10-14-1999, 03:41 PM #1benson911Firehouse.com Guest
What kind, if any, residency requirements do you have to work for your FD? Is this an issue with your membership? is this an issue with yourself?
My department requires me to live within a 15 mile radius from the city center, a 15 mile circle drawn on a map represents the distance. No one has stepped outside the limits, but at least three members are right on the line.
Some communities around us require residency within the city limits, which their membership hates, and others only require the State of Ohio.
I know of some union brothers who would love to have information from any local who has eliminated or expanded their residency requirement. One community near me allowed their FF to live anywhere they wanted, after the membership showed how their pay was not high enough to afford to live in the community (and they are paid well!)
10-14-1999, 04:23 PM #2WRENCHFirehouse.com Guest
IN NJ THERE IS NO RESIDENCY REQUIREMENT,ONLY THAT YOU LIVE IN STATE. THERE ARE A COUPLE OF EXCEPTIONS. FIRST, GENERALLY WHEN TAKING AN ENTRANCE TEST FOR EITHER CIVIL SERVICE TEST OR NON CIVIL SERVICE, MANY TOWNS SPECIFY BEING A RESIDENT AT TEST TIME AND APPOINTMENT TIME HOWEVER ONCE YOU ARE HIRED THEY CANNOT REQUIRE YOU TO STAY. THERE HAVE BEEN MANY TIMES WHEN TOWNS HAVE TRIED TO PASS LEGISLATION TO CHANGE THIS BUT AGGRESSIVE LOBBYING BY FIRE AND POLICE HAVE BEAT THIS DOWN. ALSO NOTE THAT ONLY POLICE AND FIRE ARE EXEMPT FROM RESIDENCY IN THIS STATE. ALSO IF YOU LOOK IN A DIFFERENT FORUM, FIREFIGHTER FORUM , THERE IS ALREADY A DISCUSSION IN PLACE ON THIS TOPIC
10-14-1999, 11:21 PM #3benson911Firehouse.com Guest
Sorry about the extra thread - it seemed appropriate for the Career/Paid forum.
Thanks for the response.
10-15-1999, 01:14 AM #4Ed ShanksFirehouse.com Guest
I think the thread is appropriate here, too. It's assumed that a volunteer or part-paid or call firefighter will live either in or very near his/her district, otherwise there'd be too much response time and the accompanying danger of being involved in a wreck with some clueless cranial/anal exchange recipient.
Here in Boardman, Ohio, thanks to our Civil Service Board's and township administration's decree, we must live within the boundaries of Boardman Township. We can't even live on the other side of the street on the streets that make up the boundaries!! I believe that as long as I'm where I'm supposed to be at 8 am (our shift change) they have no business telling me where to live. Especially whe I can buy twice the house for half the money a mere two miles outside of our boundaries! But, I want the job, so here I am! When I retire there'll be a nice 3-bedroom brick ranch for sale here!
10-15-1999, 10:22 AM #5Hammerhead338Firehouse.com Guest
The city I work for requires us to live 5 miles from the city limits, and you have 6 months to do this after you have been hired. If you get a letter from the city administer saying its ok, you can live farther then that out, but there has to be a good reason for it. The reason for this is we are a small dept and if we get a big call it wont take the off duty so long to respond to the fire.
I agree that there is nothing wrong with your last thread, this is the place to ask those kind of questions. Be good and safe.
10-18-1999, 07:39 PM #6akelloggFirehouse.com Guest
My department is a full time paid organization. Any person hired after June 1986 is required to live within 26 air miles of our main station. The reason for the living restriction was the department was well understaffed and they needed off duty people to cover the stations during calls. We have tried to get rid of this for many years know without luck.
Just recently it became an issue again. Currently one firefighter who is required to live within the restriction is living about five miles out of the circle and a second is considering violating the restriction. The one has not been questioned yet and states when and if he is he will fight it.
We wanted to try and prevent any action so we asked our union reps to discuss the exclusion of the restriction from our contract with the City's negotiators. We used the argument of the low frequency of callbacks for large incidents, the use of newer,updated auto and mutual aid agreements and that we have lost good people in the recent past because the cost of living is lower outside the restriction . The City said all we need to do is write a side letter defining what we are requesting and they have no problem with it. What a difference 13 years makes!!!
