1. #1
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    Default Mutt in TX kills mom

    Go to the main Firehouse.com page and read the story on the vol FF who wrecked and killed a woman in route to a call--he'd been convicted of criminal mischief in conjunction to an arson charge some years ago. He moved to a new FD and joined up; chief said they couldn't afford background checks.

    In light of homeland security stuff these days, shouldn't there be some funding to do good, international & interstate BG checks on everybody? Isn't this in the national interest, not just for mutts like this but for terrorism issues as well?

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    EastKyFF

    I couldn't agree more. Actually I am a little stunned that the states hasn't had them all along. Ours are only national, but they are a pre-employment requisite, at least for paid depts, don't know about vollie. Maybe one of the Malahat crew could fill us in on that.

    Here's the link to the story for everyone.
    http://www.firehouse.com/news/2002/6/6_Paccident.html

    Sheriff's investigators say McKinney was turning west off Mueschke Road Tuesday night. It was her last turn before home. But driving right behind her, responding to a fire was Rosehill volunteer firefighter Sammy Maglitto in a truck. With lights and sirens on, investigators say he crossed the double yellow line to pass McKinney, striking her car.
    Obviously he didn't cross the double yellow enough if he was following her...

    One has to wonder if he set the fire he was responding to. I can't believe this guy would have the fortitude to apply and work for another vollie dept after CONFESSING to starting a grass fire.

  3. #3
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    Seems like with the availability of the internet that departments could at least do some type of basic background check. And if that doesn't work see how your local law-enforcement would be willing to help.
    Just my two pennies worth.
    Alan B.

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    This guy calls himself a firefighter???? Not only does he not have regard for his brother firefighters,( as evidenced by his arson admission) he kills an innocent person by driving like an a******.
    He deserves whatever comes his way!!!
    "I have no ambition in this world but one, and that is to be a fireman. The position may, in the eyes of some, appear to be a lowly one; but we know the work which a fireman has to do believe that his is a noble calling."

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    Meanwhile, the Rosehill fire chief says Maglitto will stay on duty until the investigation is over.
    This leaves me speechless.

    Where is Bob M? I hear a case calling him. It must be the fault of the road department for not making wider roads...

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    Is this guy a mutt for setting fires? Absolutely. Is this guy a mutt for joining again after being convicted of it once? Probably ... although I guess there is a slim chance he was "reformed" by the system and would never do it again. Doubtful, but slim I guess.

    Is this guy a mutt for this traffic incident? We don't know. Is this, at the least, a horrible tragedy? Absolutely.

    It sounds like he was passing on the left and she turned in front of him. How fast was he going? Who knows? Did he give her enough of a chance to recognize the presence of an emergency vehicle? Who knows? Was he driving like a complete fool? Who knows. Was she completely clueless and did she swing out in front of him at the last moment? Who knows?

    On to the background checks ...
    Local police, by law, are not allowed to conduct background checks for fire departments (at least in PA). We must submit a background check application to the state police (I believe), pay the fee, and wait for the results. Furthermore, the results only show activity in PA. No out of state incidents will show up.

    Amazing, ain't it?

    We'll just add it to the list of things we need in order to do our job the best way possible.

    Stay Safe

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    Maybe Kiwiland has it easier,

    All people, Vol or Perm have to agree to a security check before even going for a medical.

    Gets rid of tire kickers.

    The only thing you need to get back is along the following lines

    1. Yes they can be a Firefighter.
    2. No, due to convictions or other information, they are unsuitable.

    You don't need the reasons, if someone gets snotty and gets a lawyer, just tell them to sue the Police department, cause it was their decision.
    Psychiatrists state 1 in 4 people has a mental illness.
    Look at three of your friends, if they are ok, your it.

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    quote:
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Meanwhile, the Rosehill fire chief says Maglitto will stay on duty until the investigation is over.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Speechless here too!

    #1 - CONVICTED for arson and still be able to work as a FireFighter

    #2 - REMAIN ON DUTY - Wouldn't you think that for serious charges of this nature that "suspended until the outcome of the investigation" would be more in order?? Maybe they should look at some of the unsolved arson cases in the area!

    un-FREAKING-believable!!!

    Just my opinion
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    Bones and RspctFrmCalgary

    Totally agree... I am stunned they let this guy keep working. What the H*ll are they thinking?

