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  1. #1
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    Default Southern California

    Anyone have any news on the 250 homes that have caught fire?


  2. #2
    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Updates on the fire can be found at:

    Grand Prix Fire Info
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    MembersZone Subscriber SamsonFCDES's Avatar
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    They are starting to call for crews from MT.

    I wouldnt mind takeing out our CAFS heavy wildland unit for a shift, we could use the money and it would be one hell of a good time.

    I have my redpack loaded and I am waiting for the call.

    Hell, its time to get out of MT anyway, we are starting to get snow!

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    The latest news about those 250 homes is that they are currently on the ground
    After I'm dead I'd rather have people ask why I have no monument than why I have one

    Official Minister of Philosophy of the IACOJ

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    Forum Member 33motor's Avatar
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    Hey 12truck.....

    Do you think you would still put that smiley face on there if it was your house that was on the ground?
    http://www.sanantoniofire.org

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    Wasnt ment to offend 33 just a weak attempt at humor after a long day. This kinda thing does however make you wonder why people continue to build their houses in the area after seeing what happens year after year. In a round about way they actually deserve it. You touch a hot pot on the stove you learn not to do it again. If your neighbors house burns to the ground year after year wouldnt it make sense to move.
    Last edited by 12TruckIrons; 10-26-2003 at 07:21 PM.
    After I'm dead I'd rather have people ask why I have no monument than why I have one

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  7. #7
    Forum Member 33motor's Avatar
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    12truck,

    Well, I don't agree that they should just move. And I know the don't "deserve it". It's just part of living in an Urban/wildland interface zone. Things like that are gonna happen. I would hope they have tried to take the appropriate precautions to prevent them as best they can. Saying they should just leave is like saying people in Kansas should just pack up and move becuase they live in tonado alley. Sometimes you just have to go on and hope for the best. Not everyone can just pack up and move away. What about their careers, should they just pack those up too? A lot of those people probably have a lot of time invested in their current jobs. Maybe they could just up and leave if they were some college kids who still have not gotten started with thier careers yet. But, I'm sure that's not the case with most, if any of them.

    I know I don't have all the answers as to what they should do.... me, I would probably look into living somewhere else. But, with the terrain being what it is there, is there really any places close by that are better, or safer? Probably not. But, if I were to loose one house, I can say this, even if I didn't move... I would do my best to make sure it was the last house I lost to a wildfire.

    Anyway, just my opinion.
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  8. #8
    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Post 14 dead, approx. 600 homes

    LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Wildfires raging in
    southern California have killed as many as 14 people and
    destroyed around 600 homes and conditions were expected to be
    no better Monday, with hotter temperatures and dry winds
    gusting to 45 miles per hour fueling the flames.
    Those hot, dry Santa Ana winds and minimal humidity created
    optimal conditions for raging fires in at least 10 places that
    have already burned nearly 200,000 acres. The
    fires, which have already caused millions of dollars in
    damages, threaten more than 30,000 homes across the region.
    Four counties were under states of emergency, with a fifth
    facing a fast-moving fire as of Sunday night that threatened to
    greater increase the acreage toll. Disaster-preparedness
    agencies, like the Red Cross, were working feverishly to set up
    the necessary shelters to house thousands of evacuees.
    Monday is expected to bring further efforts to stop the
    fires that have already started and prevent new ones from
    cropping up in the dry region.
    Officials said a decision would be made by Monday on
    closing the Angeles National Forest, north of Los Angeles,
    which was the site of a massive fire last September that
    charred tens of thousands of acres.
    "We've got weather conditions that we expect are going to
    continue like this in southern California into the middle of
    next week," Eric Lamoureux, a spokesman for the state office of
    emergency services, told Reuters.
    State emergency planning executives were also planning to
    shift resources around as needed to battle the blazes, which
    could paralyze some regions that are clouded by smoke and
    congested as a result of closed freeways.
    "The resources of the county from both a law enforcement
    and fire personnel (standpoint) are stretched to the limits,"
    said Greg Cox, chairman of the San Diego County Board of
    Supervisors.

    AVIATION, SPORTS PUT OUT BY FIRE
    San Diego County took the worst of the damage
    Sunday, with four separate fires burning more than 100,000
    acres and killing at least 8 people. A professional football
    game between the San Diego Chargers and Miami Dolphins
    scheduled for Monday night will be played at the Sun Devil
    Stadium in Tempe, Arizona, due to public safety concerns,
    according to the Chargers' web site.
    With airport traffic slowed or grounded throughout the
    region, major airlines were warning customers to check for
    delays and promising to waive fees through Monday for ticket
    changes or refunds. Southwest Airlines canceled all flights
    into and out of southern California late Sunday and warned
    people to call ahead on Monday.
    In Los Angeles, emergency personnel kept a wary eye on the
    Simi and Grand Prix fires, which formed a pincer that
    threatened the city's northern and southeastern boundaries.
    In Chatsworth, 32 miles northwest of Los Angeles,
    residents of multimillion-dollar homes there were told to
    gather their belongings.
    For those who have already lost their homes, officials of
    the state's insurance department were planning to open hotlines
    early Monday morning to answer questions on how to begin the
    process of recovering from the disaster.
    The air-quality advisory in effect for the major southern
    California cities Sunday was to be continued Monday, with
    the normally clean and crisp ocean air now unhealthy for most
    everyone to breathe.
    REUTERS
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  9. #9
    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Post

