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    Default Firefighters march on statehouse to tell Gov. "Mutt" Romney not to cut jobs!!

    Changed mind.
    Last edited by dfdex1; 04-13-2003 at 11:35 PM.

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    I didn't catch it, but I have to ask does anyone really think that in this current fiscal climate that the Democratic House adn Senate have contributed heavily to think that you are going to go through this without cuts?

    And explain to me how it is that Romney made the cuts? He cut state reimbursements to cities and towns and it is the mayors and town selectmen that make the budget cuts.

    If they passed a tax hike like the special interest groups are railing for there will be a total overthrow in the state. Some 45% of the voters were for repealing the income tax here. No one is going to touch that one with a 100 foot pole. Everytime it is brought up the politician gets lambasted for doing so and these useless morons want to keep their jobs adn the pay raises they just received.

    The problem here is how the money is collected, it all comes from sales and income tax and when the economy takes a hit so do the state coffers. No one will revamp the tax codes either. On top of this we have teh Big Pig in Boston that is sucking the state dry and medicare / medicaid is going through the roof. Something has to give adn unfortunately we are it. I lost my job on a fire department last June because of the state's fiscal mess and irresponsibility getting passed down to the town.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

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    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

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    but we just cant hire you because the Selectmen and the State cut our budget."-----and this is the same answer from both union and volly dept.
    Volly department that can't hire you because of budget cuts? Did not know Volly departments hired people.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    The only way I am going to get re-hired is if my department alone clls me back. I was not on a civil service department so I don't get to go on that list. I have already turned down the re-hire mainly becuase my chief point-blank told me to expect to get laid off agin in June, why take a job to get laid off again in 3 months.

    The towns can always pass a prop 2 1/2 override to get the money but here is teh clincher - people in this state are already taxed to the eyeballs. We are like the sixth highest taxed state in the country adn people are sick of it. The schools are siphoning off 80 percent of a community's budget and you can't cut there becuase the freakin' teacher's union will scream adn cry adn start playing adds on tv about hurting your kids.

    What it all comes down to is poor fiscal management and planning at the state level when the times were good and everyone expanded tehir budgets AGAINST the warnings fo the bad times to come. They do it every time adn they do not learn.

    I voted for Mitt as well but do you really think that if O'Brien had gotten elected that it would be any different? Either one of them was going to stuck with a lemon and everyone will have to suffer.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

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    I didn't vote for Mitt, but I have to agree with one thing.....Public Safety was not, nor should not have been the target for the cuts. And that has been stated time and time again. Public safety is the easy out....its made up of "big" departments by Town and City standards, so reductions in budget and or personnel appear to make a big dent in the problem. The rwality of that is that because you reduce the staffing levels, there tends not to be a cushion, so there ends up being more overtime. Also Towns and Cities are required to pay into un-employment...so the actual saving from laying people off is not what it seems. So the blame here lies with the Town and City managers...and in many cases the taxpayers themselves.

    To you its not a big deal,but to someone like me who has never been a firefighter I would eat up the oppurtunity.To me it would be another 3 months of being a firefighter.
    And in the real world, what do you do when you get laid off again? Do you think the job you left to go back as a Firefighter will still be there? I can think of no harder decision than passing up a re-hire. After all its the job most of us have wanted all our lives....but you have to eat too.

    Sharkie...good luck Brother!

    Dave

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    And Sharkie, you are right...the Economy is in the toilet...and the budget was gonna be what it was gonna be. You can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig.

    dfdex....you have plenty of time my friend...the opportunity will present itself, trust me. I waited over 8 years to get my shot. 8 years of working in dispatch, watching guys that could give a **** less go on calls they would rather not go on. But things work out...they did for me. So try not to let your enthusiam color your judgement of what others do.

    Dave

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    You can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig.
    Are we talking about the budget or Shanon O'Brien?

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    To you its not a big deal,but to someone like me who has never been a firefighter I would eat up the oppurtunity.To me it would be another 3 months of being a firefighter.
    Who said it wasn't a big deal? I would have to give up a work schedule I have now as Paramedic to go and make a little more money and then get laid off in a few months and HOPE that I can get my schedule back and work around my school obligations. I have to worry about putting food on the table for me and the wife. Yeah it may be another 3 months but I got an ulser last year hoping the 2 1/2 override would pass - it didn't and I would prefer not to go through it again thank you very much.

    I also turned down a job with Fitchburg in February. I pretty much knew that they were going to lay off in a few months from a VERY good friend of mine who just got his layoff notice yesterday. They are laying off 8 guys at the end of April and they anticipate more as the start of the fiscal year comes. We are talking guys with 6 or more years on the job getting the axe. Two of the guys getting layed of this month graduated the academy two weeks ago and gave up GOOD jobs to take the Fitchburg gig and now they have squat.