    Kiwi

    The criminal record check is the same up here. Everybody has it done medical, police and fire. It comes back a yes or no.

    PA Vol

    Up here he WOULD be considered at fault for the accident regardless of whether she pulled out right in front of him or not.

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    In regard to the incident in Tomball, Texas, I don’t understand the train of thought here..

    "Lt. Denholm says the Firefighter had every right as an emergency responder to disregard the rules of the road, but the question is whether he had public safety in mind"

    As a driver of an emergency vehicle, you should always be alert for the unexpected. Sure
    you are on an “adrenalin rush”, but that doesn’t preclude you from your responsibilities to
    the public, your department, or yourself. As for the Police Officer indicating that the
    emergency responder could disregard the rules of the road, it makes one wonder what
    kind of training all of the emergency services have in that area of the country.


    d]"Meanwhile, the Rosehill Fire Chief says the Firefighter will stay on duty until the investigation is over".

    With the Fire Chief’s decision to keep the Firefighter on duty, one has to think that either they have a very small
    Department with limited drivers, the Fire Department has an
    extrodornary insurance policy, or they are all wound up in themselves that this situation
    doesn’t seem to bother them. This should be a learning experience for every Fire
    Department in the country.

    As for the background checks, the Chief stated that he had just learned of the Firefighter’s
    “criminal mischief” conviction. You mean to tell me that no one else in the Department
    knew this guy, or that a simple phone call to his previous Department would not have
    revealed this information? Wouldn’t you call his previous Department to see what kind
    of a Firefighter he was? Just puzzleing questions with no answers.
    "The uniform is supposed to say something about you. You get it for nothing, but it comes with a history, so do the right thing when you're in it."
    Battalion Chief Ed Schoales
    from 'Report from Ground Zero' pg 149
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    Question Moran?

    Originally posted by Bones
    Where is Bob M? I hear a case calling him. It must be the fault of the road department for not making wider roads...
    Bob is on another thread....reading numerous cracks about his butt!

    As far as the firefighter still working.....can you say liability? I hope he's not involved in another accident, while this is litigated....it could get ugly.
    Proudly serving as the IACOJ Minister of Information & Propoganda!
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    I am sure that Mr. Moran will defend him on another "ignorance" plea..

    Dogs run in packs...so they deserve each other... One mutt defending another mutt!

    This is another Black eye in the face of the fire service. Currently we are still at the top of peoples lists of favorites... But if we keep playing this tune we will certainly drop to the bottom again.
    09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
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    The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.

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    Thumbs up Background Checks

    I don't know how other states are, but in NC you can get them at no cost. All you have to do is make the appropriate request through law enforcement and you can get their criminal and driving histories (and I don't mean just the local stuff either). It gives me piece of mind.

    This won't eliminate everyone, or those cases that are "sealed", but at least you are making the best possible effort to find out what you can.

    Calling previous departments should always be done, but it won't always eliminate things anyway. I know of one Chief that recommended a guy for a job he had no business doing and claimed the guy was the best thing since sliced bread - and it wasn't even close to true. All it did was ruin his reputation when the guy showed his true colors later on...but the damage was done.
    Susan Lounsbury
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    Griffith Volunteer FD

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    Hard to believe! Why on earth would firefighters be exempt from reference checks?? As a civilian I'm required to provide references from previous supervisors for any jobs I apply for, and the references are always called after an interview!
    September 11th - Never Forget

    I respect firefighters and emergency workers worldwide. Thank you for what you do.

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    I don't know about Texas, but here in NY we may not "disregard the rules of the road". The NY vehicle and traffic safety laws give responders very specific privileges when running code 3, like automatic right of way at intersections (after stopping), access to the opposite flow of traffic (with a max. speed of 15 mph) and traveling above the posted speed limit to a specified speed. While these are rules that other drivers do not have they are still spelled out as specific privileges and are not just whatever gets you there. And with every rule in responding there are clauses that say things like "...and the operator will have control of the vehicle at all times." and "... with due regard of public safety". No emergency is big enough to put someone else's safety in jeopardy.
    "What makes a person run into a building others are running out of?...Character."- Dennis Smith

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    originally posted by PAVolunteer
    Is this guy a mutt for setting fires? Absolutely. Is this guy a mutt for joining again after being convicted of it once? Probably ... although I guess there is a slim chance he was "reformed" by the system and would never do it again. Doubtful, but slim I guess.