    RANCHO CUCAMONGA, Calif. (AP) - The wildfires ravaging Southern
    California are fueled by drought- and insect-ravaged vegetation and
    stoked by hot, dry winds racing over terrain untouched by flame or
    ax for decades.
    The combination primed the region for a disaster that began to
    unfold a week ago when fires - some linked to arson - began
    spreading through dense chaparral and forest, officials said.
    "We're set up for what we have all been afraid of for a
    while," said Dan Felix, a fire behavior analyst for the U.S.
    Forest Service.
    By Sunday, the flames had destroyed hundreds of homes and forced
    tens of thousands of people to flee.
    Fierce desert winds gusted as high as 70 mph.
    "This is all wind-driven," Martin Esparza, a Forest Service
    spokesman, said of the wildfires.
    The dreaded Santa Ana wind gets started in the Great Basin, the
    vast expanse of desert that covers much of Nevada, Utah and
    southern Idaho.
    High pressure over the Great Basin forces cool, dry desert air
    toward the southwest and through the mountains of Southern
    California, including the Cajon Pass area, 60 miles east of Los
    Angeles, that was at the center of the largest of the fires burning
    Sunday.
    As the wind travels downhill toward the coast, it is funneled
    through narrow canyons, compressing, heating and accelerating the
    air, said Robert Balfour, a National Weather Service meteorologist.
    The hot, dry wind quickly parches vegetation already stressed by
    years of drought.
    "The fuels are so dry, they too are dictating the growth of the
    fire," Balfour said.
    Much of the brush has grown unchecked for decades.
    "Some of these places do not have any recorded history of
    fire," Esparza said.
    The Santa Ana wind typically blows between September and
    February. A decade ago, the wind exacerbated fires that charred
    thousands of acres, killed three and destroyed 1,000 buildings in
    Malibu, Altadena and Laguna Beach.
    The Santa Anas tend to push flames downhill, toward subdivisions
    built up against Southern California's mountain ranges.
    When the wind subsides, flames climb uphill, mounting the
    chaparral-covered slopes to push into denser forest.
    Officials fear that prospect, since the region's forests contain
    millions of dead and dying trees devastated over the last year by
    tiny beetles.
    Since the spring, the Forest Service and private land owners
    have struggled to remove dead trees and brush within the
    820,000-acre San Bernardino National Forest. Vast swaths of the
    forest, home to 80,000 people, have not been logged for more than a
    century.
    "If the fire starts to crown, racing from one tree to the next,
    it will be an extreme situation," said Stanton Florea, a Forest
    Service spokesman.
    Briefing papers circulated among fire experts this summer said
    fuel levels near Lake Arrowhead in the forest approached those that
    fed the Peshtigo firestorm in Wisconsin on Oct. 8, 1871, which
    killed more than 1,500 people.
    Decades of fire suppression mean a region that could support a
    healthy forest of about 40 trees an acre is crowded with as many as
    568 trees per acre, according to a fire safety briefing prepared by
    the San Bernardino National Forest and the interagency Southern
    California Coordination Center in Riverside. The Peshtigo fire
    region had about 640 trees per acre.

    APTV 10-27-03 0215EST
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  10. #10
    Forum Member RspctFrmCalgary's Avatar
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    At least 14 killed in California wildfires
    Flames destroy 550 homes, threaten thousands more
    Monday, October 27, 2003 Posted: 0512 GMT ( 1:12 PM HKT)

    Ventura County firefighters watch a twister of flame rise from a back fire in Simi Valley, California.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I looked outside my house and I thought I was in the middle of hell.
    -- Joe Wronowicz, Rancho Cucamonga resident


    LA VERNE, California (CNN) -- Wind-whipped wildfires have tormented Southern California from San Diego to suburban Los Angeles, causing 14 deaths, and destroying more than 550 homes and threatening thousands more.

    Eleven people were reported dead Sunday in a 100,000-acre fire in eastern San Diego County and more deaths were being investigated, Sheriff Bill Kolender said.

    Two people died inside their car and three on foot while apparently trying to escape, The Associated Press reported.

