Thread: You Make the Call #15
06-08-2002, 08:38 PM #1
You Make the Call #15
You Make the Call #A0015 has been posted online and is getting surprising results. Almost 1,400 rescuers have taken the challenge of this incident.
I'm very surprised that over 650 rescuers got the first decision point wrong. When asked what assignment they would have their rescue crew do next, most sent their crew to do a 360. That's not appropriate for the CREW to do. That is something that would be done by the Rescue Sector officer instead.
It is very interesting to see that 75% of those participating thus far in the scenario chose to attack the hinges as their Plan B when the latch side attack was not working. That is a good decision and something that should quickly be considered anytime you encounter these plastic door panels.
When asked for a Plan B when the door opening job is 'going South', I thought it was interesting to note that 16% of those participating would go to total roof removal next. With the advent of recip saws into our rescue tool inventory, roof removal is becoming more and more popular and this response from those participating just reinforces that notion.
If you haven't gone through this latest You Make the Call, you should. The firefighters on scene that night came up with a very novel solution for continuing their attack on the latch end of the plastic door; an idea you may want to put under your helmet for when its your turn out on the street.
06-09-2002, 12:23 AM #2
- Join Date
- Feb 2000
Ron, did this camaro have t-tops, I can't tell cause it has a tarp over it, I am asking because most of the t-bone accidents that I have been on, my preferred method for opening the door is to do the vertical crush technique.
This crash didnt look too bad, 90% of the t-bones that I have extricated from have had major intrusion into the passenger compartment, and if we would try to power spread the door from either the nader or hinge side, the door would bow in onto the patient, that is when we started doing the vertical crush, I dont think tools that spread less than 32 in. will be very good for this, because we usually use it all.
06-09-2002, 02:23 AM #3
- Join Date
- Mar 2002
- Loco madidus effercio in rutilus effercio.
Ron, I remember these photos from your column in the home page. I enjoyed running through the scenario on my own to see if my thoughts matched your available selections. I think I either read too much into the point just after the panel pops off the door. What you did and the description I was looking for didn't quite match out, so I ended up going straight to plan B. While doing the exercise, I was intending to squeeze the door until it either opened or allowed direct access to the nader pin. I suspect that I read too fast into what you had as a selection, cuz I think I missed it. The pictures showed what I wanted to do though. So I guess that is ok too.
These scenarios have been a great help, keep up the good work.If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)
"I may be slow, but my work is poor." Chief Dave Balding, MVFD
"Its not Rocket Science. Just use a LITTLE imagination." (Me)
Get it up. Get it on. Get it done!
impossible solved cotidie. miracles postulo viginti - quattuor hora animadverto
IACOJ member: Cheers, Play safe y'all.
06-09-2002, 08:07 PM #4
Here's a shot of the vehicle not included in the You Make the Call #15 series. It is hard to tell but I believe the roof is a solid roof, NOT a T-top.
06-11-2002, 06:16 PM #5
Is this vehicle only a two seater?
It'd be interesting to see how many Rescue units train for third door conversions and to see how quickly they could do it in a real scenario. (I know for us, a car to train on in the conversion is pretty few and far between- I reckon it'd take us a while!)
Perhaps another alternative would be to roof off and go out over the rear parcel shelf and boot on a spine board. The occupants don't appear to be "physically" pinned....Luke
06-11-2002, 08:53 PM #6
The vehicle has front bucket seats and a bench seat for rear passengers. Although the rear seat is a full width bench seat, the cushion design allows seating for only two comfortably.
The female driver was struck on the driver's door. She had neck and spinal complaints. The deep bucket front seats and the tall center console would have made attempts to extricate her out the open passenger door very difficult. The rescue officer went with forcible entry of the driver's door which allowed better removal.
06-11-2002, 09:41 PM #7She had neck and spinal complaints.The rescue officer went with forcible entry of the driver's door which allowed better removal.
Using current spinal protocols and "best practice", removing a casualty with neck and spinal injuries out the side door is NOT the better option if possible.
All spinal injured casualties should be removed in line, via a spine board and dependant on "time critical" issues, a KED or similar fitted.
06-12-2002, 08:47 AM #8
All things being considered a rear hatch or roof removal would have been my first choice for this particular incident.A severly bent door is not always a good place to start.T.C.
06-12-2002, 09:01 AM #9
Rigth on 101!
Without being at this incident, it's hard to make a fair call, but I feel that when the door skin seperated, perhaps it was time to move on.
We as rescuers can sometimes get a little too focused on the task at hand and not see the "big" picture. Assuming the casualty is sitting in the seat, in line and not physically pinned, out the rear seems to be the quicker and more logical choice....Luke
06-16-2002, 05:17 PM #10
I agree guys. Removal of the roof and taking the patient out in a straight line would have been my preferred method of attack as well.
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