1. #1
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    Unhappy New apperatus??!!??!??

    Not trying to knock anybody, but there are some departments in our county that are just poor. My fire department for example, Olmsted Volunteer Fire Department is still a professional fire department. We fight the same fires as paid fire departments fight. We protect the same kind of people as all fire departments do in this great nation that we live in.

    We have two pumpers, one is a 1963 International and right now it is broke down. It has been broke down since our last fire which was 3 months ago. Can't find parts for it. Then we have a 1970 Ford, which is our main pumper, and sometimes we wonder if it will make it back to the station. We have a 1985 GMC Tanker that just got out of the shop because the tank was falling off. A 1964 Dodge Brush truck that we wonder if it will start when we need it. Our newest vehicle is our medical 1st Response truck which is a 1994 Ford F-350, this truck was bought with a grant from one of our state reps.

    We have been somewhat fortunate by getting small grants to purchase PPE. We have 20 members on our roster and 17 of them have new PPE. Most of us are trained or exsperienced in fire fighting. We have great response time for a volunteer service. We are a very fortunate department for having all the members we do and we go to great lengths to help out the surrounding communities.

    It just bothers me to see other departments gripe because thier 1980 or newer pumpers need to be replaced just because. Like I said above I'm not here jumping anybody's case. I'm just saying that there are less fortunate departments out there that could use the 1980 or newer equipment and not be charged an arm and a leg to get it.

    Last year I followed my Chiefs' orders and applied for a Pumper/Tanker and we did not receive anything. This yea we are going to apply just for a Pumper and hopefully we will either receive a new pumper or just say the hell with it.

  2. #2
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    Default Apparatus Need

    The facilitator of the grant writing seminar said that it is key for you to follow the program guidelines for apparatus applications. Make sure you stress the reliability and maintenance problems that you have encountered with your present fleet. Stress that this is your first response vehicle and demonstrate the need for a more up to data, NFPA compliant, pumper.

    Good luck!
    NCVFC17

  3. #3
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    It's all in justification. Make your case and back it up, and consider increasing the cost-benefit situation by going for a late-model used pumper (say mid-90's model).

    Another issue I hear is, what good is a super-nice pumper if you have no equipment for it? You need to get a good, ISO-based view of your equipment situation and make sure you explain in your narrative that you have what you need but just can't get it to the scene.

    Good luck!
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.
    --General James Mattis, USMC


  4. #4
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    Also keep in mind there are trucks only several years old that already have a ton of miles on them in could be in the same bad shape as your equipment....Year of Manufacture has very little to do with road worthiness....I am not making lite of your plight just pointing out a fact.

  5. #5
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    The other thing to take from the reviewer's perspective, is that if you cried poor in the narrative, and you said you were going to blow your budget getting the new truck, how were you going to pay for it when it broke? That certainly doesn't make any sense to me.
    As the others said, you have follow the GRANT program rules. Notice the capital letters because that word means it's not a welfare program. Judging by the reasoning in your post, if the narrative went the same way, then I'm not surprised by the result.

    Sorry to be kind of blunt, but there have been some of us replying to threads exactly like yours for months where people did nothing but cry poor. Take the advice given so far and learn from it. Read some other successful grants, not just vehicle grants.

    www.firegraphics.org/grants.htm

    I've compiled some of each on my web site for learning tools for everyone. Read the rules inside out and make sure your narrative, and your solution, fit the program. Call volume weighs heavily. If you only run 12 calls and 2 real fires, then in a global sense, your new truck isn't helping a lot of people in this country. They are going for the largest public impact possible. But hopefully with the fact that they have more than twice as much money, and those that got grants last year (especially large ones), are at a disadvantage because we will be scored lower. I agree with their mindset, but that still doesn't mean you can cry poor. Cry poor, no grant. Cry spent all our money on the basics which we now have but now need a pumper/tanker, you've got a good shot because you've shown that you've already taken care of the PPE/SCBA basics.

    Good luck, and happy researching.

