Thread: Why???

  1. #1
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    Angry Why???

    I have recently switched from a department that used Stortz (not sure on the spelling) to one that didnt. Its the most annoying thing in the world. Maybe its just my rookie thought process but why would anyone want to use threads? There are so many different types and its so much more time consuming. I just cant see any reason to use the stortz connections. I'm not sure on the price so it may be an issue of affordability. I'll buy them for the friggin department if I have to. I'm sorry.....we just had a fire and it frustrated me cuz our preconnects werent long enough so we had to add sections. If someone can explain why people would still want to use threads PLEASE let me know.

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    I don't know the budget of your new FD, but rest assured that replacing all those threaded couplings will cost the awfulest pile of money you have ever seen. Check out any equipment company's web site and see what just the adapters cost. Now consider all the feet of hose you carry.

    LDH is the best place for quarter-turn couplings. Regular attack lines and supply lines...doesn't seem worth it to me. If the threaded couplings are in good shape, an experienced FF can zip them together pretty quick.
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    ...not to mention replacing all of the fittings,adapters and hose couplings(each and every one) plus replacing the threaded connections on the apparatus.Several hundreds of dollars spent on that.
    We have no plans on switching to Storz simply because most companies in small towns and rural/urban interface areas still rely on threaded connections and heres why...#1 is because of budgeting and #2 is because of other nearby companies that may still have threaded connections.My best suggestions would either to carry threaded to storz adapters on the apparatus or to obtain some "quick connectors" which can be obtained either through W.S.Darley or Heiman Fire Equipment.These type of connectors work similiar to a Storz but used for threaded connections.They are made with threaded 2 1/2" NST or NPT male or female on one end and at the other is a special type of connector that works with any type of thread with just a simple push,twist 1/4 turn to lock.We use these on our apparatus discharges and carry a few spares simply becuase our Mutual Aid companies may use a different thread than ours and if a mutual aid response was ever required then we wouldnt be standing around wondering how to make connections to each other trucks. LOL

    Donna C
    Fire Chief/EMT-P
    Bridge Canyon VFD
    http://www.fire-ems.net/firedept/view/seligmanaz/

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    Default Storz on supply lines.

    If it's hose that you are going to move around like an attack line, threaded couplings is the only way to go. It won't come loose. It is a lower profile coupling that won't get hung up on edges and it tells you which direction is out, if you need to get out fast.
    Storz is also prone to leaking; the gaskets will wear out faster than a thread will. And lastly, threads are cheaper/economic.
    We have Storz to hook to the pumper and hydrant. All attack lines are threads. It's the way God planned it!
    Use what works.
    And stay safe.

  5. #5
    iceman4442
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    Pretty well covered already - we use Storz on our LDH supply line. The down side is we carry two Storz adapters to use in our town, as we have two different 5" threads on our hydrants, plus two more that fit other threads that our neighboring departments have on their 5" hydrant connections. (The neighboring departments don't worry about it, as they use 2 1/2" supply)

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    Not that it matters at all to your situations with mutual aid etc.

    Down here we use British Instantaneous Couplings for everything except forestry line, which is threaded, due to low pressure from portable pumps etc.

    The BIC coupling seals well, and requires both lugs to be pulled out to break the connection. The good news is the when it is under pressure even Arnie ("I'll be back") could not break the connection.

    The best thing is connecting lines, just shove the two together until you hear or feel a click, thats it folks you are out of here and on with the job.
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    Last edited by FlyingKiwi; 12-19-2002 at 02:41 AM.
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  8. #8
    iceman4442
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    Never seen anything like that!

    Kiwi - do you have problems with it hanging up on corners or anything while advancing the line? It looks like the lugs would make it prone to that.

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    My God Kiwi!...how do you guys down under deal with the ears not catching on things?...especially with high-rise operations or confined spaces? LOL...Ive seen those types of connections before and they are offered in the states by various fire supply companies BUT i have yet to know of a company that uses them because here in the states we figure "the less bulky the better".If we used those here we would have to "mann" each and every connection point just to be sure there would be no hangups,meaning uneeded use of available manpower.Another thing how do you guys deal with fires that may be advancing in any direction and you are not able to "advance" your hoselines due to those "ears" getting hung up on something? LOL...
    Some of my guys here wanted to change to those some time ago thinking it would make things easier but I flat refused that we change our present threaded connections explaining to them that they would be in more "trouble" than what its worth should certain unknown things happen on the fireground.