    Is this guy a mutt for this traffic incident? We don't know. Is this, at the least, a horrible tragedy? Absolutely.

    It sounds like he was passing on the left and she turned in front of him. How fast was he going? Who knows? Did he give her enough of a chance to recognize the presence of an emergency vehicle? Who knows? Was he driving like a complete fool? Who knows. Was she completely clueless and did she swing out in front of him at the last moment? Who knows?
    couldn't have said it better myself. When I read that the driver was passing on the left, I wondered if that same scenario could happen to anyone of us... while responding to a call, the car in front of you slows and, assuming they are yielding the right-of-way, you go around them... could happen!

    What really got my goat was that this MUTT had the stones to join a volunteer fire department after he got indicted for arson and plea-bargained for a lesser charge!!
    An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure!

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    Not only was involved with another department, but a department that borders Rosehill. I'm sure somebody (or everybody) knew. Here in Texas, the whole volunteer service is VERY political. Getting in trouble with one department and then bouncing to the neighbor is very common.

    As far as jumping to conclusions on the accident, let's let the investigation tell the story.

    I don't know how fast he was going. I don't know if she signaled her intention of turning left. I do know, however, that I wasn't there.
    Let he who has NEVER passed someone on the left throw the first stone based on preliminary media investigation.

    I have my own opinion of what "probably" happened, but I don't see enough information right now to condemn him this quickly.

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    "Lt. Denholm says the Firefighter had every right as an emergency responder to disregard the rules of the road, but the question is whether he had public safety in mind"

    Forrest Gump was right..."stupid is as stupid does..."

    I smell a wrongful death lawsuit....
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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  19. #19
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    Originally posted by First In
    I don't know how fast he was going. I don't know if she signaled her intention of turning left. I do know, however, that I wasn't there.

    Let he who has NEVER passed someone on the left throw the first stone based on preliminary media investigation.

    I have my own opinion of what "probably" happened, but I don't see enough information right now to condemn him this quickly.
    Extremely well put, First In.

    Temptaker - you stated that he would be at fault up there. Why is that, specifically (just asking, not accusing or implying)?

    Stay Safe

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    Sheriff's investigators say McKinney was turning west off Mueschke Road Tuesday night. It was her last turn before home. But driving right behind her, responding to a fire was Rosehill volunteer firefighter Sammy Maglitto in a truck. With lights and sirens on, investigators say he crossed the double yellow line to pass McKinney, striking her car.

    "You should anticipate the public making a turn and that they don't hear you and obviously, in this case, he didn't," said Lt. John Denholm of the Harris County Sheriff's Department.

    I believe in NJ he would also be at fault. He crossed the double yellow line leading into an intersection and failed to use "due regard". Tough to tell from the article, but was he in a fire truck or his own personal truck?

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    You can drive any way you want running emergency in Oklahoma, as long as you do so “with due regard” to public safety. Get in an accident and you were speeding, on the wrong side of the road, etc and your gonna catch it.

    I have had people slow as I was coming up behind them (usually in an ambulance) and then turn left in front of me. Of course, I never hit anyone. I would have a hard time believing that there is a person out there that has operated an emergency vehicle that hasn’t had something similar happen.

    Since it’s all speculation anyway, let me paint this picture and see what y’all think:

    You’re responding to a call in your engine/ladder/ambulance/whatever. You’re tooling along the road with lights and sirens going, maybe a hair over the speed limit. You top a hill to see a vehicle stopped in the roadway. You don’t have time to stop. You can do one of three things: 1) crash into the rear of the car 2) crash into the ditch on the right or 3) swerve to the left. I’d probably take option #3.

    Maybe this is what happened. Maybe not.

    As for the prior conviction issue…I’m not familiar with Texas law, but is criminal mischief a felony? Sounds kinda like disturbing the peace or something.

    I used to dispatch for a local town’s PD/FD/EMS. I was certified to operate the state criminal records system to run tags, DL’s, and background checks, among other things. A criminal background check will tell you if someone has restraining orders against them (which I could get against any of you for no reason, it’s ridiculous —but that’s another thread) and any convictions. It won’t tell you what they were accused of—just what they were convicted of.

