09-30-2000, 11:07 PM #1Firefighter2197Firehouse.com Guest
what are your ideas on why so many ff are dying
why do you all think that so many fire fighters are dying
10-01-2000, 12:22 AM #2SCAFDEXPFirehouse.com Guest
Truthfully, I think it has to do with firefighters being undertrained. I know many volunteer departments have much difficulty finding manpower, and when trainings are held, few often show up. No one wants to come to the trainings, but everyone is rip-roaring ready to go when the tones go off for a fire, so people are getting into situations that they may not have the proper training for. That is my personal view on many of the LODD's.
Swartz Creek Area Fire Dept.
"FireFighters Walk Where The Devil Dances."
[This message has been edited by SCAFDEXP (edited October 01, 2000).]
10-01-2000, 03:50 AM #3TMFirehouse.com Guest
For my Senior Project I chose the dangers of firefighting and talked about some of the reason that there have been so many LODD. Shortage of Manpower, with LAFD that was the case the BC's have staff assistanst but due to budget cuts they were taken away. Bad decsion making, Who knows?. If you wish to read my findings send me your name and home adress along with state and zip to my e-mail TMacias@Firehousemail.com and I'll send you a copy of what I found out.
10-02-2000, 10:49 AM #4blockhousebusterFirehouse.com Guest
because they deserve it !!!
10-02-2000, 12:28 PM #5HFDExplorChiefFirehouse.com GuestOriginally posted by blockhousebuster:
because they deserve it !!!
10-02-2000, 05:10 PM #6kellyreliefFirehouse.com Guest
blockhousebuster this one's for you and I hope that you read this. If by any chance you are a firefighter. Do yourself and the fire service a tremendous favor right now, go to your station and turn in your gear and quit, retire, whatever and never set foot in another firehouse for the rest of your life. I will be in Emmitsburg this weekend honoring all the fallen brothers and sisters that gave their lives in the line of duty. Where will you be ?
Your comment was inappropraite to say the least! I would like to see you come with me this weekend and tell the families when they receive the flag that their loved ones died because "they deserve it !"
10-03-2000, 12:11 PM #7SCAFDEXPFirehouse.com Guest
Totally uncalled for. Are you even in the fire service at all? I personally think you must just be some yahoo looking through these posts, becuase there is no way anyone in the fire service would be posting things like that. And if you are in the fire service, I agree with the previous post, go to your station and turn your gear in, because you are of no use to us. And find somewhere else to post your negative, completely out of line comments, because they are un-welcome here.
10-05-2000, 02:44 AM #8RDWFIREFirehouse.com Guest
Let's ignore the comment from blockhousebuster. IDIOT! There are many reasons why firefighters die each year. Training (or lack of...) inexperience, building conditions, traffic accidents,...I could go on forever. What we need to concentrate on is a common sense approach to responding, firefighting, returning to the station and responding in our own vehicles. If we use a little common sense, and "take our own pulses first" (in other words....CALM DOWN) prior to jumping behind the wheel or the nozzle, we just might cut down on the losses we experience every year. We will probably see firefighters die forever. Let's just take time to think about what we are going to do BEFORE we do it. Maybe the life we save will be our own, or our partner's.
Be safe. The dragon lurks!!!
10-06-2000, 04:06 PM #9GLVFD FFFirehouse.com Guest
I think we're having more apparatus crashes because there almost all automatics!! (automatics might keep your eyes on the road more but it also keeps your foot on the gas)
WITH EVERY STEP FORWARD THERE A STEP BACK!!
10-07-2000, 12:00 AM #10wlfdtr12Firehouse.com Guest
I agree that blockhousebuster's comment was uncalled for and a disgrace. I don't know about anyone else on this forum, but I attended the memorial service on December 9,1999 with over 1,500 other firefighters from Connecticut. I walked those streets with the over 30,000 other firefighters from around the world. And you want to tell me that they deserved it. No. No one deserves that. They did their job and tried to save a life. That's what this job is all about. Helping people. When firefighters die in the line of duty, they're doing that for a reason, to help somebody. It's usually a stranger, sometimes even a neighbor. But we do it day in and day out without even a second thought. We dedicate our lives to saving others and get absolutely nothing for it except for the satisfaction that one less person has been hurt or killed by fire. When we lose our lives, we've paid the ultimate price and we deserve a lot more respect than that. Obviously you aren't in the fire service or else you wouldn't have said that. Maybe you should have been on those city streets seeing all of those people from Worcester thanking us as we walked through their city. There wasn't a dry eye anywhere and we didn't even know these guys, but we knew what they did and why they did it. Most LODD's happen for a variety of reasons. Lack of training, unsafe conditions, mechanical failure, and overreaction are just a few. As a fire service we just need to stop and think about these things. We need more training on firefighter safety, more pre-planning and more money for grants for thermal imagers. RIT teams need to be practiced and advidly used. We need to start to take our time and calm down at scenes. Many people overreact and cause accidents, whether it be in their vehicle or at the scene. Some times it's even due to unsafe conditions of buildings. But those are the risks we take every time we perform. We can't tell what's beyond that next corner or behind that next door. We have no choice over the matter, but we can decrease the possibility of serious injury happening by just thinking straight. That's just how I feel and I know other people feel different, but I'm sorry if I offended anyone. I just needed to contribute my thoughts and feelings.
