1. #1
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    Default Houston CAFS problems?

    What the H*ll is going on. Do they or don't they have problems?

    What did the dealer and E-One recomend. Did HFD follow recomendations?
    What system did they buy? Phoenix Fire has CAFS on all trucks and they work great. Sure, some of the old guys who were around when leather helmets were considered high-tech don't like to use them.lol. Other than that they are great. Much better than regular foam, worlds apart from water alone. So whats the 411 from H-town?

    Stay Safe.
    Later.

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    CAF trouble in Houston, who says? You’re not listing to the Volunteer Training officer Brian Vickers from Community VOLUNTEER Fire Department to get the skinny on Houston are you?

    Brian says they’ve never been able to make even one bubble, but Station 2 who actually works for HFD used his, but Brian isn’t with HFD and can’t be trusted.

    Only two CAF engines have been two in service over the last month and a half (E4 and E68) that was up until last week when E26 came out. Eventually, 24 more will be converted. E4 broke a spring due to impact damage but that happened before the CAF unit was put on. The only real problem is they are loud, yes due to separate engine design not what the builder suggested a pto which would have been silent. But remember, these are interim units to last until the next 130 rigs get in with integrated CAFS late this year.

    And for our, AZ friend who says, “who uses separate engine CAF’s” Houston and LA are two of the 10 largest fire departments in the U.S. and they use them, and US forestry, Park Service and BLM the three largest users of CAFS on earth and the first users of CAFS ever the Texas forest service, Annaville, Spring, all powered by aux engines.

    -What did the dealer and E-One recomend.

    Sorta

    -Did HFD follow recomendations?

    Sorta

    -What system did they buy?

    Waterous Pneumax

    -Phoenix Fire has CAFS on all trucks and they work great.

    That is not what your chief says, he was quite clear saying they all forget to use it until the fire is knocked down.

  3. #3
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    I can't be trusted, but the E/O on E68 who was the person who told me they didn't work can be. Now, whether he was operating it wrong, someone forgot to plug in a wire, I don't know. Being men, our motto is when all else fails, read the directions. But when he and the others that ride said truck say after over a dozen trips to the fire field and it still won't work, the logical assumption is that someone else was there trying to make it work besides him after the first time it didn't work, like maybe the installer, a factory rep, engineer. And they still couldn't get it to work. Hence my other post that going against the manufacturer recommendation isn't the smartest thing in the world to do. STATION2's unit had no problems as he reported. Waterous makes a very solid product, but no one's perfect so maybe out of the thousands that they make, E68 got the one bad one for this year.

    As far as the volunteer thing goes, for the past 30+ years, CVFD's day crew has been manned by HFD firefighters, officers, and paramedics. So it is from these guys that my information comes from, either from listening to their conversations about HFD, or when I work with them on designing apparatus, training topics, and tactics. Like the rest of the department, I respect their opinions and views on all subjects relating to firefighting. So can you give me any reasons why I should not believe them when they talk about a subject, especially their own place of employment?

    So I guess that the capitalized "VOLUNTEER" means that volunteers don't know anything? Is that the basic gist? I just wanted to make sure. I mean, I'm only a stupid volunteer so you have to type slow so I can understand. I guess we all just should ride the short fire engine to the fire so everyone else can tell when we get there, and that way they don't expect us to do anything productive? I guess all of those classes I took and paperwork I have that says I'm trained at the same level as a paid firefighter doesn't mean anything either. I'm not a paid firefighter because I went to college for software development, and it pays just that teensy bit more.

  4. #4
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    Every one stands around as they hear a loud whistling sound wondering what it is. They then realize the sound is that of the paid / volunteer Nuclear bomb being dropped again as someone yells


    INCOMING!!!!

  5. #5
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    Angry Lets hope not...

    This is not about Volunteer vs Paid, E-One vs Pierce or Fog vs Smooth Bore. It'a about the same, sad, manifestos that the same, sad person seems compelled to publish.
    Really, it isn't worthy of debate, only pity.
    TUTUM TE ROBORE REDDAM
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    District821....funny man funny!!! By the way is that one of the new GPS guided bombs we have been hearing about lately?

