tripping" so they were removed!

    If my story offended anyone on this list or in the "Fire Service World" than I must apoligize. It was not intended nor written to be a Glory Trip for Me, My Team or my Company!

    However, don't think for one minute that I'm not proud of going there! I am very proud of my team and every person that went to Ground Zero! I met several professional Firefighters (From all over the Country) that went there for the same reason I did...."Because we just needed to be here!" Ask anyone that went! They'll tell you the same!

    In conclusion, I'm sure, no matter what response I post, my words will be turned around and used against me. So for what ever reason you have, stay safe and pray that this disaster NEVER BE REPEATED!

  3. #53
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    Southbronx,

    I'm just watching from the sidelines, you seem to have this all well in hand. Yeah, the 1st, 3rd, SOC and my 11th did "take it on the chin", but you lost as many brothers as the rest of us, didn't you?

    I've read the war stories. If you think back to the first week, not one FDNY brother spoke to the media, but there were a truckload of firefighter interviews. I just got tired of letting it **** me off.

    Someday this story will be told. There will be many versions. The only true story will be the one in your heart, not the one on your lips.

    Xellic, I must say, I'm a little suprised to see you here...you're on your own.

    [ 12-01-2001: Message edited by: E229lt ]

    [ 12-01-2001: Message edited by: E229lt ]


  4. #54
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    Xellic...

    First of all, thanks for having the stones to speak up for your outfit. You were probably caught up in the storm that was swirling without really knowing how it started. So I will thank you again for your appearance.

    However, there are some things you need to understand about this situation. Hopefully, this was a misunderstanding on your part, but you are dead wrong on more than one point.

    "...we just needed to be there!"

    Thats terrific that we were able to fulfill your needs. But the point you are missing is that its not about what you need... ITS ABOUT WHAT MY BROTHERS NEED! If you have to sit in your house, stare at the TV, and stew for two weeks.... THATS LIFE! The California Earthquake during the World Series a few years back made my little girl cry, but I didn't jump in my car and head that way.

    Your responsibility is to YOUR community, not OURS. Its one thing for the local guys to show up unannounced, but if every guy like you, within a 200 mile radius, that felt terrible, showed up, where the hell would we have been then? You make yourself available to us and then OUR bosses will decide if they need to call you or not.

    In times of crisis, you fall back to your basic responsibilities. If that involves answering a call for help from the FDNY, then get there as quickly as you can and do everything you can to help. If not, then protect your home, your family and your job. In both cases, you doing the same thing...YOUR JOB.

    I don't know if you know this or not but theyrecalled all off-duty firemen and cops in the city. Thats about 50,000 off duty members. You know where alot of them went? To the neighborhoods the are ASSIGNED to protect. Don't you think they "needed to be there"? They did their jobs and kept their mouths shut, because that is what our city needed them to do.

    So you showed up, you say with OUR best intentions at heart, so I will take you at your word. There are certain things you do and don't do in that situation. Leave the goddamn cameras at home. That doesn't sound the slightest bit disrespectful to you? We have no choice but to deal with the press and their games, but you should know better. I hope your job has not lost anyone recently, but if they did would you want us to show up and make home movies? And posing for shots with our tomb in the background is like a punch in the face to each and every one of us.

    If you want to raise money for us... sell T-shirts or hats like all the other stand-up brothers are. I guess the upside to your fundraising is that you have a handy little stocking stuffer for all your friends and family that have forgotten how wonderful each of you is.

    Also, whats with the text of the article? Again, I will take you at your word that all of the text was true. What could possibly be accomplished by naming my brother and describing his family tragedy for the world to read? He LET you into HIS world and that is the thanks he gets? It was bad enough that he was babysitting you guys when he wanted to be looking for his brother.

    The part about you and your crew finding body parts, "...tagging and bagging them" is pure buff horsesh$t. Again, if it is true, why describe it in detail? Could you think of a more RESPECTFUL way to describe it? How about not describing it at all? Oh, I forgot, you were doing it to EDUCATE the fire service. Do you honestly think there is a fireman in this world that needs you to tell them that there were body parts there? NO CLASS. God forbid one of our wives read that, or a friend of some deceased members...like maybe...me. What earned you the right to disrespect my brothers and their families?

