1. #1
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    Default Driver's Licenses? (GDL?)

    In my state (New Jersey) the government recently created the "GDL" or Graduated Drivers' License program. What this is basically, is the same restriction on drivers under 18 that some other states have. (AKA a "Cinderella" License) Drivers under 18 are not allowed to be on the road between midnight and 5 AM and they cannot have more than one person (other than family members residing at the same address as them) in the car with them. The only exceptions on the time restrictions are for those with a certain type of note from an employer or religious authority stating a valid reason that they are out.

    That said, the problem I'm having is that under this new law, even on the weekends when my post SOPS say I can respond at any time of night, I can't drive to the station! Now, don't get me wrong, normally I would just ignore it and go anyway, but my parents are being really gay about it and whining, moaning, and threatening because they think there are a bunch of consequences (like points or FURTHER license restrictions) that I'm convinced just don't exist. Now, the only legitimate concern I can see is the one keeping me from telling them to go to heck: consequences with the insurance company. It's not like any cop in this town would pull me over going to a fire call (they all know me and my dad's firefighter license plates), but my parents are worried about what would happen if someone hit me, or if, God forbid, I hit someone (which I keep swearing won't happen: it's only a couple of blocks to the station).

    So anyway, here are my questions:

    1) Does anyone know if a Fire Company Explorer qualify as under these new laws as an "employee?" If you can be exempted by a religious authority for community service why not Explorers? The chief and the other officers don't want to put the fire company at risk by writing me one of these letters if they aren't allowed to. Is this situation just maybe something the legislators didn't consider?

    2) Does anyone know what the consequences are in NJ? The only thing I've been able to find is a $100 fine. Nothing about points, license suspension, or possible insurance consequences.

    3) Does anyone else have anything gay like this to contend with in their state? I'm the first one in our post to have this problem, so we don't know what to do. Another problem I just remembered: what if I sleep at the station or somehow get there in the middle of the night and everything's already out? Without a letter of exemption what kind of risk am I putting the fire company in if I drive one of our marked fire company support vehicles to the scene (without warning devices because I'm a minor, of course).

    Does anybody know anything about this stuff? I think this is all pretty effing homosexual if you ask me and it only serves to make my G-d d-mn life effing hard. This is the gayest law our state has done since the bike helmet law (which really chapped my ***** at the time). If you know anything, please help. All I wanna do is help my f-cking community, come 'on now it can't be this hard.

    Oh well, I guess I'll walk/run to the station at 3 AM until we get this figured out or I go find the guy who originally authored this law and seriously consider punching him in his ignorant face. As you can tell, I'm kinda angry that they couldn't leave a perfectly good system alone. Of course, In our gay town they just made a curfew of 10:00 (weekdays and WEEKENDS!) for minors to be walking around, so technically.... I can't go to the fire house in the middle of the night. But it's OK, no cop in our town would so much as roll down his window to tell me to go home if he saw me sprinting the few blocks to the station with a scanner in my hand. I guess I need the exercise anyway.

  2. #2
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    Default

    I know in Pa there is an exception to emergency services people. All you have to do is get a written letter from the Chief. You may want to check your permit book. Thats where I found this information.

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    Default License

    I unfortunatly can relate to this because I was once in your place, but I am older and a Little bit more wiser. I know here in mass when given a you must wait 1 year to apply for a "Cinderella" Licese and only given for "Home to work and Work to home" . Now being and Emergency Service Provider I am unaware how that would affect it. Up here my license was, thank god, not suspende for that long so Im not sure. But I would venture to guess that it would that it wont, IF big IF you are given a check from your fire company with there name as your employer. Now as for what further consequences there is. Your parents are right, my buddie a Mass. State Police Trooper, said that the MV laws are pretty close in nature and you could risk losing your "GDL or Cinderella" License. I hope this information is helpful to you.

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    Default Re: License

    Originally posted by EPHQ
    I unfortunatly can relate to this because I was once in your place, but I am older and a Little bit more wiser. I know here in mass when given a you must wait 1 year to apply for a "Cinderella" Licese and only given for "Home to work and Work to home" . Now being and Emergency Service Provider I am unaware how that would affect it. Up here my license was, thank god, not suspende for that long so Im not sure. But I would venture to guess that it would that it wont, IF big IF you are given a check from your fire company with there name as your employer. Now as for what further consequences there is. Your parents are right, my buddie a Mass. State Police Trooper, said that the MV laws are pretty close in nature and you could risk losing your "GDL or Cinderella" License. I hope this information is helpful to you.



    Correction


    I unfortunatly can relate to this because I was once in your place, but I am older and a Little bit more wiser. I know here in mass when given a suspension you must wait 1 year to apply for a "Cinderella" Licese and its only given for "Home to work and Work to home" . Now being a Emergency Service Provider I am unaware how/if that would affect it. Up here my license was, thank god, not suspende for that long so Im not sure. But I would venture to guess that it wouldnt, IF big IF you are given a check from your fire company or town you work in with there name as your employer, as you could always say you were on your way to work. Now as for what further consequences there is. Your parents are right, my buddie a Mass. State Police Trooper, said that the MV laws are pretty close in nature and you could risk losing your "GDL or Cinderella" License. I hope this information is helpful to you.

