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Thread: helmets??

  1. #1
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    Default helmets??

    i recently bought a carnins-1010, thats what we use at my house, but they have the face shild. andas mst people know a good portion of the time they like to come down. and i bought mine with the borkes. to solve that problem and i just prefer them. has anyone had a problem with them b/c they dont meet nfpa. or any other problems like that. im not allowed to use my 1010 b/c it dosent meet nfpa and i really dont want to put googles on it... so now its sitting collecting dust when it should be out collecting smoke... any info or advive is appericated




    stay alert, stay safe


  2. #2
    Forum Member explr985's Avatar
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    Just put some goggles on it with the lens on the back of the helmet, NFPA compliant, go collect smoke. Mine isn't NFPA, I just carry safety glasses, no eye protection on helmet, ( my choice ).
    No longer an explorer, but I didn't wanna lose my posts.

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    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    DUDE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! what are you sayin ? cause I cant figure it out ........
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  4. #4
    Forum Member explr985's Avatar
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    Put the goggles on the correct way, then flip them over the clips so they ride backwards, out of the way. And doing this still looks good too, plus if it is nessary to use them, just flip them back over. 1617, does your state say you must be NFPA, I think here it is just OSHA.
    No longer an explorer, but I didn't wanna lose my posts.

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  5. #5
    Forum Member 33motor's Avatar
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    I just bought some bourkes for my dept issue 1010 today. I will be buying a N6A in the future so I wanted to try the helmet for a while with them to see which style I want to order (bourkes/faceshield). My Dept probably has rules against wearring non-NFPA, but I don't really care. They have rules against wearring a ball cap other than the SAFD cap too, but I have been wearring my FDNY cap since 9-11. I don't really like the fs, and mine has gotten to the point where it wants to fall down a lot too. I don't plan to use the goggles at all either, I'd rather have fs than those anyday. I think I'll just carry the safety glasses too. There are a lot of guys in my dept that have bourkes, and some don't have goggles so I figured if no one has bothered them about it I should be OK.
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    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    so then that makes it right ????????? how old are you ?
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
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    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
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  7. #7
    Temporarily/No Longer Active July36's Avatar
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    Default

    no pun intended but....has ANYONE ever thought of maybe tightening up the thumbscrews on the faceshield holders?....Those ARE adjustable fromlight to medium to heavy holding power and maybe there shouldnt be any more fuss about the faceshields coming loose.

    Donna C
    Fire Chief
    Bridge Canyon VFD
    http://cms.firehouse.com/dept/SeligmanAZ

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    I wear a 1010 with Bourkes....safety glasses in my pocket, and have never had an issue. If they won't accept that, put the goggles and the helmet and let them melt and scratch. Bourkes are basically useless as eye protect, but I am not a huge "welding shield" fan either. The Safety glasses (disposable kind we wear for EMS runs - they are rated) seems to be the best fix. (They also don't fog up like the goggles)

    Try to keep a couple things in mind....Its called protective equipment for a reason.....and just becuase they don't enforce the rules, doesn't mean its right to bend, break or maul them.

    If you really thing something you guys are doing isn't working, then lobby for a chance in the rules, don't just pick and choose which rules you will use.

    Have a nice Sunday folks...

    Dave

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    MembersZone Subscriber Medic162's Avatar
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    First, I'm not attempting to be a guru regarding the "standards", that being said, take the time to go the the "Firestore" website and check out their link to the eyewear safety standards for helmet compliance. If I'm reading the thing correctly, not only are Bourkes noncompliant, but flip down faceshields are as well. Unless I'm missing something, the only eye protection that is acceptable is goggles(or ANSI approved safety glasses). As I'm an active duty Air Force firefighter, there is probably no agency more interested in meeting the standard. I don't like tactical tupperware and asked my AC about wearing my New Yorker(which only has Bourkes). He said as long as I have a pair of safety glasses available in my bunker pocket, it would be fine. Problem solved.
    Brian Rowe
    Paramedic/Engineer
    Colleton County Fire/Rescue

  10. #10
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    I've said this before and I'll say it again. In my experience any type of eye protection that is worn on the outside of your helmet will be rendered useless after only a few fires. It will be scratched, warped, and blackened to the point that you wont be able to see through it, and you won't be able to clean it well enough to get it where it should be. (not that any of us clean our helmets anyway)

    The most practical eye protection in my opinion is goggles or safety glasses stored in a case in your pocket. If you want full face protection use your mask.
    DKK
    Truck Man
    APFD
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    "Above all, an assignment to a truck company should be considered a promotion."

    Chief John W. Mittendorf-1998

  11. #11
    District Chief distchief60b's Avatar
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    Medic162....To the best of my knowledge thestandard 4" visor is compliant as eye protection as are the goggles. I believe that when the standard says "flip down visors" it is referring to the bourque shields. As far as federal government and standard compliance....don't make me go there.....!!!! The feds are exempt from thier own regulations. Additionally, remember, the NFPA standards, unless adopted by the Authority Having Jurisdiction, are voluntary concensous standards. So it is up to your department or the AHJ as to compliance.....