    If you were troubled by "all the horrible things you experienced", and this is your way of cathartically dispelling it or "getting it off of your chest", I hope it worked. I also hope you learn something about how your actions affect other people. Next time, talk to your priest.

    As much as you may not want to believe this, it was not your tragedy, it was not your town, and they were not your friends. I realize that we are all brothers and that you may be hurt by our losses as most Americans are, but you deal with that by respecting OUR needs not YOURS. You offer support, condolences and you grieve. If you were truly concerned about us you would have taken off for weeks at a time to attend funerals, not to buff the Trade Center job.

    I know, I know...you were just coming to serve coffee. Good thing you brought all your turnout gear and cameras with you huh. Would have sucked to miss the job of the century. Just think how empty your life would be without the ability to say "...I was there!". But, thats what were are here for... to make buff fantasies come true and to help Americans deal with their feelings of helplessness in the wake of national tragedies.

    I guess the difference between your outfit and the guy from your hometown that told the bullsh#t story in the paper is that in your eyes you've EARNED the right to tell bullsh#t stories.

    Before you get ****ed, curse my family and say "... he's wrong, he doesn't get it!", take a second to remember, we live here, we were the ones you claim to have been helping and we are the ones you are hurting with your act. Unfortunately for you, in this situation, our perception of events is the reality.

    I started this message series in the hopes that the guys from around the world that meet here would get a view of things from our side of the fence. As I said before we appreciate all of the support we have gotten and love everyone that has travelled to our city to SINCERELY help us out. But you need to understand the effect that things like your website article and video have on the guys here who see them.

    If anyone has earned the right to do the things you are doing, it is my brothers that have lost everything and yet continue to keep giving all that they have. But you know what... it would never occur to one of them to do such a thing.

    [ 12-01-2001: Message edited by: southbronx ]

    [ 12-01-2001: Message edited by: southbronx ]


  5. #55
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    OUTSTANDING SOUTH BRONX, just outstanding. No other words come to mind.

  6. #56
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    Thumbs up

    I can't imagine ANYONE trying to "monday morning quarterback" a situation where two-110 story buildings come crashing to the ground. What kind of manual or textbook are some of these guys reading that tell them what the "correct" way would be to even think of approaching the scene that happened that day.

    We all have our stories of where we were that day. I work in the city and saw the first plane fly right by the window. I went to the closest firehouse and asked what I could do. The truck co. there were covering form Harlem. They stayed. They didn't leave their position even after it became apparent that alot of their brothers weren't coming back.

    When members of the engine and truck that belonged in the house started filtering in, covered in dust, tears in their eyes, " have you seen so and so" or "nobody has heard from the Lt."
    I realized this wasn't my place to be. As much as I wanted to help, I began to feel like I was intruding on something that had just turned very sacred.
    I don't even know what I'm trying to say. Go to funerals. Raise money so these guys kids have some sort of future, so they can see that the world over, firefighters take care of their own.
    Say a simple "how are you doing", the next time you happen to cross paths with a brother from the FDNY.
    To you, Southbronx, a sincere thank you and a heartfelt respect for the job you guys are still doing down there everyday, 24/7. I'm now working in a building right next to groung zero, and to see you guys still going strong, well, it's somthing to witness.

    God Bless
    Remember the Fallen

    P.S. to the guy from Maryland... STOP using so many damned EXCLAMATION points!!!!!!!!!!
    (sorry, had to get that off my chest,DUDE!!)

  7. #57
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    In response to the last message....

    My intentions were to help, no matter what people think. We were hoping to lend support while the 50,000 plus off duty members did the job of "removing thier own". As for the camera's, I know how you feel about them being in firefighters faces. This is something I have a problem with. Its tough to document a story, yet maintain the respect of your subject. So I guess I'll never be a reporter! If you look at the pictures you'll see that no close up's were posted.

    Lets clear up something RIGHT NOW! Regarding the Leiutenant "Baby sitting us", His name WAS changed to protect him and his family. Check it for yourself!