  5. #5
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    Default

    your best bet would be to contact DMV about this matter and ask them, and explain that you are a member of your fire department, what can I do, blah blah blah. Just a suggestion.

  6. #6
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    The same Thing here in Texas, right now im taking driver ed and
    i havent read any thing about a fine or any thing like that.
    But if you have a department sticker on your truck the cops
    most likely wont do any thing to you.And if all the cops know you
    they most likely know what you are doing out in between 12:00 am and
    5:00am. So go to the station by all means. O and the person we would all like to punch in the face for that dum @$$ law is Presedent Bush

  7. #7
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    Default

    Here in NC, ours is similiar to that. people that can only drive between 5 am and 9 pm are exempt if they are a volunteer. it doesnt really matter for me, with my parents being on our dept. if one of them go, ill go. also it doesnt matter because i get my full license in 20 days.

  8. #8
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    Soon jr Fighter,
    Driving laws like that are made by state governments, so yes, Then Governor Bush may have put that law in place in Texas, but he as President didn't put it on the country. While I can see your frustration in the law, it isn't a bad one. Drunk driving accidents occur way to often, and unfortunately are sometimes caused by teenagers. There also isn't a need for most teenagers to be out at those hours. I am 16, am a volunteer firefighter ,and have a provisional license, i can't drive between midnight and 5am, without a note from my employer. I agree, however, go to the station, but do it legally. I'm sure that a note from your Cheif would be acceptable. We don't need firefighters, let alone explorers going around breaking the law just to get to a call.
    Last edited by FF19CSC; 05-05-2002 at 08:02 PM.
    Megan Barnum

  9. #9
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    Post Maturity Needed

    Originally posted by renplah
    ....my parents are worried about what would happen if someone hit me, or if, God forbid, I hit someone (which I keep swearing won't happen: it's only a couple of blocks to the station).

    I think this is all pretty effing homosexual if you ask me and it only serves to make my G-d d-mn life effing hard. This is the gayest law our state has done since the bike helmet law (which really chapped my ***** at the time). If you know anything, please help. All I wanna do is help my f-cking community, come 'on now it can't be this hard.

    .....go find the guy who originally authored this law and seriously consider punching him in his ignorant face.
    Your post indicates a disregard for the law, a disrespect for your parents, a disrespect for certain lifestyles and is an example of the lack of maturity that the lawmakers had in mind when they crafted these measures. A driver's license is a priviledge, not a right.

    Your comments regarding "won't happen to me" and "the cops would never pull me over" and "makes my life G-D effing hard" make it clear to me that, you aren't ready to be a safe, responsible driver. Furthermore, I would question your readiness to be a firefighter. You lack the maturity. You're supposed to be aiding the public....NOT endangering them by disregarding the law.

    Maturity begins to grow when you can sense your concern for others outweighing your concern for yourself. -- John Macnaughton
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    Default

    All I wanna do is help my f-cking community, come 'on now it can't be this hard.
    Doesn't really sound like that's your motivation. I'm reluctant to help because I agree so much with NJFFS_A16. If your chief won't sign a note, you may wish to read between the lines.

    Anyway, your state legislature probably has a website. Go there, get a copy of the new law, and read it. See if it applies to your situation. If there is an exemption for you, you're set. If not, there is probably a reason. The fire service has lobbyists like anyone else. They look at pending legislation to see what effects them. If they didn't look at GDL and say "Oh Crud! What about the explorers we need on scene! Let's fight for an exemption!", well... Maybe when you get old enough to vote you can do something about it.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Maturity Needed

    Originally posted by NJFFS_A16
    Originally posted by renplah


    Your post indicates a disregard for the law, a disrespect for your parents, a disrespect for certain lifestyles and is an example of the lack of maturity that the lawmakers had in mind when they crafted these measures. A driver's license is a priviledge, not a right.

    Your comments regarding "won't happen to me" and "the cops would never pull me over" and "makes my life G-D effing hard" make it clear to me that, you aren't ready to be a safe, responsible driver. Furthermore, I would question your readiness to be a firefighter. You lack the maturity. You're supposed to be aiding the public....NOT endangering them by disregarding the law.

    Well Put!!!

  12. #12
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    Default 40 year old men... out!

    first off...

    40 year old men.... out! didnt ask for your opinion, dont care what you have to say cause you dont have this problem. This is the old thing about hazing, just because you had to go through it doesnt mean it is the right thing to do (and ya that includes if its worse than what you went through). Don't just look at the link to enter this forum that says jr.'s and explorers and assume your invited too.

    second off,

    not immature, just really frustrated.
    i said nothing about drinking and driving, speeding, or anything else that would be considered unsafe during the day or during any of the allowed driving hours for that matter. Chill out, im not going to be bombing around town running peds off the sidewalk, just driving THREE blocks to the firehouse rather than sprinting them. O ya, and, the day I got my license I made a promise to myself that I would never drink and drive. I don't intend to break that promise or break any laws.