    Arson wouldn’t have shown on his record unless it was a conviction.

    I wouldn't remove him from the department yet--but he would be on leave for sure.
    Bryan Beall
    Silver City, Oklahoma USA

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    It was a personal vehicle.

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    In Texas, my guess is that he will be held liable. As far as criminal charges, I don't think I've seen an accident here result in that. But, that's not to say it hasn't or won't happen. Hind-sight is always 20-20, and it's real easy for us to make judgements now. Driving down the road is a different story.

    I've had some personal experience with just how much liability is involved with emergeny driving. Let's all be careful. ANYTHING that happens, burden of proof is on us.

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    AFD368

    Great Point. It's pretty tough to pick up the phone and call his old dept for a reference

    PA Vol

    Up here emergency vehicles have seperate insurance from ALL other vehicles on the road. The rules governing the operator of the vehicle are somewhat different. Most of the time if there is an accident involving an emergency vehicle it is always the operators responsibility because they have to take 'emergency driving'. So it is assumed they are better drivers on the road then everyone else.

    This actually happened: Ambulance is stopped in a line of traffic going to a call downtown. Citizen turns right, and clips the rear quarter panel of the ambulance. Citizens fault right? WRONG. It automatically went on the ambulances insurance. The operators aren't charged or fined for most things, unless it was something considered negligent.

    Another one:
    Lady comes off the highway heading west to a light. Ambulance going code 3 to a cardiac who has the green is going north through the intersection. Lady blows the red, plows into the amubulance pushes it side ways about 12 feet to a concrete guard rail, it bounces and flips on its side. Who's fault was it... the ambulance of course. Apparently they are supposed to be psychic and know that someone is going to blow that particular light. Everyone walked away, with only minor injuries. The cardiac pt lived, thanks to fire already on scene. I would hate to think of what it would have looked like if she had hit a passanger car instead of the ambulance.

    We also aren't allow to blow through a red light even if BOTH lights and sirens are on. At the very minimum a rolling stop is used. People are stupid and they figure they can get through before you can. Let's face it Honda civic vs Engine, is going to be messy. We do have some traffic lights which will turn all signals red in the event of a fire call, but the engine still has to make sure that everyone has stopped. These rules are especially nice when you are going code 3 on the wrong side of the road, and people are fingering you instead of getting out of the way.

    Finding out that this guy was driving a personal vehicle. What was he doing with a siren? I thought vollies in the states could only have lights unless they were officers. I'm not sure if vollies have lights in BC, maybe one of the Malahat guys could confirm/deny it. I am 100% positive, because it was a person vehicle, even though he was going to a call, it would be considered 100% his fault. That doesn't mean that the police would charge him with anything, just that any and all damage would go on his insurance.

    Did I mention most people up here carry 2 or 3 Million in liability? We have a big problem with personal injury suits in MVA's. It is partially for that reason that the emergency vehicles take responsibility for accidents. They basically pay out claims if one is filed. Just to prevent the operators from being personally named in law suits.

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    I don't understand what having a prior conviction has to do with getting in an accident and killing someone. I am not sticking up for anybody, but why is everyone making a big deal about this? Do you personally know this guy? How do you know he didn't turn himself around after his his conviction for criminal mischief? I'm not saying he's an angel, but none of us are. We have all made mistakes, and we all must live with them.

    I'm not familiar w/ his states' laws, but here in Ohio if you are a volunteer/paid on call firefighter and your vehicle is equipped with emergency lights and audible warning devices, and you are responding on a call, you are considered an emergency vehicle, which means that as long as you proceed with "due regard to safety", you are allowed to "break the laws" (for lack of better words). I wasn't there, so I don't know if he was driving with due regard to safety or not.

    Also in OH (I can't be positive on this, but I know I've seen others mention it on here before), but I believe it is every driver's responsibility to check behind them before making a left hand turn. This is to check for any emergency vehicles that may be approaching from the rear and may need to pass you (for those who can't follow the "go right for lights and sirens".

    All I'm saying is, why attack this individual when you don't know him or know all the specifics of the incident? What would you all be saying if this was a memberr of FDNY who was responding to a fire or a member of your own department????


    I just wish everyone wasn't so quick to judge......

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