    When you say it's not my tragedy, I must disagree, I felt it like everyone else. In fact I did lose a friend (Citizen) working in the south Tower. Does that give me a right or permission to invade someones privacy to document this story? Nope! That's why we didn't!

    Look, I'm not going to try to bull**** you or anyone else on this list! We documented a story that was in our generation as big as Pearl Harbor. Did I go with my camera leading the way? Hell no! In fact we worked *2* in the compound before my camera ever left our vehicle. But when things quieted down, thats when I got the camera out and shot the destruction. In some peoples view, this was a monumental gathering of agencies from all over the world! That's something we all should be proud of! And it's something I know my friend would have love to have seen, but didn't!

    I have a question you! What gives Firehouse Magazine the right to run stories and pictures of the devistation as it happened? Tell me they waited until a certain time to run a story or didn't use AP (Assc Press) photos of firefighters crying and going through the motions days after the incident. Lets not pick on Firehouse, lets look and the others, Fire engineering, Emergency Mag, Ect. What gives them the right to run stories and show people at their worst. It sounds to me like its a double standard! They have reporters, photog's, assignment editors and Money making ideas, besides the ALMIGHT FREAKING TEE-SHIRT!

    We are a news agency, nontheless! We report on our community (Fire Service), just like them! And before you say, "Firehouse Magazine paid the price because they're in New York", well that my friend is bull****! They're making money hand over fist and don't think they're not! Just look and see what site your on RIGHT NOW!

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    I HAVE JUST FINISHED READING THE ARTICLE OF THE MFN MEMBERS WHO MADE THE TRIP TO NYC TO "WORK" AT GROUND ZERO, I MUST SAY I AM TOTALLY AMAZED AT HOW PETY SOMEONE CAN BE. I HAVE TALKED TO A FEW PEOPLE WHO WORKED AT GROUND ZERO , BOTH FIREFIGHTERS AND FEMA MEMBERS AND NONE OF THEM WERE THERE FOR THE GLORY, BUT TO DO A JOB. NOT BEING A FIREFIGHTER MYSELF BUT A FRIEND OF THE FIRE SERVICE MY HEART GOES OUT TO ALL THE MEMBERS OF FDNY DURING THESE PAST DAYS, WEEKS AND MONTHS SINCE 9-11. IF THESE MFN MEMBERS REALLY WANT TO HELP NOW IS THE TIME TO STEP FORWARD, TO ATTEND MEMORIAL SERVICES AND FUNERALS. IN EARLY OCTOBER I TRAVELED WITH FRIENDS TO ATTEND MEMORIAL SERVICES, ONE OF WHICH WAS IN ROCKAWAY, I WAS DISAPPOINTED AT THE TURNOUT, MUCH SMALLER THAN WHAT THE FF DESERVED BUT I UNDERSTAND WHY. IF ONLY THOSE "HEROS" FROM MFN TRULY CARED THEY MIGHT HAVE MADE A TRIP TO HELP BRING "CLOSURE" TO THE PEOPLE WHO REALLY NEED IT, THE FAMILIES AND FIREFIGHTERS WHO LIVED THE NIGHTMARE. I HAVE BEEN GOING TO NYC FOR OVER 20 YEARS AND HAVE ALWAYS BEEN TREATED GREAT BY THE MEMBERS OF FDNY. A SPECIAL THANKS TO THE MEMBERS OF ENGINE 314 "ON THE EDGE" IN QUEENS AND ENGINE 37 AND 40 TRUCK IN HARLEM FOR A PLACE TO STAY.

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    Yet another response....

    Just an FYI: The crews from MFN have attended several Funerals for the Firefighters. In fact, of our admin staff, at least half have made the trip, some several times!

    Can we all look at the REAL problem here! It's not MFN, it's the people that caused all this Bullsh*t to begin with! But just like good US citizens we crucify ourselves in the name of whats right! Lets hope those assh*les over the middle ast aren't reading these post's. This is what they love to watch and we're just falling right into it!

    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  10. #60
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    Amen to you South Bronx and thanks for all of your posts.