    Also, I only meant that my parents are way to knowledgable and concerned for normal parents. I hang out with a bunch of good kids, a large majority of them are in the top 10% of their class and have a clear definition of what is right and wrong at the tender age of 17. These laws aren't designed to keep these kids off the road who never break traffic laws and pay strict attention to the road even when there are 3 people in their car at 12:05. Oh, and by the way, most of their parents trust them to be safe and to follow the law WHEN APPROPRIATE and WITHIN REASON, and won't have a caniption if they come home at 12:01 or if they give more than 1 person a lift for 3 blocks after practice or something.

    Also, does anybody really think that the idiots this law was intended for will actually give a d@mn? I haven't seen any proof that anyone but the kids who wouldnt wrap their car around a tree in the first place cares about these laws or is scared of getting caught breaking them.

    O ya, and i dont intend to break any laws even if they are stupid.

  13. #13
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    Default one more thing...

    the cops would never pull me over because i dont break the law, not cause im invincible, jerk.

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    Unhappy stop making us look bad

    renplah...could you please stop making all explorers look bad with your complete disrespect for the laws, your parents, and your elder firefighters. you may have a valid point, i have to deal with it too, but your going about fixing it in the wrong way. noone's going to help you if you treat them like this. just remember most people who make the laws are 40 year old men. alls you are doing is making all explorers/ juniors look bad.

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    Default

    I am sooo glad to see that at the age of 17 you hae it all figured out. "I'm not going to get in an accident" well if you're so damn smart why did you need to ask this question.
    My questions
    1. Can you control all the other people on the road?, I sure as hell can't
    2. Can you control you're car when you blow out a tire or even identify things that would cause a tire to blow?
    3. Are you so expericened that you know how a car reacts in adverse weather conditions? For that matter even under regular conditions?
    4. Further more what co. vehicle can you be qaulified to drive other than a standard passenger vehicle?
    5. Who said anything about you drinking?
    Well of course you can, you've got it all figured out.
    If you consider breaking this law you set a bad example to everyone who knows you are an explorer, thinking that it is ok to break the law because you can get away with it is not only immature but sets a p.r. image to everyone around you, that firefighters think they are above the law, your actions relfect not only upon yourself but to your co. and the profession. I am going to refrain from getting to harsh in my reply here. But remeber the reason 40+ people come into this forum is to help little boys such as yourself get perspective. As for the rest of the jr's in this forum, most ff.s realize the differnce between good jr.s with ambition to learn and rabib brats you need an *** spankin.
    the truth never hides for long

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    Default woops

    ok people, before I try to figure out how to delete my account so i dont have to be connected to the stupid angry ranting I did earlier, I wanna say I'm sorry if I gave you the wrong impression about me, my family, or my department. I only meant to start a discussion about exemptions for volunteer "employees" of an explorer post for the time restrictions. I have had a lot on my mind lately (explorer related but I dont realy wanna talk about it), and I have clearly been venting my anger in the wrong place. From now on I'll stick to my punching bag, it doesnt talk back.

    Just to be clear, I dont actually intend to break any laws; I haven't yet and I don't plan to.

    570eck:

    1.-3.: Never said I was that experienced, but I dont see how thats different from the middle of the day, 9:00 at night, or 6:00 in the morning. Ya, I probably have a lot to learn about driving, but the state saw fit to let me drive 19 hours of the day, whats the difference if I have a valid reason (however debatable that may be)?

    4.: There aren't any qualifications to drive a company support vehicle like one of our jeeps or a van or something where I live. I can't speak for where you are, but here the only qualification is a drivers license. And minors cannot drive while any of the emergency warning devices are activated. (Which I happen to think is a good idea, I've only been drivin for a couple months, I certainly don't need to be behind the wheel in an emergency response.)

    5.: I don't know, but I thought I saw something about drinking in somebodies response, plus thats almost always implied when people talk about the new rules about having more than one person in the car or being out past "normal" hours. I don't think I've ever actually encountered anyone in person who didn't bring that up as though there is no way that a young person out past midnight could have ernest intentions.


    To recap, very sorry, wish I could start this over, seem to have gotten the "*** spankin" I deserve.

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    Default seriously i wanna delete this

    Seriously, does anyone know if and how I can end/delete this thread? I feel like such a jerkoff, I need a better way to deal with it than punching myself in the face.

  18. #18
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    Default

    first of all, i dont think renplah was out of line at all. would eck speak up if we were posting in their forum? i think so. second of all, the point of this thread was to help the guy out, not bash him. renplah, dont worry about what the oldies think, that's why it's the explorer/Jr. forum.

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