    Sharkie...good luck Brother!
    Thanks. Right now I am taking eht opportunity to fill out my prerequisites for a Mater's program I have my eye on.

    Are we talking about the budget or Shanon O'Brien?
    Both. One can be corrected though.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

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    his is the article from the local paper in Fitchburg. Mind you the Mayor never liked the fire department when he was a counselor and likes them even less since the union local endorsed his opponent in the election last year. This is why union locals should not endorse on a local level:

    Chief: Layoffs risk safety
    By Benjamin Cole

    FITCHBURG -- Fire Chief Kevin Roy said Friday eight firefighters have been given layoff notices, which has him worrying about the safety of the public and his staff.

    "Laying off these eight people is going to be devastating," Roy said. "It's going to be tough -- it's a serious situation."

    In addition to the eight layoffs, the department is also not filling positions being left vacant by losing one firefighter who was activated for military duty and another to retirement.

    Two additional firefighters are expected to be lost to retirement in coming months, and these positions will not be filled.

    The eight firefighters given layoff notices will have a civil service hearing to notify them of their benefits and rights on April 24, Roy said.

    If all the layoffs go through, with the additional vacancies, the department will be left with 85 firefighters.

    A city ordinance stipulates the fire department must have 117 firefighters.

    "That's where we were at in the early 1980s, but these numbers were significantly reduced after the passing of Proposition 2 1/2" in the mid-1980s, he said.

    Roy said with the reductions, he is "absolutely" concerned, not only about the safety of the general public but of the firefighters who are on duty.

    He said the department consistently receives approximately 7,500 to 8,000 calls a year, and that figure shows no signs of going down.

    Roy said there were nine multiple alarm fires in the city last year, up from eight the previous year. The department also assists on about 2,600 ambulance calls in the city as well.

    "We were at minimum levels before all this started," Roy said. "Now we're dropping way below the standard."

    Roy noted the National Fire Protection Association recently conducted a study of a variety of fires and emergency situations.

    The association used the study to make recommendations of standards regarding the number of personnel needed to handle particular situations safely.

    Roy said according to the standards, 16 to 17 personnel are needed to fight a fire in a single-family home.

    With the high number of multi-family homes and high rises in the city, the drop in personnel could prove dangerous, Roy said.

    "We're now going to drop below the number to even handle a single family safely," Roy said.

    The loss of the firefighters is the result of Mayor Dan H. Mylott's request in December that all city departments cut 10 percent from their budgets.

    Earlier this week, Mylott requested another 5 percent cut.

    Mylott said while public safety remains a top priority in the city, the layoffs are necessary.

    "I think it's more than I really wanted to reduce the manpower by, but it's a necessary thing to do to get our budget in line and balanced," Mylott said.

    Roy noted several of the layoffs include younger members of the staff.

    Two of the layoffs include two firefighters that just completed their training last week.

    "This is a complex and physical job and the average age of firefighters in the department is going up," Roy said.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

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    Guess the future aint looking good for me and the fire service
    I guess I am not quite getting thru to you my friend. These times will pass, and eventually departments will hire...even if it is not to the strength they are now. Through retirements there will eventually be vacancies. I suggest you take this opportunity to do everything in your power to become the best possible candidate to fill one of those slots. Mark my words....there will be stiff competition. You would be better served to learn from these forums, rather than whining about what opportunities you may not have.

    The Fire Service will survive, it always has. Sometimes in spite of itself. Departments that are forced to lay off people will eventually return to strength. Some Departments will even grow, in spite of lean times. Go to school, get an education. Get your EMT, go work for a ambulance company. Experience comes in many shapes and sizes, and it all counts.

    Dave
    Last edited by hfd66truck; 04-13-2003 at 12:03 AM.

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    DFDex1

    I'm going to say this to you once nicely. I hope you understand it, because you have been corrected repeatedly and it apparently hasn't registered. These cuts affect more then YOU. There are firefighters that have families that have to deal with these cuts. There is going to be staffing issues, and overtime issues, and an entire myriad of things which you can't begin to fathom.

    Firefighters LIVES are going to be put in danger because of cuts like these. Civilian lives are going to be put in danger because of cuts like these. What will the powers that be do NOTHING! They will do nothing until something bad happens (even then it is questionable), or they get hit by lightening. Which do you think will happen first?

    What are you doing? Bitching and whining about maybe not being able to get a job in the end, and how bad that is for YOU! What do you think that once you have become a paid firefighter suddenly the love of the job disappears? I have news for you, being a firefighter means you are part of a team. It has NOTHING to do with YOU, and everything to do with your BROTHER, and until you get that through your head, you have ZERO chance of getting hired anyway.

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    Talking Yeah!!!!!!!