We are currently writing the letter and it will go to council in the very near future. I don't know why the arguments worked this time but maybe this will help you.
[This message has been edited by akellogg (edited October 18, 1999).]
10-21-1999, 05:21 PM #7WTFD730Firehouse.com Guest
We have residency requirement here in Toledo,Ohio FD. All city employee's must live within the City of Toledo.
10-25-1999, 10:01 PM #8MFDffcFirehouse.com Guest
We have a 10 mile residency, with our chief getting his jollys on firing a guy who did not move within 6 months of employment. The State Supreme Court handed down a ruling on a Wheeling police officer in the same boat, and the firing was upheld.
Here you must move to within 10 miles within 6 months of employment, but you are on probation for one year in which you can be terminated at just about any time, doesn't seem fair huh?
10-26-1999, 12:03 AM #9FyredUpFirehouse.com Guest
No residency at all for us. As it should be. All that matters is you are there when your shift starts.
Residency is nonsense. The real reason for it is a false notion you should spend your money and pay property tax where you work.
11-03-1999, 10:08 PM #10E7engineerFirehouse.com Guest
I work for a County fire department. There is no requirements for residency. We have firefighters that live 2-3 countys away. There is some Muncipalities that have requirments. One is thirty miles from there main station. That could mean that you could live in the next county, and still work there.
11-12-1999, 01:02 PM #11sefd114Firehouse.com Guest
On our department we have to live within the district boundaries. Most of our full-time firefighters want to have this restriction lifted.
[This message has been edited by sefd114 (edited February 01, 2000).]
11-12-1999, 03:32 PM #12INDY FIREFirehouse.com Guest
In Indy we are suppose to live in Marion County (Indianapolis) or one of the 7 Countys bordering Marion County.
11-13-1999, 09:45 AM #13mfgentiliFirehouse.com Guest
Must be a city resident to be hired and remain a resident for four years. After that you may live within 15 miles of the city limits.
11-13-1999, 12:55 PM #14benson911Firehouse.com Guest
SEFD114 - Jackson Township, Ohio Firefighters were able to get their residency restriction lifted by comparing their pay to the average housing cost in their district and it was not enough for them to afford to live there. It worked for them, try it. Collective bargaining is a wonderful thing, I would investigate setting up an IAFF Local right away. Just contact the IAFF or another local near you.
mfgentili - I'm surprised the city can restrict its applicant pool to residents of your city only. Don't they want to attract the best recruits from your whole area?
11-13-1999, 04:01 PM #15mfgentiliFirehouse.com Guest
I agree with your assessment of getting the best applicants from the area. However, a city ordinance retricts new hires to city residents and it's only our collective bargaining agreement that allows us to move after four years. We are lucky in that most city employees other than police and fire must remain residents for their entire career as a condition of employment. In order to attract qualified applicants, the city must sometimes offer annual residency waivers to some of these other employees. This means a majority, if not two thirds vote of the city council, every year. What a pain that would be. As far as attracting applicants for the fire service, we have very little problem locally. All appointments are done through statewide civil service exams and the applicants standing on the eligible list. Position on the list is determined by test score and any preferences that apply such as military veteran or being a child of a Massachusetts firefighter killed in the line of duty. Credit for previous firefighting or related training or certification is added to test scores utilizing a predetermined formula for experience. Massachusetts state law pretty much determines how we select candidates, however, communities are allowed to enact local residency requirements through home rule petition. This is an entry level position we're talking about here and I feel that the way we train and lead our new members, regardless of where they live, will determine if they will be good employees or not. We currently have a list of around 400. Another test is to be given in April, 2000 which will establish a whole new list. This happens every two years. I have posted a topic regarding this in the "Employement" section. Hope this is beneficial.
11-17-1999, 12:07 PM #16jrj918Firehouse.com Guest
on my department residency is stated as: to fill out and turn in an application you must be and must have been a resident of vanderburgh county(EVANSVILLE IN) for at least 6 months prior to submitting your application. After you get hired and i believe after your 1 year probationary period the residency changes to any of the 3 surrounding counties in INDIANA(we are bordered by kentucky to the south of us).
