1. #1
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    Default ANOTHER F.L.S.A. QUESTION.

    OUR A.R.F.F. PERSONNEL ARE BEING MANDATED BY OUR CHIEF (AS PER F.L.S.A.) TO ATTEND LIVE FIRE TRAINING IN CORPUS CHRISTI WITHOUT PAY OR ANY OTHER TYPE OF COMPENSATION (EXCEPT FOR TRANSPORTATION,AND HOTEL)
    AS HE ADVISED IF AN OUTSIDE ENTITY REQUIRES TRAINING OF PERSONNEL THE CITY DOES NOT HAVE TO PAY.
    HOW CAN THIS BE FOUGHT?

  2. #2
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    Seems to me that if he is making it a requirement of your employment, they must/should pay.

    Are you talking about live ARFF fire training or live structural fire training?
    Member IACOJ - Building crust and full of lust...

    "It's okay to to scared, just don't be chicken." - Clark

  3. #3
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    THE REQUIRED TRAINING COMES FROM THE FEAERAL AVATION ADMINISTRATION (THE OUTSIDE ENTITY) SORRY FOR NOT ADDING THAT

  4. #4
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    Hi:

    Take a surf through the US Dept of Labor website. I think you'll find that as long as the employer knew or should have known the employee(s) were taking part in the training, it is considered work time and they must be paid accordingly.

    Typical municipal attitude...the city wants the benefits of the training, but not the expense.

    Since the Feds mandate a minimum wage, does your city bill the Feds for it?
    http://www.dol.gov/dol/public/regs/main.htm

    [ 08-20-2001: Message edited by: 9C7 ]
    Stay Safe.
    You asked for my opinion, now you have it. Any similarity to another opinion, living or dead, is purely coincidental.

  5. #5
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    What does your contract say? Situations like this are a negotiable item in a contract. If you do not have a union with a chief like this maybe it is time to look into it.
    IACOJ

  6. #6
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    FORTUNATLY WE DO HAVE CIVIL SERVICE AND COLLECTIVE BARGAINING( UNION TOO! )
    WE DO HAVE A "ME TOO CLAUSE" IN OUR CONTRACT AND ARE FIGURING OUT WHO IS BEING SENT TO CLASSES AND BEING PAID FOR IT, LIKE P.D. OR SOME OTHER DEPARTMENT, BUT OTHER IDEAS WOULD BE GOOD FROM THE OTHER STATES

  7. #7
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    If your department is mandating that you go in order to perform your job, then they have to pay your for it. If the class is optional, and is not required then they do not have to pay you for it.

    I.E. If you work on an ARFF unit volunterily and this training is only manditory if you work on this unit they may not pay for it.
    However, if your department is required to provide ARFF certified people to staff certain companies, and they need you to be trained, then it would be up to them to pay you for your time.

    Don't get cheated. The key to this is, if you don't take the live fire training, is the department going to be penalized by the FAA? If so then I think they are trying to pull a fast one and cut some overtime out of the budget at your expense. Good Luck
    The opinions posted in these forums are my own, and do not represent my department.

  8. #8
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    Good question.

    FLSA states that training time is compensable time EXCEPT for either one of the following reasons:
    1. The training is required by a law of a "higher jurisdiction" as a condition of employment
    2. For all the following reasons:
    - Time spent training is outside the normal working hours.
    - The employee must not perform any other work during the training
    - It must be strictly voluntary
    - It is not directly related to the employees job.

    From what you have posted it appears as if the requirement is the FAA's. Therefore it is required by a "higher jurisdiction". If it is a condition of employment then the time is not compensable according to the law. It may be compensable if your contract says that it is but not by FLSA.

    I'll try and get you section and paragraph numbers later so that you can check it out yourself. I don't presently have my reference material with me.

    Sorry, it probably wasn't what you wanted to hear but that is the law.

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