    Donna C
    Fire Chief/EMT-P
    Bridge Canyon VFD
    http://www.fire-ems.net/firedept/view/seligmanaz/

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    OK, lets be really clear here.

    Unlike most of your trucks, we cary REELS. Remember them, solid line, 1" diameter (internal). They are high pressure lines. used for internal work and immediate response, They are keyed connections, solid line with a smooth screwed coupling.

    Drag the line and it goes where you are. you will be hard pressed to kink the mongrel when dragging it.

    Two FF's can advance with a line and search, no problem. Back up crews lay 70's (2 3/4") lines outside, and depending on the situationm MAY drop a 30 Meter (100') length of 45 mm (2 and a bit inch) line for mobiltiy of Low Pressure line of the 70. The 45 will go on the end where you MAY need to enter and back up, moving fast with 2 3/4" is not an option. The 70 keeps the feed up, the 45 allows movement with two.

    We do not use split crews, pump/truck mentality does not equate here, "we all do the job needed."

    July36. The ears don't catch "Cause theys tucked under our Bone Domes" ROTF

    PS to Ice and July

    What you call "2 in, 2 Out" we call that a crew, Any less and the situation is NOT controllable. Our call to comms is "Make pumps X, we do not have a crew at this time"

    Less than 4 is NOT A TEAM.

    I live on this job BECAUSE of the team.
    Psychiatrists state 1 in 4 people has a mental illness.
    Look at three of your friends, if they are ok, your it.

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    As with Kiwi, we use BIC male/female couplings and have never had a problem with them. All our delivery hose comes in 25 metre lengths. So if youhad to take it into a house for instance, two lengths would be more than adequate to get round the interior,(if we could'nt use the HP reel).

    Can't say i have come across a time when there has been a real hang up on corners with the hose. This coupling is much better if you are moving water over a long distance, as it is easier and quicker to snap them together, rather than having to thread length after length. If you get bursts, its much quicker uncoupling a length to replace it too. I have run out over a mile of this stuff and not had that, "can't grip anything anymore" feeling, which I seem to get when using screwthread couplings, which of course have to be airtight.

    (Note to Kiwi.Ian, those are the shiniest, brightest couplings I have ever seen!! You must let me into your polishing secret, the boss would love them to look like that!! )
    United Kingdom branch, IACOJ.

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    Talking What language was that?

    Is it me or did those last two guys speak some other language than english?

  13. #13
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    Martin.
    ROTF, so would mine. have a look at www.firemaster.co.nz

    Translation for NON English speakers follows....

    Martin.
    ROTF, so would mine. have a look at www.firemaster.co.nz
    Psychiatrists state 1 in 4 people has a mental illness.
    Look at three of your friends, if they are ok, your it.

  14. #14
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    Default LOL

    I cant say I have ever seen the type of quick connect your talking about...but I can tell you this much IT WILL NEVER WORK ON A WILDLAND ENGINE!!!
    I have used quick connect couplers when I drove a water truck and I agree with everyone else for using on a supply line great...
    But speaking from my own observations made during the several years I have fought Wildland Fires....Use of your connector on a Type 3 Engine,would not work.
    The hose we drag up and down the mountainsides,through mud and crud and cactus and rocks ....off cliffs or inbetween and caught on every size snag known too man....not too mention the beating the couplings take from falling debree,falling rocks,getting burried and superheated at times...isnt near as brutal as the abuse taken bye Firefighters tripping over them,stepping on them kicking them,throwing thm off cliffs or out of Helicopters~and oh Yes...my favorite...being run over bye crew busses ,Division Chiefs,and every other Engine on that fire.....lol.....
    Threaded couplings are more durable,less likely to break loose or come apart under these circumstances and if trained properly a good crew can extend a progressive hoselay and keep pace with you as you hike uyp the trail wearing only your web gear...I know Ive done it and wearing a 50 lb hosepac on top of your own 40 lb web gear and doin a hoselay isnt something to take lightly....
    Maybe Im old fashioned but thats just my opinion...LOl
    Musta been some other blonde...

  15. #15
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    Genafire

    Maybe that is why our forestry line is all threaded couplings with percolating canvas line.
    Psychiatrists state 1 in 4 people has a mental illness.
    Look at three of your friends, if they are ok, your it.

  16. #16
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    Yo Kiwi,

    If I Recall Correctly, BIC couplings also are built in adapters between hose size --

    So your 45mm "attack lines" just snap into the 70mm "supply line" -- just like a 45 to 45 or 70 to 70, no adapter needed.

    Right?

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