    MFN Firefighter or reporter? After reading YOUR article it appears to me you are more reporter then Firefighter which in my view totally discredits your comments of going to help Brother Firefighter's. I have not seen any evidence of Firehouse or Fire Engneering personnel posing on their websites or on the cover of any other magazine or news agency crediting their efforts of their own stories. Yes, they are there and they are reporting the stories of FDNY. NOT of themselves. Any reporting of specific details of any incident shouldn't be printed or video's made without permission of FDNY or any other jurisdictional Department to do so is disgraceful!!
    It is FDNY's incident period.
    They will share their story and the accounts of what happened when they are ready. After all they are the HERO's and the Victims of this Attack on our Country.

    GOD Bless FDNY and all of the Lost Brother's.

    Dave
    FTM, PTB, RFB.

    [ 12-02-2001: Message edited by: FF.1205 ]


  11. #61
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    FF1205.....You obviously haven't been watching the coverage. There were several stories written and produced with reporters in the limelight! And don't think for a minute that firehouse's subscription rate has gone through the roof since the incident, because it has! Just look at the past 3 months covers. As for me, I am a Firefighter. That job has and will always come 1st.

    You people are on this Major high right now and there's not a lot I'm going to do to change this. Lets get this straight, I do respect the brothers in NY City and I do agree this is their fight. My story was written about the NY City FF's and it backed up every FF in the city. The determination, the anger and the hurt. If that's a crime, from this REPORTERS view, Tough!

    I didn't go looking for fame and truly not fortune. But I went nonetheless and we helped and the treatment we recieved from the FF's (FDNY) and staff were fantastic!

    This is my last posting for this subject. Like I said before, my words will be turned around no matter what I say. So keep rambling and slamming my company and service. If it makes you feel better, maybe this is good therapy!

    And for the record, for the 2nd time, it's MFN not MSN. At least slam the right company!

  12. #62
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    SouthBronx....my hat is off to you Brother...your words are golden. To MFN....try as you might, your freelancing act at GZ could never be justified. There were thousands of firefighters, including myself who would have responded to NY in a minute, had the call came for help. You can sit back and scream that we're all jealous because you went and we didn't. You couldn't be more wrong. I'm proud of the fact that I was available to serve the citizens that I'm sworn to protect, and we made ourselves available in case the FDNY needed us.

    Here's a question for you....being a hell of a lot closer to the Pentagon versus NY...why didn't your "News" organization send one of your crack forces of super heroes there to help? I think we all know the answer to that one buff.

    In closing, we all appreciate your concern for not taking any "close up" shots as you put it of the devastation. You're a real credit to our profession.

    p.s. Loved the photos of you two geeks posing at GZ. SIMPLY MAHVALOS!

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    Talking

    PHILDABOX DO YOU HAVE ANSWERS FOR EVERYTHING?

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    There was a call for help, actually. That's why at Javits Center they had all Fire and Rescue Personell expediated through the sign in process and quickly transported to the scene. That's why when you got to Ground Zero with your turnout gear, they sent you right into it. That's why they had individuals assigned to organize volunteers. In the first few days of the operation there was still hope of life, and there was a huge demand for manpower, as the cranes and loaders could not access the scene as per the collapsed walkways. I realize that a lot of FDNY guys could not be there because they had to cover thier own fire stations. That is why I went down, and probably why others did. If my friends were there, alive but trapped, I would want someone qualified there to help in the rescue if I could not. Despite what many of you seem to think, I consider all firefighters my brothers. Sure, I may not have known that many of them that died that day, but does that mean it still doesn't hurt? Does that mean that I still didn't well up with tears when I saw the first tower fall and knew that there were dozens of FFs right there?

    You can criticize this guy from MFN all you want for his reporting style and video. I agree that the way he wrote it could lead someone to believe that he was doing it for the attention. So he's not a great writer, so what? He showed up to help, and as far as I can remember, there was no one at the gates saying "What exactly are your motives for being here?" Just because he is not FDNY does not mean that he doesn't have the same desire to help. He is a firefighter, he has probably seen a lot of the same sh.t you have, even though he is not FDNY, he has probably gone through a lot of the same emotions, even though he is not FDNY. Just because something happens outside of your local, does that mean you are not supposed to help if you can? There is an article on here right now about a FDNY guy in Hawaii who ventilated and searched a burning structure nearby. I am not in any way disparaging FDNY here, just trying to make a point. If you wanna bitch this guy out for his article, fine, but don't say that he had no right to be there. He may not have known them, but those were his brothers too.

