Emergency Lights for Vol FF/EMTs

[S8ER95Z]

No wonder there is so much volly bashing. I know this last page is a joke, but man you guys are keeping a straight face enough to fool this newbie....

I have a red disco light that I pickd up about a month or so ago when I joined the department and only used it one other time, at night when directing traffic on a corner.

I used it again last night for the second time because we had a power line down and this is a very dark road. The engine could not get to my side of the line in a reasonable amount of time due to the live wire across the road so I wanted to have something red and flashy on the corner we were at. Incase we wanted to dance.

I have a bag with turnout gear in my car, as I live 8 minutes from central station. A flashlite in my pocket, and a knife. I have a FL and knife with me all the time anyway. Anything else I need will come on the rescue or engines.

I will be honest, I have miniphantoms in the rear deck and one under the front mirror. I got them as a kit for Christmas several years ago but live fairly close to the station so I rarely use them. I have used them to direct traffic when we problems with a brush truck we were using and had to pull it from service and I've responded a couple times from out of town but found them to be of little use since no one yeilds to you anyways. I keep no turnout gear but do have a pair of gloves (for EMS) in the car just in case. As you said everything I need is on the apparatus so turning my car into a rolling christmas tree isn't going to make the world a better place anytime soon.

Simply put I am not against lights in POVs... but I believe there is a time and a place for thier usage. Just because someone is asking about lights doesn't automatically mean they are a whacker IMHO.

[Cappy05]

So just in case....

Ky ... Fire service and EMS RED/Red and White w/ siren and lights must be visible from the vehicle 360 degrees. Siren must be audible for 1 mile (I think that is the minimum) . Blue lights are reserved for police officers. Amber for road workers, I have never seen green in our state.

[whfd hems 930]

Pros, cons, officers, non-officers, US Senator, Mary Jo at the corner store, povs, fire apparatus, police cars, meat wagons(ems ambulance), John Boy's tractor, my sons go-cart, Red, blue, amber, green, clear, purple, chevy engine orange, sky blue pink with purple poka-dots, siren, bell, exhaust whistle, pa system with an ipod and mp3 siren files( been there, done that), bike siren, air horn, lean out the window and yell "move", the list goes on, and on, and on.


Here is the thing, no matter what we say, we are wrong, in at least one persons eyes, but there is the thing, the President of the United States has lights and sirens, so we all need to live by his example, and light 'em up.

Just my opinion, so beat away, as the horse has done like the Phoenix, and has risen from the burnt ashes.

Sorry, had to do it.

Stay safe out there, and if you are privileged to run lights, remember that it is just that, a privilege, so don't mess it up for the others.

[XRaysJL]

Here is the thing, no matter what we say, we are wrong, in at least one persons eyes,

I agree. Too often, too many people think in absolutes. People often forget that different areas have different situations. One rule can not fit for every situation.

[GTRider245]

Just my opinion, so beat away, as the horse has done like the Phoenix, and has risen from the burnt ashes.

Thanks to you, so has this thread.

[DennisTheMenace]

Here is the thing, no matter what we say, we are wrong, in at least one persons eyes, but there is the thing, the President of the United States has lights and sirens, so we all need to live by his example, and light 'em up.

Actually his USSS Protection Detail, Federal LEOs, have lights in the car they use to haul his butt around in.

[KanFireman]

I just run across this thread and figured since nobody else from the Four by Two State mentioned the laws here lights. If I recall correctly any combination of red white blue and amber for emergency response vehicles. Siren must be used with Lights while vehicle is in motion, LEO are exempt from the siren part. I can't remember but I think tow trucks are red and amber only. Traffic regulations may disregarded when Emergency lights are in use, but must be operated with due regard to the safety of public, tow trucks are obviously excluded from that part. Lights must be visible 360 and siren must be forward facing. There used to be a part about where a siren may be mounted, but can't remember if it still applies. The use of lights on POV's is regulated from top down starting at county level, i.e. the County first has to allow their use, then City if applicable, and final approval by Chief. My department doesn't have to answer to the authority of a municipality per se, since we are a fire district. The Board of Directors and the Chief do have to listen to the County Commission, though. Around here most of the Counties allow light use, but the individual departments don't. My Department allows their use, but only two guys use them.