    Brian

  6. #6
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    New Apparatus? good luck... Have you looked at the statistics on apparatus awards? Last year our Dept. presented a very well demonstrated need for a new pumper. "Basic Firefighting Vehicle", quoted at $165,000.00. We didn't get it, however I did notice several Dept's receive grants for well over $200,000.00 for their version of a "Basic Firefighting Vehicle"... yeah right. This year there's no way in hell I'm going to waste my time and effort trying for a new "Basic Firefighting Vehicle". I'll go for the next up capitol project. Compliant SCBA's and a fitness program. Might as well get one end funded to help save for another.
    Good Luck just the same,
    Last edited by FSRIZZIO; 03-06-2003 at 08:45 AM.
    Chief Frank Rizzio
    Pea Ridge Fire Dept.
    Pea Ridge AR. 72751

  7. #7
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    I think Chief Rizzo answered his own question on why their app was turned down: applying for Basic Apparatus. They were not looking for basic apparatus in the vehicle catagory. The bulk of the awards (and $$) were for apparatus that filled a different need: pumper/tanker, heavy rescue, and several QUINTS. If your matching dollars were what kept you from applying for more, then that has to be stated in the narrative that you can't afford to pitch in any more money. And you'd have to say that all of the other money was already used to outfit everyone in PPE and SCBA. Otherwise, the reviewers probably looked at the basic apparatus you already had, and wondered why you would need another one of the same thing other than it was new. A pumper without CAFS, speedlays, preconnected hydraulic tools, or whatever new fangled thing is out there, is not a progressive piece of equipment that is going to be awarded.

    This grant program is about fire department programs that are to be beneficial over many years, not just having new stuff. Go for a quint, a rescue/pumper, CAFS retro fits, something that will add to the dynamics of the department. Cascade trailers with compressors and new buddy breathing SCBA. Several of those were awarded last year. Don't have much money? Look at picking up an old Army surplus duece and a half and converting it into something, a brush truck, tanker. Hell you could probably even get a bigger pump on the thing and use it first out. A rescue/pumper/tanker is no longer a strange beast either.

    USFA is looking for progressive ideas to carry the fire service through the next century. It is time to think outside of the box.

    Good luck and happy brainstorming

    Brian

  8. #8
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    Au Contrare 79... The program workshops and documentation stated Basic Firefighting Vehicles, as in pumpers, tankers, etc. Aerials, quints and the like were even lower on the priority for approvals. Sure, people need new rigs, or at least later versions of the junk they already have, and if everyone got one the money wouldn't go near as far... ahhh, enough of this, I'm glad I've got the chance to improve our Dept. and the services we can offer. There is money available through other programs, you jus' got to go get it.

  9. #9
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    1973:

    Whatever you decide to go for just make sure you have the matching funds NOW. While it matters how convincing your narrative is if you don't have your share you won't get the grant.

    Your narrative has to show how you will fund your portion. FEMA will not accept "if we get the grant we will have to have 3 chicken Bar-b-ques, 4 car washes and take the weekly bingo profit for the next year to pay our share."

    If you do get a grant you have to prove to FEMA that you have the money in the bank. If not they will not approve the grant.

    So before you decide whether you need the money for a new or used vehicle, make sure you have your 10% in sight.

    Good luck.

    ALSO, it's "APPARATUS".
    Steve Dragon
    FFII, Fire Instructor II, Fire Officer I, Fire Appartus Driver Operator Certified
    Volunteers are never "off duty".
    http://www.bufd7.org

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    Default

    Originally posted by dragonfyre
    ALSO, it's "APPARATUS".
    I was thinking the same thing

  11. #11
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    Apr...Aper...Aparr...TRUCKS! I need a spell check on this thing.

  12. #12
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    Our winning grant last year was for multiple safety and ops equipment. SCBAs,radios,training etc.
    email me atstcoesda2@mchsi.com and I'll be glad to share details and narrative with you
    Every silver lining's got a touch of grey...I wiilll get by....


    Proud to be IACOJ Flatlander Division

  13. #13
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    Go to Rodney Slaughter's web-site, www.dragonflynet.com

    He has several successful narratives from 2001 & 2002 including ours.

    If you don't ask you don't get! Ask for all you think you need as long as it's all in the right program under the FEMA guidelines. Go to the FEMA web-site and download the 2003 guidelines. Read them at least twice and have a couple other members read them also. Then have the same people read the finished narrative several times before you attach them to the application to make sure you are following the instructions properly.

    Good luck!
    Steve Dragon
    FFII, Fire Instructor II, Fire Officer I, Fire Appartus Driver Operator Certified
    Volunteers are never "off duty".
    http://www.bufd7.org

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