  15. #65
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    Unhappy

    Man,

    I don't know whether to be inspired or discouraged.

    So, what am I supposed to do now, now that all the fundraisers are done and the media hooplah has died down? My listing wasn't called to help, so all I can do is pray for FDNY and all FFs who put their butt on the line.

    Bronx, since this is your forum, I need your advice. I've understood your perspective, but to see it put in words is pretty humbling. If prayers are what you need, you got it, man!
    We're all in this together. FDNY 9-11-01

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    Thumbs up

    All I have to say it Amen brother! I am mearly a youngin' in my dept. but I hear the message.


    God Bless FDNY

    We are all with you in our thoughts and prayers

  17. #67
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    Hey XELLIC, you still sound like a self serving, glory seeking ******e! You really want to do something to help the FDNY Brothers? Follow our Locals lead....we held a 'fill the boot drive' and collected $12,000 in 6 hours, sent it off to the 911 fund. Eight of our Brothers went to NY (from Seattle) and spent four days attending funerals and memorials, and guess what? Nobody wrote an article or had a news interview, they just paid their respects and came home. You live a hell of a lot closer than us...any of you "Heroes" been back since your "great save of NY" to REALLY help the brothers? If you truly wanted to help, that's fine, but why the articles and videos? That helps nobody but yourselves, and that, I believe, defines the term "self-serving". If you don't want to appear to be a true MUTT, why don't you remove your highly offensive article and post an apology? Ahhh, what the hell, you're probably a lost cause. Hey SouthBronx, if you ever get down to L21 give my regards to Paddy Cullen, we played football together when we were kids. I heard his Co. is having a rough time. Take care and best wishes, Brother.

    Dennis Kelly

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    [quote]our Brothers went to NY (from Seattle) and spent four days attending funerals and memorials, and guess what? Nobody wrote an article or had a news interview, they just paid their respects and came home


    You know what?

    Thats what everybody should be doing in their 'spare time'. FF's, cops, EMS personnel, or just the average citizen in the towns where the fallen lived and are being remembered.

    You want to " DO SOMETHING "?

    Pay respects to those who lost their lives doing their job, and who were in my opinion, the first casulties of this new war.

    [ 12-02-2001: Message edited by: toneloc177 ]

    May God bless all the people and families who have lost
    their lives on 9-11-01, to those also lost on Flight 587, and to the rescuers who responded to both.

    "I'm not saying it's right, i'm just saying (the way it is)."

    FDNY-EMS - Still New York's Best!

    e-mail always accepted @
    toneloc177@firehousemail.com

  19. #69
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    Southbronx,
    Great post, don't give this guy an inch. We all know exactely what he was trying to do and it is disgraceful no matter what his reasoning. The ONLY people to be telling the WTC story should be the FDNY......

    Also, this guy has sent me 3 nasty emails regarding his position on this, threatening to go to my Chief, MFing me, etc. Let me assure everyone that I am very scared and worried about this (Yeah right). It shows his true character. Like I said, I usually don't involve myself in these tiffs but this guy went way over the line in wackerism and it disgusted me.....

    Southbronx, if there is anything I can do for you guys from here in Pittsburgh, just let me know. We've been sending guys up for funerals and our local raise over $142,000.00 for you, but it just doesnt seem like enough for what FDNY is going through right now.....

    My prayers are with the FDNY,
    Jim Crawford
    James K. Crawford
    Assistant Fire Chief
    Midway Fire Rescue
    Pawleys Island, SC

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    Wow, going to your chief. That's a little petty. Thats's being a man.
    This space for rent

  21. #71
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    Southbronx.....To you (and you alone) I apologize.
    I have pulled the story completely from our site, and wrote an editorial to our 300,000 plus viewers. After reading these postings, I have read
    and re-read my story over 500 times. All I can say
    is, no harm was intended, we thought we were doing
    some good!

    http://www.mdfirenet.com/article.cfm?id=282

    To Mr Crawford....You forgot to mention you E-Mailed me 3 times prior to me threatning to go to your Chief! I didn't ask for your crap, nor did I e-mail you 1st. You brougt it on yourself...Talk about a Self proclaimed Biggot! Check out this guys website!