[KanFireman]

I finally found the statutes for Emergency Vehicles

Chapter 8.--AUTOMOBILES AND OTHER VEHICLES
Article 15.--UNIFORM ACT REGULATING TRAFFIC; RULES OF THE ROAD
8-1506. Authorized emergency vehicles; rights, duties and liability of drivers thereof. (a) The driver of an authorized emergency vehicle, when responding to an emergency call or when in the pursuit of an actual or suspected violator of the law, or when responding to but not upon returning from a fire alarm, may exercise the privileges set forth in this section, but subject to the conditions herein stated.
(b) The driver of an authorized emergency vehicle may:
(1) Park or stand, irrespective of the provisions of this article;
(2) Proceed past a red or stop signal or stop sign, but only after slowing down as may be necessary for safe operation;
(3) Exceed the maximum speed limits so long as such driver does not endanger life or property;
(4) Disregard regulations governing direction of movement or turning in specified directions; and
(5) Proceed through toll booths on roads or bridges without stopping for payment of tolls, but only after slowing down as may be necessary for safe operation and the picking up or returning of toll cards.
(c) The exemptions herein granted to an authorized emergency vehicle shall apply only when such vehicle is making use of an audible signal meeting the requirements of K.S.A. 8-1738 and visual signals meeting the requirements of K.S.A. 8-1720, except that an authorized emergency vehicle operated as a police vehicle need not be equipped with or display a red light visible from in front of the vehicle.
(d) The foregoing provisions shall not relieve the driver of an authorized emergency vehicle from the duty to drive with due regard for the safety of all persons, nor shall such provisions protect the driver from the consequences of reckless disregard for the safety of others.
History: L. 1974, ch. 33, § 8-1506; L. 1977, ch. 43, § 1; July 1.

Chapter 8.--AUTOMOBILES AND OTHER VEHICLES
Article 17.--UNIFORM ACT REGULATING TRAFFIC; EQUIPMENT OF VEHICLES
8-1720. Lamps and lights on authorized emergency vehicles; alternately or simultaneously flashing head lamps. (a) Except as provided in subsection (b), every authorized emergency vehicle, in addition to any other equipment required by this act, shall be equipped with signal lamps mounted as high and as widely spaced laterally as practicable, which shall be capable of displaying to the front two alternately flashing red lights located at the same level and to the rear two alternately flashing red lights located at the same level, or in lieu thereof, any such authorized emergency vehicle shall be equipped with at least one rotating or oscillating light, which shall be mounted as high as practicable on such vehicle and which shall display to the front and rear of such vehicle a flashing red light or alternate flashes of red and white lights or red and blue lights in combination. All lights required or authorized by this subsection shall have sufficient intensity to be visible at 500 feet in normal sunlight. Every authorized emergency vehicle may, but need not, be equipped with head lamps which alternately flash or simultaneously flash.
(b) A police vehicle when used as an authorized emergency vehicle may, but need not, be equipped with:
(1) Head lamps which alternately flash or simultaneously flash;
(2) flashing lights specified in subsection (a), but any flashing lights, used on a police vehicle, other than the flashing lights specified in K.S.A. 8-1722, and amendments thereto, rotating or oscillating lights or alternately flashing head lamps or simultaneously flashing head lamps, shall be red in color; or
(3) rotating or oscillating lights, which may display a flashing red light or alternate flashes of red and blue lights in combination.
History: L. 1974, ch. 33, § 8-1720; L. 1975, ch. 39, § 21; L. 1989, ch. 43, § 1; L. 1991, ch. 41, § 1; L. 2005, ch. 18, § 1; July 1.

