10-05-2000, 02:38 PM #1chiefjay4Firehouse.com Guest
What are your selectable gallonage nozzles set at for 1 3/4" attack lines?
10-05-2000, 04:49 PM #2MetalMedicFirehouse.com Guest
Orrville (OH) Fire Dept.
10-05-2000, 06:31 PM #3NUMBYFirehouse.com Guest
We use mostly smoothbore, but all trucks carry a preconnect 1 3/4" with a combination nozzle. All nozzles are set at 200 GPM.
Anything i say in the forums is my opinion and does not reflect my department or any organization i belong to.
10-05-2000, 06:37 PM #4P.P.Firehouse.com Guest
We have a Elkhart Chief 150-gpm at 50-psi on one 1 3/4" pre-connect and a Vindicator Heavy Attack 250-gpm at 50-psi on the other 1 3/4" pre-connect.
10-05-2000, 09:15 PM #5fireraFirehouse.com Guest
we use the i 3/4 TFT nozzle set to 125 gpm
10-06-2000, 08:10 AM #6F02Firehouse.com Guest
10-06-2000, 11:07 AM #7KEAFirehouse.com Guest
Question : What are your selectable gallonage nozzles set at for 1 3/4" attack lines?
F02: Great Post! You simply answered the question...no brands, model numbers, nothing more...nothing less!
For those who dont know...A select gallonage nozzle is one the the operator can turn a ring on the nozzle to change the Orifice size, which if the pump operator adjusts his pressures for this change in orifice size you will get more or less water depending on the direction your going with it.
Smooth bores are not select gallanage nozzles.
Fixed flow at a given pressure nozzles (150@50) are not select gallonage nozzles.
Automatics are not select gallonage nozzles.
Chiefjay4: During most of my travels around the country I'm finding that most of the departments using select gallonage nozzles they have them set at 125 and 150. Unfortunatly due to pre-connect friction loss not being factored in for the EP most of those nozzles never see the NP needed to achieve that flow. Check your flows with flowmeters to establish the proper engine pressure and you should be good to go. If you dont have access to a flow meter contact one of your local fire reps and have them bring one out for a demo. Hope that helps!
First Strike Technologies, Inc
10-06-2000, 11:23 AM #8chiefjay4Firehouse.com Guest
Currently we run the one selectable gallonage nozzle we have at 125. I used to run it at 95 for foam purposes, but i think from what i'm reading that i'll be better off having an extra 30 gpm than foam.
10-07-2000, 02:57 AM #9DDFirehouse.com Guest
We don't have nozzles with selectable gallonage rings. We do use our combination, solid bore, piercing, and Vindicator nozzles as selectable gallonage on a regular basis. It is accomplished by gating the nozzle bale or discharge valve, various discharge pressures, not considering head pressure changes, kinks in hoses, and using doors for hose clamps.
10-07-2000, 03:34 AM #10MetalMedicFirehouse.com Guest
This string has been an eye opener. I always thought everyone started at 95GPM and adjusted from there, usually dependent on how good your water source is. We have a FoamPro on our engine, so I guess we are still OK at 95GPM. However, I am going to start looking around at other departments in this area to see where they have their nozzles set at.
Orrville (OH) Fire Dept.
10-07-2000, 10:54 AM #11Halligan84Firehouse.com Guest
We don't use selectable nozzles, but have standard pump pressures that supply 185 GPM on the 1 3/4 and 325 GPM on the 2 1/2
10-07-2000, 03:39 PM #12Dalmatian90Firehouse.com Guest
Our selectable gallonage nozzles come out of the hose bed at 95gpm...but there also on our two trucks that don't make much fire attack (the ladder and hose tender/engine)
Main attack truck has a 1.5" line with a 65gpm fog/95gpm straight stream Rockwood nozzle and an 1.75" line with an automatic nozzle. Generally run pump pressures at the beginning while hoselines are being advanced in the 130psi range, giving the auto nozzle in our setup upto 130gpm output. Once things settle down and attack lines are in place, discharge pressure is boosted to 180psi giving us 180gpm to play with.
10-07-2000, 10:41 PM #13Capt. ZadaFirehouse.com Guest
No selectable gallonage or automatics are used here. I like a 15/16" solid bore knob at 50 NP producing 185 g.p.m. or for serious attack, the Heavy Attack Vindicator at 50 NP producing 250 g.p.m. Others like the SM-20 combination knob at 100 NP producing 200 g.p.m. These are all carried connected to 1-3/4" preconnected handlines. I would rather have the 50 NP with it's lower reaction forces than the higher kickback from the 100 NP. We haven't tried the lower NP combination knobs, yet.
10-08-2000, 04:50 AM #14Hosekey21Firehouse.com Guest
On our 1 1/2" lines we have ours set at 95 GPM.
Just one man's view from the flames.
10-08-2000, 04:04 PM #15FirehoseFirehouse.com Guest
Our department uses the Elkhart SM 20 and SM 30 break a part. Initial attack is at 130 GPM plain water or 15/16 pipe for CAFS.