    To everyone else, take care and stay safe! And I'll see you in NY attending some more Funerals!

  22. #72
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    You know what?

    If you give a guy the benefit of the doubt and say to him " ...hey, these things bother us." you would expect him to say OK and move on with life. Our pal from Maryland, however, seems bent on justifying his actions and even goes so far as to thumb his nose at us in the process.

    I know you said you were done posting here because of the injustices you were faced with, but I feel quite sure you are still watching... so I will continue.

    Comparing yourself to an organized magazine or newspaper is quite a stretch. It also shoots holes in your " We really do give a sh#t" argument. Fire service magazines exist for the sole purpose of making money for themselves and providing entertainment for the readers. It may seem like they are your buddies, but if they were in it for your well-being solely, they would hand the things out.

    They, along with the rest of the press, feel that as Americans they have an inalienable right to take pictures of, and comment upon, anything they see in the public view. Whether we want them to or not, they will print what they want to print... a point that has been illustrated for us before. So I guess you ARE a journalist, because apparently you feel the same way.

    However, if you open the copies of the two big magazines and read their coverage, one thing is glaringly absent... "I" !!!! They speak in general terms to describe for the reader what was going on at the site, without delving into detail. They also dedicated large amounts of space to honoring the men that died, not themselves.

    But again, you are missing the point, they are journalists, you call yourselves firemen. We expect that type of behavior from journalists, they value themselves more than they do us. You obviously feel the same way, as evidenced by your exclamation to us in one of your posts that you were simply not a good writer and that was why it appeared that you were promoting yourself. You finished off that statement with a hertfelt "...if thats a crime, TOUGH!"

    Where do you get your balls? A member of the department you are offending tries to inform you that you are offending his job and the honor of his brothers, living and dead, by your actions, and you reply "...TOUGH!"? If thats the way 17 year firemen in your job act, then god help the kids who are trying to learn about being a TRUE fireman.

    Being a fireman "at heart" is not only about fire duty and taking in runs, its first and foremost about loving the men in your job more than you do yourself. THATS what seperates us from the common man and thats what should have kept your f*cking mouth closed and your camera at home.

    You said yourself that the treatment you received from the members of my job was fantastic, and somehow that proved that you belonged in our city at that time. Guess what... thats not what it meant. It meant that they were true gentlemen at their core, and extended themselves to you, even though they had just lost everything. So you carried that tradition on by selling them out when you got home and then telling them "...TOUGH!" when they pointed it out to you.

    If I thought that something I said or something I did offended a fireman who was hurting like my brothers are, I would change it immediately, and probably feel like sh%t for doing it...whether I meant to hurt them or not. But you somehow feel entitled to your own rights in this situation. Your loyalties are to yourself and your buff group.

    Just the fact that your outfit labeled the brother from PA, that alerted us to your presence, as "jealous" of you indicates that you feel that you have earned a special place or priviledge... even though you were just lurking in the shadows, performing good deeds, and then disappearing back into obscurity.

    I guess the reporter from Vanity Fair suddenly jumped from behind a mailbox, snapped a photo before you knew what happened and then fabricated a quote based on what he thought your friend would say. I say this because a group with the mission such as yours, (helping us and educating your readers at the same time), would never pose for such a cheesy, " I'm in there doing it Ma..." photo as that. How many copies of that did you snatch up, or did you just refer people to your purely EDUCATIONAL (no glory for yourselves) web site.

    I hope that you are the exception and not the rule for Marylanders... judging from the other replies I think that you are. Cal Ripken would be ashamed of you.

    PS Good luck with the letters to that Pittsburgh brothers chief. I'm sure when he finds out his man was dissing a certified hero, (with the pictures to prove it) (and video... autographed if you call now) justice will be swift and merciless. Boy, he sure F-ed with the wrong guy.