Chapter 8.--AUTOMOBILES AND OTHER VEHICLES
Article 17.--UNIFORM ACT REGULATING TRAFFIC; EQUIPMENT OF VEHICLES
8-1722. Vehicular hazard warning lamps; warning lamps on police vehicles; trash trucks. (a) Any vehicle may be equipped with lamps for the purpose of warning the operators of other vehicles of the presence of a vehicular traffic hazard requiring the exercise of unusual care in approaching, overtaking or passing.
(b) Every bus, truck, truck tractor, trailer, semitrailer or pole trailer 80 inches or more in overall width or 30 feet or more in overall length shall be equipped with lamps meeting the requirements of this section.
(c) Vehicular hazard warning signal lamps used to display such warning to the front shall be mounted at the same level and as widely spaced laterally as practicable, and shall display simultaneously flashing amber lights. On any vehicle manufactured prior to January 1, 1969, the lamps showing to the front may display simultaneously flashing white or amber lights, or any shade of color between white and amber. The lamps used to display such warning to the rear shall be mounted at the same level and as widely spaced laterally as practicable, and shall show simultaneously flashing amber or red lights, or any shade of color between amber and red. Such warning lights shall be visible from a distance of not less than 500 feet in normal sunlight.
(d) Any police vehicle, when used as an authorized emergency vehicle, may be equipped with warning lamps mounted as widely spaced laterally as practicable, either inside such vehicle in front of the rear window or on the roof of such vehicle, and capable of displaying two alternately flashing amber lights to the rear of such vehicle. Such warning lamps may be used in lieu of or in combination with any other vehicular hazard warning signal lamps used to display such warning to the rear, and shall be visible from a distance of not less than 500 feet in normal sunlight.
(e) Every truck designed and used for collection and disposal of domestic or commercial waste or trash shall be equipped as provided in subsection (c) and shall operate such lamps when collecting or transporting waste or trash and traveling 15 miles per hour or less.
History: L. 1974, ch. 33, § 8-1722; L. 1975, ch. 39, § 22; L. 1978, ch. 39, § 1; L. 1981, ch. 45, § 1; July 1.

Chapter 8.--AUTOMOBILES AND OTHER VEHICLES
Article 17.--UNIFORM ACT REGULATING TRAFFIC; EQUIPMENT OF VEHICLES
8-1738. Horns and warning devices. (a) Every motor vehicle when operated upon a highway shall be equipped with a horn in good working order and capable of emitting sound audible under normal conditions from a distance of not less than 200 feet, but no horn or other warning device shall emit an unreasonably loud or harsh sound or whistle. The driver of a motor vehicle when reasonably necessary to insure safe operation shall give audible warning with his horn but shall not otherwise use such horn when upon a highway.
(b) No vehicle shall be equipped with nor shall any person use upon a vehicle any siren, whistle or bell, except as otherwise permitted in this section.
(c) Any vehicle may be equipped with a theft alarm signal device which is so arranged that it cannot be used by the driver as an ordinary warning signal. Such a theft alarm signal device may use a whistle, bell, horn or other audible signal but shall not use a siren.
(d) Every authorized emergency vehicle shall be equipped with a siren, whistle or bell, capable of emitting sound audible under normal conditions from a distance of not less than 500 feet and of a type approved by the secretary of transportation, but such siren shall not be used except when such vehicle is operated in response to an emergency call or in the immediate pursuit of an actual or suspected violator of the law, in which said latter events the driver of such vehicle shall sound said siren when reasonably necessary to warn pedestrians and other drivers of the approach thereof.
(e) Every truck specifically designed and equipped and used exclusively for garbage, refuse or solid waste disposal operations shall be equipped with a whistle, bell or other audible signal. Such whistle, bell or other audible signal shall be used only when the driver of the truck is backing such truck. Notwithstanding the provisions of this section, a city may adopt an ordinance prohibiting the activation of such whistle, bell or other audible signal during specific periods of time during the day.
History: L. 1974, ch. 33, § 8-1738; L. 1975, ch. 427, § 40; L. 2004, ch. 114, § 2; Apr. 29.

I also found out while trying to find these that all members of an official fire department have the legal authority to arrest an individual for violation a lawful order, only while they are acting in official capacity, but they can't carry a firearm unless they are already an authorized law enforcement officer with appropriate training.(Code Enforcement/Fire investigation) Oh, and tow trucks can only operate their lights while stationary and the regulations don't specifically address sirens for tow trucks so I interpret this as them being allowed, but what is the use of operating a siren only while a vehicle is stationary. I know there may be a time, but the situations aren't very numerous and if you can think of one, then odds are there already is going to be fire truck or police vehicle present that already has one. For instance on the Federally-Funded Highways, State Troopers are everywhere. Whenever we have a decent accident by the time we're ready to leave there are more Troopers present, just watching us to make sure us and their accident reconstruction team don't get injured, than there are Firefighters. Which adds up to a lot of cars.

