1. #1
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    Cool Tradtional style helmets

    My department just got a new Chief and we are changing a lot of things, one of which will be our style of helmets. The rank and file want Ben Franklin II helmets and the chief agreed upon this. Two of us have Benny II's already, one other guy has a Carins 1010. Our Assistant Chief does not like the tradtional style helmets and says that the back of the helmet hits the SCBA tank so you can't look up very good. We have new Scott 4500 SCBAs and I have yet to have a problem with my helmet hitting my SCBA. I have tried and cannot do it.

    My question is has anyone had a problem with this before or hear of this happening? Any input whatsoever would be a great defender!!

    Thank you!
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    Lt.Jason Knecht
    Altoona Fire Rescue
    Altoona, WI

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    If you have the weight of the Scott pack sitting on your hips and rear end instead of your shoulders, the pack will sit lower on your back.

    If you do this right, you will take alot of weight off your shoulders and allow yourself to look up without hitting the bottle.

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    I have a Cairns 1000R, same as your 1010 but different material. Anyway, I have had my helmet hit my Scott bottle before, but nothing that takes away from my mobility or visibilty. Besides that, I just love my traditional helmet, and it will have to be pried from my dead hands to get it away from me!!!

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    I would go with the Ben II. I had a Cairns 1010 and it does hit the SCBA cylinder when pulling ceilings, etc. I got a Ben II and the brim is shorter. No problems with it at all.

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    I have a 1010 myself & although we use MSA packs I'd have to agree w/ Adze.

    If you wear the pack down low then you shouldn't have a problem.

    I've never had my "lid" hit the SCBA Bottle while looking up or crawling. I used to have that problem a lot w/ a "salad bowl" helmet, then I was told/shown that I was wearing the pack too high (hey what did I know then?? It felt o.k. to me).

    Anyway - that's my story and I'm stickin to it.

    Give up my 1010 ?? Only for a Cows Butt
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    our department just recently switched back to traditional helmets. we have the ben II's and i love mine, we were just given the approval to put bourkes on them as long as we keep our goggles with us. no problems with hitting the pack, but then again we are still in the stone ages with our steel 2.2 scotts. after five years in a yellow turtle shell they will never get my black traditonal back ever!
    Last edited by postal79; 02-08-2002 at 10:43 AM.
    9/11/01 forever in our hearts

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    Dickey,

    You said your department is trying to agree on helmets. Well when they do agree are they gonna sale the old ones because i am very interested in buying any fire helmets and would be intereted in purchasing all. Either post a response or e-mail me at firefighter1361@firehousemail.com

    Thanks
    Matt

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    Aren't you supposed to look up with your eyes instead of your neck?

    I had this problem when I first went with my 1010. However after being shown how much better it is to wear the weight of the pack on your hips (not to mention it allows rescuers to use the airpack straps easier to pull you out if you have a problem) it ceased to be a problem. Just mention to the A/C's that have a problem with the longer bills that it will help prevent embers and scalding water from going down your collar.

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    If the brim hits the bottle once or twice, I don`t think it`s that big of a deal. We`re phasing out all our Metros, and getting Ben 2`s. I`ve never heard anyone complain about the bottle problem, the only things I really hear about them are good. Mine is sitting in the chief`s office waiting for a shield....

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    Hey Matt,

    We will be phasing in the new helmets, replacing old ones that break or whatever with the new Bennys. We currently have Bullards which are about as good as a screen door on a submarine. They are so junk! They crack around the edges and near where the helmet insides attach to the outer shell. Wearing my Benny is as comfortable as a baseball cap to me. Now we have a Chief that is asking our opinions and saying that we will have to wear them so we should know what is best.(at least for now anyway.)

    Matt, if we get rid of good ones, I shall let you know. I'm sure you could get them very very cheap!!!!

    Thanks guys.
    ____________________
    Lt.Jason Knecht
    Altoona Fire Rescue
    Altoona, WI

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    Default helmets

    YO Jason,

    Now, I haven't been around that long. But, lets just say that I started my career being issued an MSA-Plectron! WHEW!, by todays standards, that is a scary deal!

    I think that I've worn near all of them by now. In the '80s, there was a big push to get away from traditional helmets. OSHA issued some regs and NFPA, while staying officially mum, stated its concerns about broken necks from falling debris. The p$ss-pot lid types were the new generation helmets and the vendors were pushing their sales. Well,we were despirate to get out of those ole Plectrons (they are only good for display, post melting my first one, my second now retires on the shelf), so then, we went to the Cairns pots. After a couple of years of this, none of my partners or I could wait for a new chief so as we could get back in a traditional style.

    So,here's my two cents. I am a firm believer in a firefighter developing their own system. I, like others here and after years of hearing and teaching, "cinch it high and tight", ride my pack lower on my back, fairly loose and across the hips {teased that I wear it like a sack of potatos lol}. This is not only most comfortable, it affords better mobility and reduces the helmet hitting the tank. Yes, I've had trouble with tank strike while hooking ceiling, but it's more a nuisance than a hindrance. Also, I've hit my tank when crawling about in a fire and "looking up." But, I must say, that if you have the need to crawl, there isn't much up there to see anyway!