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    District821 has it, and it will be the WT dropping the bomb, nuking the entire tread.
    Txff44 didn't make this a career/vollie argument, he is stating that more reliable info would come from a career firefighter EMPLOYED by HFD, not some vollie not associated with the department.
    Lets try and keep the tread going, many believe CAFS is the way to go. If there are problems, it may be good to have some dialog on what they are and how to overcome them.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
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    Elevator Rescue Information

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    Default Seperate engines, DUH!

    Yeah, no sh*t. I know forestry and brush trucks use them, but other than a WUI rig they should not be used. Let me say it again , IT SHOULD NOT BE USED. I've got over 6 years on CAFS as both user,trainer, and I even went to Waterous/Pnuemax mechanic training. There is no reason on God's green earth to mess with another engine if you can instead go with a PTO. I'm inclined to say both Station2 and BC79er are right. Yes, a setup like that can work. But more often than not it will cause problems long before a PTO will. You don't have to be a Phd. to figure that out.
    District821, you've gotta be the funiest person in your firehouse. Wish some of my coworkers were more like you.
    BC79er can't be trusted because he is a vollie? I'm both paid and vollie. I started out vollie. What makes you think like that? If I were you I would get a cat scan soon. Real soon. Sounds like a bad case of Cranial/Rectum Inversion disorder.
    Oh yeah, before I leave. Brunicini;otherwise known as Bruno, says "If your new firetruck does'nt have CAFS, It's already obsolete". And alot of PFD crews use it ALL the time, not just for overhaul. Maybe you should get on I-10 and head west to learn something about CAFS.

    Saty Safe.
    Later.

    I'm gonna go play with my CAFS for awhile.
    Last edited by helicopter722; 03-10-2003 at 04:32 PM.

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    I am going to make one comment for clarification since I was mentioned again. In an earlier post I said that I had no problems getting foam out of our CAFS when I needed it last tour at work. It is Engine 68 that I am speaking of. So, ours does work. Atleast when I needed it to. I am just passing on facts as I witnessed them with me personally at the controls of the unit.

    Stay low and move it in.
    Stay low and move it in.

    Be safe.


    Larry

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    There seems to be a lot of people here that think they know all about HFD and the problems with the CAFS. Did it ever occur to any of you to get your facts correct before you started posting to this site. Maybe the CASF is good could there be any other problem. Does anyone really know how many CAFS have been installed on Houston engines!!!!!


    Why dont you do some reacearch before you post!

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    I did.

    And to give the short story, STATION2 and I always haven't agreed, but he's always dealt it straight. So after one of his other posts I dug further into my source's comments. He and his cronies still stick by them, but no one else does. He's not an E/O on E68, and doesn't even run there at all. Other (more respectable) guys say they heard something about a bad switch on one of the units but obviously just a quick fix and it was up and running fine. And I then find out that this guy and friends are habitual bitchers about everything. Now they tell me. I didn't know him as well as I know some of the others, so my fault for misplacing trust to all of them. Let me rephrase an earlier comment and say I trust MOST of the guys I talk to.

    I still can't say I'm a fan of the seperate engine over a PTO for the CAFS, but at least they do really work.
    Brian P. Vickers
    www.vickersconsultingservices.com
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    Westlake VFD - Houston, TX
    Proud Member IACOJ - Redneck Division

  12. #12
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    For this application of a retrofit, the engine driven compressor was the only reasonable solution. An Amps generator is driven off one of the PTO openings and there was a spring shackle interference with the PTO and the compressor on the other opening.

  13. #13
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    Default Extra engines

    No. There should not be an extra engine for CAFS on a class A pumper used in a metropolotian setting.NO,NOT EVER. And yes , you can have PTO driven CAFS and still have a hydraulic generator. AMPS and CAFS on the same one, I dunno. But it is theoreticaly posible.

    Stay Safe All.
    Later.

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    Yes, it is possible on my own trucks on my department and many others. I have AMPS generators and PTO driven compressors. But it is NOT possible on the Houston retro trucks. If you would fly to Houston yourself you would see that a PTO driven compressor and the existing AMPS generator is physically impossible.

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    The ports are there and open but there's something else that comes across that prevents everything from mounting up there. Can't remember what it is.