[looneym86]

In Arkansas, as far as I'm aware, POVs may have red, white, or amber lights. Blue lights are restricted by state law to police due to the "Blue Light Rapist" incidents in the early 90's. My department will actually pay for a light bar and siren on your POV. Of course, this equipment belongs to the department, so you can't keep it if you leave. I purchased a dash light and traffic advisor from Extreme Tactical Dynamics for my 2000 Blazer. They are LEDs, which move traffic well, and will be helped when I get the siren installed. They were also about 1/3 of the cost of other name brand lights.

[washinton_05]

Does any one know the law/rules for a light in an POV for the state of VA??
I am a volunteer EMT in that state.

Thanks

[CaptOldTimer]

Does any one know the law/rules for a light in an POV for the state of VA??
I am a volunteer EMT in that state.

Thanks

Check here --- http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...+cod+46.2-1061

[BVFD_LT2]

Here in the not so great state of NY we are allowed blue lights with no siren unless your a chief you get red lights and siren. with that being said i live close to my station so i rarely use mine unless traffic is bad because i have to cross a major roadway well at least a highly used roadway. Also as an emt i carry all my gear with me (both fire and medical) due to my stations protocols that allow me to go straight to the scene of any rescue call. any type of fire call only chiefs go directly to the scene, but thats how my station does it every station is different. and as stated earlier on this page te what type of blue light should i get or who uses a light or any other thread like that has been beaten to death over and over again.

[MonkeyBiz]

I have red lights and siren on my truck.

[Jonnee]

I have red lights and siren on my truck.

Good for you. Learn to operate that truck with some sence!

[cdw32]

Metal medic,

I am new to EMS in Ohio and i have heard 10 different rules and regs about POV lights. Is there anyplace i could find a hard answer to the question?

Thanks,

Cdw32

[Jonnee]

Metal medic,

I am new to EMS in Ohio and i have heard 10 different rules and regs about POV lights. Is there anyplace i could find a hard answer to the question?

Thanks,

Cdw32

The Ohio Bureau of Motor Vehicles has a code that reflects on this.

Check it out.

[PaladinKnight]

Call the Ohio Dept of Public Safety

[hwoods]

Is there anyplace i could find a hard answer to the question?

We're about as Hard as You can get. Or call 1-800-Ask-A-Fireman...........

[Jamcdear]

Here in Virginia, we have some of the strictest POV laws in the country. Volunteer firefighters and EMT's are allowed to have either all red or red/white lights, and NO sirens in their POV's. We are only allowed to have up to 2 lights max and they can only be facing one direction (in the front facing forward.) We are not allowed to have grille lights, light bars, take down lights, headlight/tail light strobes or headlight wig wags. Blue and red/blue lights are used for PD only. You are also required by state law to obey ALL regular traffic laws while responding POV. You can't break the speed limit, run stop signs or go through stop lights, even if you come to a complete stop first to look and see if anyone is coming. If any police officer sees you running emergency and even speeding just a little bit, they will more than likely pull you over. All of these requirements are the same regardless of your rank. (Chief's and company officers aren't allowed to do anything extra than what firefighters can do.)

In Virginia, POV lights are defined only as "courtesy lights" which means that people are not required by law to pull over for you. However most people see you running emergency and are pretty quick to pull over and let you pass. (At least from my personal experiences.) But again, they aren't legally required to. The POV laws are pretty heavily enforced by local and state PD's and other local fire officials and company officers. Some departments in my county allow their members to have lights immediately and other stations you have to wait one year before being allowed to have lights and your state issued firefighter license plates. In Virginia there are 2 kinds of firefighter license plates, professional/career firefighter plates and the volunteer firefighter plates. You do have to show proof that you are a firefighter at the DMV in order to get these license plates. (You typically either have to show your department ID or a letter from your chief clearing you to get the plates.) Usually it's only the volunteers who have POV lights, but there may be a few career guys who have them.

Hope this information helps! Stay safe out there!

J.A.M.
Volunteer Firefighter
Roanoke County Fire & Rescue
Roanoke, Virginia

[Jamcdear]

Here in Virginia, we have some of the most strict POV laws in the country.