    I wear a Cairnes N880 and was fortunate enough to have the foresight as to purchase several when they were available. I'm on my third one. Love the way it feels and the service that it gives. However, now it is not OSHA, NFPA approved as there is no inner helmet (i.e. skull cap). My loop hole is that when the 880 was manufactured and sold/bought, it was compliant, therefore it can be worn. We have many Cairnes 1010s and several Classic 1000 (the short lived predessor to the 1010). The guys love them and they are good helmets. I am bias, but I don't like the high center mass on the 1010 and its bulky feel. There are some leathers around (I have one of them too) and most are good, but, cost prohibitive. I have the same center of mass complaint with them, plus they are heavy(ier)! The Bullards {?}, I concur with you in that they are the Chevette of helmets (Bullard and Chevrolet, this is ONLY my opinion!). I've been evaluating the new Paul Conway traditional. I like its agile, adjustable suspension system and it can be adjusted to sit really well on the head even in all of its bulk. I am sure that it will be determined to be a quality product, but, only time will tell. Your option of the Benny II, it's a fine helmet and I feel that you'll be most satisfied.

    The U.S. fire service is steeped deep with traditions and the traditional helmet style is one. That cry rings loud and clear from most personnel. There is no mistaking that one is a firefighter when wearing the traditional. With the new NFPA eye protection requirements, we can go back to Bourkes and use our goggles, HOORAY! There are benefits and draw backs with any equipment. The one that your Asst. Chief cites is trivial in the scope of things. Also, if something strikes your helmet bill hard enough to snap your neck, ahem..."big red truck"... the bill ain't the problem!

    Manufacturers noted the calls for a good traditional and reinvested their efforts to produce them. They shortened and reshaped the rear-bill and improved their technology as to reduce complaints such as your Chief's (now you know, that white helmets are "brain-suckers" lol}. Most of the name brand "pots" on the market are good helmets. However, like most of you, I want only a traditional symbol of pride riding with me!

    be safe,
    Truck Co. 9...the bone breakers

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    I went form a turtle shell to a Paul Conway.
    I love it. It is comfortable a little heavy, but
    man it is comfortable. I would recommend the Paul
    Conway to anyone. It is great and not real expensive.

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    Jason,

    thank you very much when you phase them in and get rid of broken or etc. helmets i would be interested i dont care if they are good or bad shape i would still like to purchase them if you would let me know when you get rid of em.

    Thanks
    matt

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    I had a little trouble going from the turtle to the New Yorker...wearing the pack lower fixed everything. My leather is starting to get a little beat and should be retired soon so I have been thinking of a benny. any thoughts

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    truckiedog,

    I think the Bullard is more like the AMC Pacer of helmets!

    Living the dream...

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    Talking Tailboard

    LOL Tailboard!!!

    Quite the coincidence that you should mention this, but I had initially typed "Pacer" instead of Chevette! Then, went back and changed it. There are so many young posters on this forum, that I was afraid I'd get all kinds of email asking what is a "P$sser?"... LOL.

    As for your statement, I can't agree with you more. Thanks for reading...
    be safe,
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    Soar free our Brothers and Sisters.

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    What is AMC?
    Thanks for the email truckiedog...I will check out the Paul Conway
    Last edited by blackleather; 02-12-2002 at 08:24 AM.

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    Most of the youngsters will only know AMC as the local movie multiplex...After having a variety of helmets issued and purchased with my own cash over the last 18+ yrs. I have to agree with the majority. Bullards and Chieftain salad bowls although light, leave a lot to be desired in protection. If you have to go with new style stay with the Cairns. I have purchased 2 Metro 660C's used and they are far more stable than these new lightweights. I asked for and was given a Ben IIw/ bourkes and goggles for Christmas and will never give it up.(Gonna try and get leather bunker boots for Father's day) It is the most comfortable and not that much heavier than the Metros. Be sure to look and try on whichever one you decide. What feels great on my melon might not be a good fit for you especially the goggles. There is a difference between the ESS and the Paulsons. The leather fronts add to the tradition.

    Be safe .

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    Hey Truckiedog, thanks for the comments. I respect the word from the "more experienced" guys. I don't want to say older because I am now at a crossroads myself where I would be considered the "older" guy at the station. Again, thanks for the the good comments.

    Hey, AMC Means American Motor Company. They made one or two types of cars, one was the Pacer. This was as popular as the Ford Pinto and about as embarassing to drive. That's what my older brother says anyway, he had a wood panel Pacer!!! (God that's funny)

    And to whoever was looking at the Benny II, they are as comfortable as wearing a baseball cap. You can adjust the inside "skull cap" to fit as high or as low as you wish. Also it fits much better than any other helmet I have worn. Very user friendly.

    Again, thanks for the great information guys, much appreciated.

    Keep your head down and your powder dry.
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    Lt.Jason Knecht
    Altoona Fire Rescue
    Altoona, WI

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    Talking

    I had the same problem, had the old style and when I looked up, I hit the scba, however I started to wear the tank lower, "we have the smaller bottles, i think there the 4500 anyway I was given another old, but newer to me helmet, and yes the brim is shorter in the back. So I dont hit the tank LOL

    FYI, Im still new to this so please don;t flame me....
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    Default I have A

    Cairns & Brother 660c Metro Firefighter Helmet
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    this could be it ?> So for now Darth .,.............you can go fly a kite ......got the point ?
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    This is it oh my god this is it oh no it isnt
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    Default Do your own research

    If you are definate about "traditional" so be it but look at the newer styles too, lots of other choices out there, make the dealers work for your bucks, try out the ones that interest you/your members. Good luck with your research.


    Hey guys, you forgot the Ford Maverick and the Chevy Vega. LOL
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