    BucksEngine,

    Where exactly did the call for help come from and who was it sent to? I respect the fact that you did what you thought a City resident should do, but the FDNY did not request that type of assistance. The only official request was for USAR resources, and of those only the dogs, listening devices and search camera people were extensively employed.

    The Javits center was a staging area for all resources, the people there were trying to organize the crush of converging volunteers. The FDNY and PD did the best they could to organize the thousands of men that showed up, rather than just letting them freelance, which did go on for a while.

    But if you read my earlier messages, I do not want to come down on those of you that did show up and do the RIGHT thing. I love you for your effort AND for doing the right thing when you went home.

    Certainly, I am willing to admit that although many of us do not feel that volunteers just showing up because they were hurting was the best thing for the operation, that doesn't absolutely mean it was wrong for them to do in everyones eyes. I am not willing to argue that belief at the expense of your feelings or the feelings of anyone else in your shoes. That being all the ones that did the right thing and deserve to feel good about it.

    My problem, and my brothers problem, is with the buff scumbags that are standing on the shoulders of the true heros so that John Q. Public will notice them and stroke their swollen egoes, while offering condolence to them only as an afterthought and a thin mask of their real desire... ATTENTION. And to the subspecies of that scumbag that has the balls to critique the manner in which our brothers operated.... before the job is even done.

    The same jerk-offs that were crying about how unfair that inappropriately timed, and rightly cancelled, memorial service and helmet rubbing party was, are some of the same ones spouting off their own theories and strategies that THEY would have employed had we been smart enough to ask them. All this while my brothers wonder if all 341 will ever make it home to their families, or will simply become a permanent part of Lower Manhattan. But I guess thats just "TOUGH!" for us.

    Oh and by the way....please don't anyone write my chief any letters. He's kinda new at his job and I don't want him to think he has any bad people working for him.

    [ 12-03-2001: Message edited by: southbronx ]


  23. #73
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    Upon completing the above message, I saw the one above it in which the spokesman for the MFN apologized if his actions in any way offended me personally. (you forgot my 11,000 brothers). On their behalf, I certainly appreciate and accept your apology.

    Although I admit that his previous responses to me were infuriating (you know how the Irish are), I respect the fact that he did retract his article and notify his readers of our concerns, even though he does not personally believe that what he did was wrong.

    I again want to state that my venom was not directed at the members that were then, and still now, trying to help out my brothers. But my love and my loyalty are to this job and the brothers in it first and foremost, and when I feel that they are not treated in the manner befitting them, I have no choice but to speak out in their defense... even if it means offending a brother from another job in the process. No personal ill-will was intended (ok, a little) and no hard feelings exist.

    I hope that we can let the MFN return to their daily lives, without fear of further computer based terrorism. But the rest of you posers are still fair game. ( I.E. mr. big shot-mouth-of-the-south-FEMA-barney with all the answers in one neat attempted Fire Engineering article)

    [ 12-03-2001: Message edited by: southbronx ]


  24. #74
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    Hey Xellic,

    How in the hell could you ever think ANYONE was on a friggin "MAJOR HIGH" over the horrors that have befallen this country and these comrades?

    "MAJOR HIGH"????? Christ almighty help us. Let me re-light your crack pipe for ya.

    THIS IS WITHOUT A DOUBT THE LOWEST OF LOWS THE FIRE SERVICE, POLICE SERVICE OR EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICE HAS EVER SEEN IN MODERN HISTORY, IF NOT ALL OF HISTORY!

    When you mentioned the words "my company", that pretty much explained it.


    PRAY FOR OUR FALLEN.

  25. #75
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    Thanks Sounthbronx.....Just clear up your last statement, "What about my 11,000 Brothers". In the last paragraph of my editorial it says,

    "To the NYFD members and my friend in (S) Bronx, please accept our sincerest apology if this story in ANYWAY appeared to be a "glory filled, self fulfilling proclamation." At no time was this the intention or result of the story. We know how hard it is for you to continue doing your job while wanting to recover your brothers. Every Firefighter in America is behind you 100% and we at MFN are no different"

    _______________

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