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    <b> Does anyone really know how many CAFS have been installed on Houston engines!!!!! </b>

    Sure, E4, E68, E26

    <b>No. There should not be an extra engine for CAFS on a class A pumper used in a metropolotian setting.NO,NOT EVER. And yes , you can have PTO driven CAFS and still have a hydraulic generator. AMPS and CAFS on the same one, I dunno. But it is theoreticaly posible.</b>

    NO, NOT EVER? Well, you might want to fly over to LA County and tell them the error of their ways on their structure engines, apparently they need enlightenment. Theoretically possible? It is done all the time.

    Bad switch huh? Unless the guys in the station are wrenching on thier own rigs (a violation of policy) there aren't any work orders to support that claim either.

    Not a fan of separate engine CAFS. OK, let me guess, you've never owned a CAFS unit, EVER right? You don't own any now, so based on that, you don't like them, right? Let's see, why would you consider aseperate engine CAFS unit. 1. Retrofit, no way to tag on to the PTO, 2. No PTO port or no unused PTO port. Of course not all makes of pumps need a PTO to run CAFS. 3. You want pump and roll capability. Pretty handy. 4. You don't want to risk someone turning the compressor on and off stalling the vehicle engine or scattering the PTO.

    You don't know whjat was in the way on an E-One? Come on. Can you say Houston A/C. Oh that is right you are not a member of Houston.

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    Default I'M SORRY WEB TEAM!

    WEB TEAM, WHAT I SAID YESTERDAY WAS FROM THE HEART. BUT YOU WON'T TAKE CARE OF THIS PROBLEM. SO HERE I GO.


    txff44

    MAYBE YOU SHOULD TAKE YOUR MEDICATION OR GET SOME OTHER KIND OF HELP. YOU DON'T SEEM TO FOLLOW THE VERY THREADS YOU ARE POSTING IN. LIKE :CAFS, BETTER THAN SEX?????
    MY THREAD. IN IT I MENTIONED THAT I AND A FEW FRIENDS OWN A FEW CAFS BRUSH/INTERFACE RIGS FOR FIRE SEASON JOBS SO WE DON'T HAVE TO WORK 2 JOBS ALL YEAR. MAYBE YOU DID'NT NOTICE IN THESE POSTS WERE I SAID I WAS AN OPERATOR,TRAINER, AND EVEN A TRAINED WATEROUS/PNUEMAX MECHANIC.BUT I DOUBT YOU MISSED THESE FACTS. I SUSPECT YOU ARE MUCH TOO STUPID TO UNDERSTAND THESE THINGS.

    A WHILE BACK IN THE MIDMOUNT THREAD YOU ATTACKED BC79ER ABOUT THE FOURLEAF TOWERS FIRE. YOU MENTIONED THAT THE NIOSH REPORT SUPPORTED YOUR CLAIMS THAT NO, REPEAT NO, 3 MAN ENGINES WERE ANYWHERE TO BE SEEN. HMMMMM.

    WHAT ABOUT THIS?
    http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/face200133.html


    DOES THAT SAY THE FIRE CAPTAIN WHO WAS HURT WAS FROM A 3 MAN COMPANY? AND THE OTHERS?
    WERE ANY 3 MAM UNITS ON SCENE???????


    YOU HAVE GOT TO BE THE DUMBEST MOTHER FU$@ER ON THE FACE OF THIS PLANET.

    LATER.
    MY VOLLIE BEEPER JUST WENT OFF.
    Last edited by helicopter722; 03-14-2003 at 11:16 PM.

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    Oh that is right you are not a member of Houston.
    Gee, Larry - neither are you.

  19. #19
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    Default New fleet?

    Anyone hear that HFD is going to buy or has bought a new fleet? Is it E-One ?

    Stay Safe All.

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    Lets not use FourLeaf Fire as an example...some of us lost a friend that day find another example!

  21. #21
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    Unhappy

    Has anyone heard anything new on the Houston CAFS system?

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    Last conversation I had offline with Larry (Station2) both retrofits were chugging along fine and making foam. Think he said 10 new ladders were on the way as well, E-One's just like the current set. He didn't say anything about new engines although I would imagine that they're in the works as well with CAFS on board from the start.

  23. #23
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    My how time changes things.

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