    However, your idea of carrying the safety glasses is a good one.

    To the initiator of this post
    ............................Yo ur department will not let you wear it the way it is...so the way I see it...you have 3 choices.....

    #1 Put on the goggles and move on.
    #2 Leave it on the shelf and admire it
    #3 Sell it
    Last edited by captstanm1; 09-21-2003 at 11:19 AM.
    09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
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    The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.

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    I am a firefighter in Michigan, work on a very busy department, and live with the MIOSHA rules. NFPA requires goggles for eye protection but MIOSHA requires face protection. I wear an N6A with a face shield and don't particularly like the way it looks or works for that matter. Wearing leather is a perk for us and not to follow the rules would not only jeopardize that right but it also would give the city an "out" concerning any face or eye injuries suffered by one not wearing proper gear.

    just my opinion

    take care brothers

  13. #13
    District Chief distchief60b's Avatar
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    flintoid....Thanks for sharing that... Your example is one of State Laws and AHJ rules. Your stance on the issue is one of "common sense."
    Last edited by captstanm1; 09-21-2003 at 11:20 AM.
    09-11 .. 343 "All Gave Some..Some Gave ALL" God Bless..R.I.P.
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    ------------------------------
    The comments, opinions, and positions expressed here are mine. They are expressed respectfully, in the spirit of safety and progress. They do not reflect the opinions or positions of my employer or my department.

  14. #14
    MembersZone Subscriber Medic162's Avatar
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    As far as federal government and standard compliance....don't make me go there.....!!!! The feds are exempt from thier own regulations.
    Captstanm1-Amen to that! But, this is one that we at least try and not be exempt from They(we-I suppose) just rewrite it to suit the needs/at the time. Amazing what happens when someone gets hurt- but alas, I too, won't go there!
    Brian Rowe
    Paramedic/Engineer
    Colleton County Fire/Rescue

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    With all the comments on face shields, keep this in mind (and if you are going to try for a rule change, here is a place to start):

    Stamped on the side of each shield is a little disclaimer that reads: "Not intended for impact protection. May shatter if struck."

    Take the Bourkes off, and take the faceshield off. They are equally useless.
    Omnis Cedo Domus

    www.hinckleyfd.org

  16. #16
    Forum Member 33motor's Avatar
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    Weruj1,

    so then that makes it right ????????? how old are you ?
    Does it make it right.... NO. I just said I was going to do it, I didn't say either way as to what type of judgement was used. What do you care? Maybe I'm doing my own field testing. As far as age, I'm 36. You know, so far you have really added a lot to this post with your informative replies. But I have a little tidbit for you, I knew exactly what explr985 was saying about flipping the goggles. So, now I have a question for you, you always been that slow on the uptake? Or, do you just like replying with ****y little remarks that add nothing to the post?

    July36,

    has ANYONE ever thought of maybe tightening up the thumbscrews on the faceshield holders?....Those ARE adjustable fromlight to medium to heavy holding power and maybe there shouldnt be any more fuss about the faceshields coming loose.
    Yes, of course I know what the knobs are for. But, when they get screwy with age and abuse from use, they do tend to get weak. They will hold it up for a while, but just work loose again real soon. I get a little tired of messing with them. I also want to try the Bourkes, so right now, even if they were fine, they would be coming off.



    As far as bending rules and such, like I said before, many guys in my Dept. wear them. I just figure, that since they have for years, I should be able to as well. I want to try them in a work setting, not sitting in my living room watching TV through them. I mentioned that I don't know exactly what the rules are for my Dept. about htem, but i would think (knowing my FD) that they probably are a no no. But, my Dept. does have the "ask and it's no, do, and it's ok" flaw. So, I'm simply going to test it.

    I don't feel that I'm putting myself at risk for injury, I will use eye protection, like before, it will just be different. As I also stated, I will carry safety glasses as well. Besides, if you saw my faceshield, you would think it was more dangerous to use it in it's condition anyway.
    http://www.sanantoniofire.org

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  17. #17
    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    I was saying I have no idea what the thread starter was really asking, not what the post above me said as even you figured that out, as I am not that slow on the uptake. I just dont like it when anyone knowlingly (key word) wants to not follow rules for their own personal choice, wether they are 36 or 6.
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  18. #18
    Forum Member 33motor's Avatar
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    Well, at least you posted something worth posting. I respect your opinion on breaking rules. I will however, be one of many in my Dept. and until I have tried the Bourkes for myself, I can't say which style I will stay with. Who knows, I may prefer the fs after all is said and done.
    http://www.sanantoniofire.org

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  19. #19
    Forum Member Weruj1's Avatar
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    and this is what it is really all about ..........be safe wahtever you choose and I liked my FS, but, not compliant gotta go goggles.....it has been great to have some banter with you 33 !
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
    RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
    LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

  20. #20
    MembersZone Subscriber ff7134's Avatar
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    I have a N6 with Bourkes. In a nomex bag in my coat pocket is my ESS Extricator goggles. Those are my eye protection, the bourkes just look good..that is all they are really their for. I would not recommend going against dept policy, that is usually not a good idea.
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