10-16-2000, 12:33 AM #16BFD 210Firehouse.com Guest
We use a break apart nozzle with a 150gpm@75 fog tip and a 15/16"smoothbore underneath at 180 gpm. With 200 feet of 1 3/4" this allows the nozzleman to take off the fog tip on his way in without having to tell the pump operator anything because the pump pressure remains the same at 150psi. We have only had these knobs for about 6 months but are loving the advantage of using the smooth bore inside.Previously, We were using sellectable gallonage nozzles at 125 gpm.
Also a note about foam.
The critical rate of flow (the amount of water needed to control a fire in a given compartment size) remains the same even if you are using foam. The main benefits you receive from foam are in the overhaul process which is where you get your bang for the buck. I know this is off topic but it is important.
[This message has been edited by BFD 210 (edited October 15, 2000).]
10-16-2000, 01:18 PM #17LHS*Firehouse.com Guest
We use a Fallon tip.
We have 7 cross lays 3 x 400 foot and 4 x 150 feet.
The front bumper sports three 150 foot lines and ione 50 foot preconnect.
The rear bed has a 400 foot line and two 250 foot 2 1/2" lines with 500 to 1000 gpm tips.
CAFS is very sticky and used for all structure fires.
Foam allows conservation of water and reduces damage while speeding knockdown.
10-16-2000, 01:21 PM #18LHS*Firehouse.com Guest
Specially designed "Fallon Tips" by TFT allow handline flows from 2" hose to 350 gpm preconnects. Simply removing the TFT tip and a 1 1/8" and 1 3/8" stub tip awaits for another high flow option or a way to address large debris in the line. A 3/4 and 15/16 inch tip on the pistol grip can be swapped with the fog tip.
It would become the pistol grip when the smooth bore tips are in use. Smooth bores are normally used for CAFs operations. Barricade gel instantly turns water to Vasaline. The ultimate weapon for exposure protection. Spray once the home will stay wet for at least a day. Region wide mutual aid wildland responses requiring a selection of agents to save homes. Each rig carries 90 gallons of 1% AFFF which is the same as carrying 270 gallon of 3% or 540 gallons of 6% foam. The rigs have three Class A foam tanks with 70 gallons of concentrate. A 120 cu ft compressor and two foam systems are capable of flows from 10 gpm to 4000 gpm. They allow the rigs to produce water, Class A or B foam in low, medium or CAFS forms or any combination at the same time.
The foam tip makes 200 gallons of foam for every gallon of water that passes through.
CAFS is very sticky and used for all structure fires.
10-16-2000, 07:10 PM #19Dalmatian90Firehouse.com Guest
Ok, being nitpicky...but I've been that way on the internet the last few days...
I don't think Barricade turns water into Vaseline, since that's petroleum jelly and would burn quite nicely
But it does make a nice and sticky goo.
10-17-2000, 01:44 AM #20FyredUpFirehouse.com Guest
If the selectable gallonage nozzles you are using are the 30-60-95-125 gpm variety I would start at 125 and select less flow if appropriate.
If they are of the 95-125-150-200 gpm variety I would start at 150 and select up or down depending on the fire.
Selectable gallonage nozzles are good nozzles as long as the pump operator pumps the right gpm to meet the nozzle setting.
Take care and stay safe,
10-19-2000, 11:01 AM #21chiefjay4Firehouse.com Guest
We only use one selectable gallonage nozzle, everything else is auto/Smooth Bore. Some company's have been setting the variable gallonage nozzles at 95gpm for foam perposes. So I guess my question was does antbosy else follow this practice as a "first" line off for most residential fires? As I have said in other posts, I am not sold on the use of foam as a attack tool, if I had my choice between 150gpm and no foam, or 95 and foam, i choose 150gpm everytime.
11-07-2000, 05:12 PM #22CorvinFirehouse.com Guest
I agree! The comment from MetalMedic reminded me of a fire many years ago where an Asst Chief circled the building having nozzles turned down to a lowere GPM flow. So many BTU's of heat production will take so many GPM to overwhelm it. You can start with a lower flow but why bother. Use the needed flow amount immediately, EXTINGUISH THE FIRE IMMEDIATELY and use less water overall than if you play around.
Same with foam. A nearby dept uses a foam minipumper as a first attack unit on structure fires and has had some great success. They have also had situations where the smaller flow did not provide enough cooling ability and valuable time and water were wasted.
12-10-2000, 04:49 AM #23eyecueFirehouse.com Guest
You should have at least 110GPM at the nozzle to protect against flashover.
12-10-2000, 01:38 PM #24StaylowFirehouse.com Guest
The selectable gallonage nozzles we have used were locked into place at 200 gpm's. Most companies generally use, and I prefer, smooth bore nozzles. As far as what number to set your selectable nozzles, I would rather have more gpm's available from the beginning than to come up short and have to adjust to catch up.
12-10-2000, 11:01 PM #25ENGINE 52Firehouse.com Guest
The selectable gallon nozzles that my dept. uses are set at 150 g.p.m. on the 1 3/4 attack lines.
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