    Yeah Tempie!!! You got it. I just hope someone else finally did...... Sharkie, Best Wishes, Bro. I know this is easy for me to say, but, Come South. There are jobs down here, and you seem to be qualified, much more than a lot of new hires I've met. Baltimore, DC, and the surrounding counties hire pretty regular, pay and benefits are good, and times aren't that bad here because of the Federal payroll's effect on the local economy. Stay Safe....
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    Firefighters to vote on jobs vs. benefits

    By DAVE GERSHMAN

    Staff writer

    SALEM -- The firefighters' union is set to vote tonight on whether to forego pay raises and perks or risk losing 14 jobs this summer.

    The union is the first in the city to take up a vote sparked by Mayor Stanley Usovicz's request that each city department cut spending by 10 percent in the next fiscal year, which starts in July. And it's the first union to cry foul over the choice of losing hard-fought benefits or losing jobs.

    "The city is holding us hostage," John O'Leary, president of the International Association of Firefighters Local 172, said. "He's trying to put this on the union's shoulders to make these cuts for him."

    But it's a struggle being played out in other North Shore communities as well. In Peabody, for example, police agreed to take unpaid furloughs and give up some vacation days to balance the current budget. Peabody firefighters eventually agreed to similar terms, and the city is talking about renegotiating benefits to save money in next year's budget.

    In Salem, the mayor's staff said there's nothing else to cut in some departments. Job reductions have to be negotiated with the unions, and the mayor is meeting with all of them to outline a list of pay raises and benefits they could give up to save jobs.

    Firefighter union leaders say the mayor should first dig deeper into the city's rainy day accounts or make cuts elsewhere. The mayor responds that everybody is being asked to cut spending.

    He's using some rainy day money, but wants to save some for future emergencies. The city had to tap that account to plow the streets this winter, for example. Right now, the city has nearly $2.3 million in stabilization funds and nearly $2.5 million in free cash.

    "Everyone feels that they should be exempt, and they're not," Usovicz said. "No one is. It's unfortunate, but I have to put everything on the scale."

    14 jobs at risk

    In the Fire Department, a 10 percent budget cut translates into 14 positions. If the union does not give back any benefits, those positions could be eliminated by laying off some firefighters and not replacing others who retire.

    The union will talk about whether to forgo its 3.5 percent raise, which is due to take effect in July; whether its members should take unpaid furloughs; and whether to sacrifice the extra pay they receive for EMT certification, among other benefits.

    "We've asked them to take a look at those options to try to limit the amount of firefighters that would have to be reduced," Tom Philbin, the mayor's chief of staff, said.

    The base pay of a first-year firefighter is now $35,185. After a few years on the job, that firefighter's base pay goes up to $38,244.

    Union leaders don't like the idea of giving up pay and benefits, but say the alternative -- cutting staff --would leave the Fire Department with 71 firefighters. City officials say the Fire Department would still be comparable in staffing with other fire departments, an assertion the union questions.

    "By cutting this personnel, our safety is in jeopardy," O'Leary said.

    The firefighters' union has been the most vocal in the city. Last summer, it went to court and secured an agreement with the city not to cut the positions of five firefighters if the state didn't cut aid to Salem. A few months later, however, the state cut aid by 2.5 percent. Those positions were eliminated.

    Today, the mayor said all signs from Beacon Hill point to another, much bigger cut to local aid. Given the gloomy news, he said, he has to take steps to balance the books. The mayor said he is open to any suggestions union members might have to save jobs.

    "I think everybody is well aware that there is a decline in the economy that is only parallel to the Great Depression," Usovicz said. "That reality is now hitting home with many of our municipal employees."

    No agreements yet

    So far, the mayor has sat down with representatives of all the city unions except for the police, who are also due a 3.5 percent pay raise in July. And so far, none of the other unions have agreed to give up pay hikes or benefits, though they have not been critical of the mayor.

    "We're going to be meeting later in the month, and we intend to sit down with the mayor and the chief and discuss the situation," said Detective Peter Baglioni, who is president of the Salem patrolmen's union, which represents 68 police officers.

    The teachers' union, which is the city's biggest union with 700 members, has agreed to postpone the start of negotiations with the city on its next contract. The current contract expires in August.

    "Mayor Usovicz came in last week to our negotiating (meeting) and asked us to put it off for awhile because they have no money," Loretta O'Donnell, president of the teachers' union, said.

    O'Donnell said she hopes Beacon Hill hikes the income tax to stave off cuts to local aid, but added that there appears to be no momentum to do so.

    "I don't know how you can take all this money from the cities and towns," she said, "and not have anybody hurt."

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    Sharkie, Best Wishes, Bro. I know this is easy for me to say, but, Come South.
    It's in teh back of my feeble little mind. If I do it'll be to Florida or North Carolina. I am gettting ready to apply to Physician Assistant school this year so I'm kind of stuck beacuse most of my schools are up here. After that thought the wife and I more than likely getting the Hell out of dodge.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

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