Anthony D. Ruggiero
Windsor Locks Fire Dept. Exp. Post 50
10-07-2000, 10:01 AM #11Halligan84Firehouse.com Guest
We have been at 100 =/- firefighter LODD's for the past few years. The stats really haven't changed much. Most of the deaths are stress related. Heart attacks. Since most of us don't have regular physical performance tests, etc... (the osha respirator exam wont' filter out much)
Then comes responding and returning. We still have people with no seat belts, losing control way too often, just generally poor driving. I think if we got some of the older, less safe rigs off the road and had effective driver training across the board we could make a real dent in the numbers. Fireground deaths due to the fire itself continue to make up a smaller percentage (but much more publicized) of the LODD's. The emphasis in the past 5 years on FAST, RIT, Saving our Own is evidence that we are paying attention there. The 2in/2out rule is another example.
10-09-2000, 11:24 AM #12Firefighter2197Firehouse.com Guest
as the person who started this post thank you to all who posted their thoughts on this message board
why any one would say that they deserved to die eludes me. as a second generation firefighter I love the fire service but when fire fighters die I stopm and think why my self and my father do this. even when the people who kill fire fighter geyt off the hook scot free we still put our lived on the line to safe people who will probley sue us for ripping holes in their roof to make sure the fire is out
thank you and god bless
keep it safe and have fun
10-10-2000, 09:35 PM #13squad 1335Firehouse.com Guest
HAY BLOCKBUSTER GO TO HE@# YOU SICK BAST@#$
XENIA FIRE CADTS COMPENY#29
10-10-2000, 09:54 PM #14TristinFirehouse.com Guest
i personaly belive that most acidents with firefighters are just that acidents no matter how well trained you are fire can change from relitively safe to killing you in seconds i think that it is sad but it is something that firemen will never be able to get away from
Orcutt Fire Department
Explorer post 2335
10-11-2000, 09:22 AM #15smokeeater51Firehouse.com Guest
Nice post, however I have to disagree with the idea that a lot of the LODD's are result of lack of training. Halligan84 hit it dead on the head. Look in the line of duty section of Firehouse and you will see that a large number of firefighter fatalities are due to AMI's...heart attacks. The other percentage are traffic accident related. Firefighters now are offered the best training that money can buy. I will say, however, that volunteer firefighter deaths can be related to one other thing besides AMI's & response accidents......lack of experience. Guys, experience and training go hand in hand. A lot of vollies have the training, but lack the experience to associate it with.
A far as blockhousebuster's comment goes, he is ignorant, insensitive, and rude. I hope he reads the responses to his comment, and realizes just how spineless and sacless he really is. I pray that he is just a "surfer" who found his way into our wonderful community of real, dedicated, selfless individuals, and that he isn't on a department somewhere. No firefighter, or firefighters family deserves to be put through such a horrible experience. I too went to honor our six fallen brothers in Mass, and follow up on every item that comes up about it in the news. I cried in Worcester, and I cried again when I returned home to my wife and daughter. It is a very sobering experience and I hope that I never have to do it again.
Take care, stay safe, & stay low.
Lt. Mike Spinney
Rollinsford Fire & Rescue
10-17-2000, 08:39 AM #16augdog11Firehouse.com Guest
I think the heat stress issue is the major factor in the fire service today. I think that eatting a good diet and staying fit contributes to lowering this risk. but not always..Not to trash anyone or be an old dino, but the gear is different also.. bunkerpants and coats hold in the heat as well as protect you from the heat. You end up like a hotpocket in a microwave.. compare that to a long coat and hipboots and the heat isn't trapped as much. I'm not saying to quit wearing bunkers or go out and buy hipboots right away. not the case. just think about the amount of work you are doing in the heat and in your gear. don't over exert yourself.. went it's time for a break take one.. that's another thing.. how many take a break when they really need one.. they say oh i can go a little bit longer..
you get the point..
*Leather forever*Dead cow on my head before a plastic salad bowl*
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