I think this requirement might be changing though.I have hear talk about some poeple who want to get on are fighting to change it
11-22-1999, 03:42 PM #17Chief TaylorFirehouse.com Guest
My Full-time Fire Dept: Residency is not required mainly due to the current number of local FF'rs around Town.
My Volunteer Job: residency is not required, but we have created Two programs to accomidate this. A NON-Resident and a resident Volunteer firefigher program.
11-29-1999, 09:39 PM #18Truck 2Firehouse.com Guest
The city of Lancaster, Pa. requires you to live in the city one year prior to to testing. Once your hired you may live 15 air miles from center city, most of our 86 firefighters live outside the city. The city offered us to live anywhere in the county under a new contract offer that we voted down and are still negoiating. Our3 year contract runs out Dec.31 1999
12-03-1999, 08:34 AM #19Lieutenant GonzoFirehouse.com Guest
Personally, I think that residency requirements are a bunch of bovine scatology.
I don't think that someone in need of our services care if we live in the city or not.
I have a friend on the Boston FD that will not take the exam for promotion because he will be required to move back to Boston. He was grandfathered in when they set up a residency requirement, but they treat a promotion the same way as a new hire.
12-10-1999, 12:44 AM #20YFD911Firehouse.com Guest
I also agree that residency is garbage. The dept I work for in Youngstown Ohio has residency n the city limits. There is a bill in the State senate that would make residency requirements by municiple organizations illegal. My question however is, how does that play into a city that has a charter type govt. Does state law over rule a charter or is the charter over powering since the issue is voted by the people? Any help woould be appreciated since nobody really seems to know.
12-10-1999, 12:12 PM #21benson911Firehouse.com Guest
YFD911 - It is my understanding that municipal charters can be more restrictive than state law, but not less restrictive...so residency may be allowed by charter. I don't know what Ohio bill you refer to, can you let me know the number so I can look it up. I know the Akron Fire Department members want to know about this bill!
12-10-1999, 12:14 PM #22EXJAKEFirehouse.com Guest
We have a limit of 15 miles from town lines but aren't bothered if we're a little over. It's all politics anyway, if the right people ask at the right time they can get anything except money
My brother and I, as well as about twenty others were born,raised, and educated in our home town but can't afford to live there.
We have proved it's not a problem to live outside town by our daily attendance and response to call backs for mutual aid and other emergencies.
Boston jakes have always lived as far away as Cape Cod and they've been doing the job for years by cooperating with each other on scheduling reliefs.
Between politics and contracts you can do it if if enough of you want it.
My town hired people from outside from a layoff list and they never went back. They still live where they used to work and work where they have never lived!
12-11-1999, 03:07 PM #23YFD911Firehouse.com Guest
Benson911 and all Ohio firefighters. The Bill that is in the Ohio State Senate is S.B. 46. If you go to the Ohio Senate web page you can browse by bill # and read the entire bill. It is supposed to be voted on in the next few months.
12-27-1999, 06:49 PM #24EdFirehouse.com Guest
Our city was the only one for many years to have a liberal residency requirement of aprox. 9 miles from city center. This is for all represented city employees. All department heads (Chiefs, Administrators, Heads of department types) have to live in the city boarders. Recently one other department next door allows their employees to live in a boardering community.
I know of some departments that have no residency and some have absolute. Good luck, personally I think residency for anything sucks, Imagine a major corporation telling employees or the C.E.O. that they have to live in the city where the company is.
12-29-1999, 07:48 PM #25D. AndersonFirehouse.com Guest
We overturned our residency requirement this past year. Some of the city's representatives actually had the gall to say we would try harder on calls if we lived in the city! They also tried to say how much tax money the city would lose in the "mass exodus" that would result if the city lifted the requirement even though vacancy in the city is only 4 percent. I can only think of three people on the department moved out of the hundreds that can.
Unfortunately they still require you to be a resident of the city to try out and for your first six months of probation. We now only get about 400-600 people who try out when it used to be more than 4000 before residency. They insist this isn't affecting the quality of the people who are hired though.Right.
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