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  1. #21
    dalittle
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Tom:

    You think your wife is rather attractive?

    Only RATHER attractive??

    Boy oh boy, I hope that she's not reading this board - for your sake - or that's the last time your're gettin' any!

    Be REAL careful abouth this stuff, last week my wife accused me of having an affair with something yellow that sees through smoke.


    david


  2. #22
    IRalltheway
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    The horse is dead, but I will respond to S.Cook.

    Do you think that I work for flir because I'm 100% for hands free and I feel that the microbolometer is far superior than the BST? The only camera on the market that fits that description is the fireflir, I wish thier were more options. All of my posts have been for hands free and all for the microbolometer. Almost every person that post a topic or reply on this board favors one paticular TIC, right. So, they must all work for the TIC that they favor. I have made no sales pitches and have said several times any TIC is better than none. As far as what features were available on the firerflir last year. I have no idea, but I have done a lot of research on all the companies that sell TICs because I want to make sure they will be around for years to come. I looked at the flir web page about 8 months ago to see some of the other products that they manufactuer that use the microbolometer and they have been doing temperature measuremnt for a long time. I think David Little will agree. So, my guess is that they could have done it, but like anything else it takes engineering, design, and time. All TIC manufactuers have features coming up that they will release when they want, that's called business. It's our job as consumers to buy at the right time and make sure we don't get screwed. Take a look at all the fire departments that bought Bullards and MSA two or three months ago. I bet they would have waited if they knew that microbolometer system were coming out.


  3. #23
    S. Cook
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Good coverage of the assumed points IRALLTHEWAY, but you danced around the question like you were trying out for Swan Lake.

    So I'll ask again - do you work for FLIR in any way, shape or form? Yes or no, simple as that.

    The question or answer has nothing to do with how you feel about hands free or handheld. I've said several times in my posts to try all of them and get what's best for your department. If that's how you feel and that's what you're using then I'm all for it for you.

    If you're curious, I do not work for Bullard, I'm just an end user.

    And at present, I would not trade the BST based imagers we purchased for a microbolometer - I've only seen 2 I like (to be fair I haven't seen the new MSA yet). I'm sure there will be a time in the future when I will, but just not now.

  4. #24
    IRalltheway
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    NO!!

  5. #25
    S. Cook
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    Ok, just wondering.

  6. #26
    nj_lawyer
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Exclamation

    "What a difference a year makes."

    That quote says a lot.

    First, my belief is that having a TIC is better than not having one. I'm fighting the uphill battle at my volunteer company of getting one on every engine. (We will purchase (or get freebie)first unit in next 60 days.) I can think of a dozen instances that due to driver availability or engine availability, our "first due" piece was not "first due." How often do the crews think to get some piece of equipment off another engine before responding? I also think that a TIC should be mounted in the cab rather than in a box in a compartment. When I am grabbing tools, I'm not pawing through compartments and opening boxes, its grab and run. That's why we have quick release mounts for tools and crosslay hoselines. --- HEY MANUFACTURERS: How about crew cab mounts???? only ICC offers one that I've seen.

    Second, BST vs. Microbolometer should not be the deciding factor in your decision.

    UNDERSTAND THIS: In thermal imaging, BST and Microbolometers are both OLD TECHNOLOGY. However, they are the only imaging technololgy available for the fire service. There are several existing and developing technologies that are better and cheaper. It will remain to be seen if they are adaptable to the fire service.

    Don't base your purchase decision on sales representations. Look to see if the unit is in service or is from a company with a history. Buy a unit that you feel comfortable with. Last thing you want to do is buy the "latest" unit with the best "bells and whistles" and have the guys not use it because its awkward or uncomfortable.

    Personally, if a manufacturer or rep won't bring it out to the burn building because other TIC's will be there, I would not buy that unit. What are you afraid of.

    We had a microbolometer unit out at station and when a neighboring company showed up with their ArgusII, the microbolometer guy started packing up. Why? When you put the two units side by side, the Argus had a much clearer image. But, the Argus didn't have a 180 degree swivel which some guys liked. (Personally, I like the Bullard, Scott, ICC style units which you strap on one hand and crawl with best).

    Anyway, there's my soapbox. Manufacturer reps, feel free to argue some more.

    ------------------
    Nothing stated in this post has been approved by or is the position of my employer or VFD. It is only my opinion.

  7. #27
    jerseyfire
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    The way I look at it is we become passionate for what we use. From day one, I wore Scott Air Packs, Globe Turnout and our department had twin 1970 CF Mack Pumpers. To this day, thatís what I like. (now Iím into our Pierce trucks)

    Likewise when firefighters are exposed to some piece of equipment that they like or are willing to put their trust in, they become passionate about it. These cameras are no different. As a firefighter and a salesman I have come to put both my personal safety and my professional reputation into the camera I sell.

    The last volley between two forum members above represents this passion. IRalltheway is obviously impressed by FLIR and itís features, while S. COOK is a fan of Bullard, because thatís what they use. At least weíre learning from these posts and getting what I believe is good information out there.

    Better to argue Microbolometer vs. BST than Coke vs. Pepsi or Bud vs. Coors. I think the fire service has come a long way.

    p.s. Ė Hey Scott which guy are you in the GALLS catalog, right or left?


    ------------------
    Rob Donnan
    Captain, Metuchen FD
    President, Jersey Fire & Rescue

  8. #28
    S. Cook
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Post

    I'm the handsome one with the big water-head holding the imager - on the right as you're looking at it. I haven't seen my royalty check from Galls yet either.

    While I am a Bullard fan, I would not recommend anyone go out and buy one because of what I (or anyone else) say; or, for that matter, buy a TIC based on what anyone says. I honestly believe each department should do their own evals and our opinion was based on the evals we did.

    In fact as technology progresses, we intend to continue to eval what's out there (we've seen most of them) and if switching brands or moving from BST to microbolometer would significantly benefit us, I'll be the first one to suggest it.

    nj_lawyer says it best "Last thing you want to do is buy the "latest" unit with the best "bells and whistles" and have the guys not use it because its awkward or uncomfortable."

    Also when I drank, it was Bud.

    [This message has been edited by S. Cook (edited March 15, 2000).]

  9. #29
    nj_lawyer
    Firehouse.com Guest

    Smile

    Glad I'm being accused of "saying it best" when I just thought I was ranting....

    Personally, I'm a Guiness drinker, but then free beer is kinda like NJ's free TIC, hard to argue against.....



    ------------------
    Nothing stated in this post has been approved by or is the position of my employer or VFD. It is only my opinion.

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