    The so-called Cedar fire started Saturday when a hunter lost in the mountains near Julian lit a signal fire, the AP reported authorities as saying. Two other fires in southern and northern areas of the county have torched nearly 20,000 acres.

    San Diego's fire chief said at least 25,000 acres had been destroyed within the city limits. In the Scripps Ranch area alone, 150 homes have been lost, he said.

    "Our hearts go out to those who have lost their homes," San Diego Mayor Dick Murphy told reporters Sunday evening. "This fire is so overwhelming, so devastating."

    Murphy, who surveyed the fire-damaged area by helicopter Sunday, asked residents to reduce their water use to provide more for firefighters. Schools will be closed Monday and "only the most essential services" will be operating.

    He said the city had asked the National Football League to cancel the Chargers game Monday night against the Miami Dolphins. The NFL decided late Sunday that the game would be moved to Tempe, Arizona.

    Fast-moving fires have been raging in Southern California since Tuesday, fanned by low humidity and hot Santa Ana winds blowing 30-35 mph and gusting much higher, keeping the fires erratic and unpredictable, and hampering efforts to contain them.

    Up the coast, fires in the mountains and canyons beyond the eastern suburbs of Los Angeles sometimes hopped fire lines and highways, thwarting firefighters and lighting up homes.

    Two fires in San Bernardino County once separated by at least 10 miles merged at the intersection of interstates 215 and 15, the main freeway between Los Angeles and Las Vegas, Nevada.

    The combined "Grand Prix" and "Old" fires created a blaze of about 72,000 acres in the San Bernardino and Angeles national forests and have so far destroyed more than 375 homes.

    As many as 12,000 homes in the region were under "some form of evacuation," with residents either having already left or preparing to do so, Forest Service information officer Martin Esparza said.

    Two elderly men died Saturday in San Bernardino, apparently from fire-induced stress. A 93-year-old man collapsed and died while watching his home burn, according to the San Bernardino coroner. A 70-year-old man died from a heart attack while evacuating his house, the coroner said.

    Officials also reported a third stress-related death in the San Bernardino area.

    The Grand Prix fire started Tuesday and the Old fire Saturday. Officials believe both were deliberately set.

    Still farther west, more then 2,000 homes in Simi Valley were in danger from a 80,000-acre fire dubbed the Simi Incident, which sparked Friday when a smaller fire jumped State Route 126 and sped west.

    According to the AP, firefighters were working to save the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library in the city.

    Ventura County fire officials confirmed the loss of 12 homes and said the Union Pacific Railroad had closed all rail lines into Simi Valley.

    One of the other fires in the San Diego area came within a quarter-mile Sunday of the Federal Aviation Administration's radar facility at Miramar Naval Air Station.

    When air traffic controllers transferred their responsibilities to a facility in Palmdale, the switch delayed air travel for several hours at several Southern California airports, including Los Angeles International and San Diego International.

    Firefighters took advantage of any lull in the winds, however brief, to put helicopters and fixed-wing tanker aircraft into the air to dump water and retardant on the fires.

    Hundreds of residents of the heavily populated suburbs waited in their cars, on the streets or at shelters for word on the fate of their homes.

    Among those sitting in their vehicles watching the burning skyline Sunday were Sharon Robinson, 62, and her daughter Kim Robinson, 46, who fled their home after throwing whatever clothes and other belongings they could into the back of their truck, according to an AP report

    "We've lived in our home for 35 years," Sharon Robinson told the AP. "Fire has always stopped in the foothills. I never thought it would reach our home."

    "I looked outside my house and I thought I was in the middle of hell, it was redness everywhere, unbelievable," said Rancho Cucamonga resident Joe Wronowicz, who along with his family put off evacuating and put their faith in firefighters to protect their neighborhood.

    California Gov. Gray Davis asked President Bush to declare the four counties affected by the fires disaster areas, paving the way for financial aid.

    "My heart goes out [to] them," Davis said at a news conference in San Bernardino, describing those who have lost or been forced to abandon their homes.

    "This is a terrible situation. They are the worst fires in California in 10 years," Davis said.

    The governor said he has authorized more than 650 fire engines to help the effort.
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    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Some of the worst wildfires in California in the past seven
    decades, based on number of deaths, buildings destroyed or acreage
    burned:
    - October 1999: Jones Fire, near Redding in Shasta County. One
    volunteer firefighter killed, 176 homes and hundreds of other
    buildings destroyed, 26,200 acres of land burned. Cause believed to
    be accidental.
    - November 1993: Topanga Fire, Malibu and nearby areas in Los
    Angeles County. Three deaths; 323 homes; 18,000 acres. Arson
    caused. The fire was among more than 20 that for about two weeks
    raced through Southern California, killing four. More than 1,000
    homes and 193,814 acres of land burned.
    - August 1992: Fountain Fire, Shasta County. 636 buildings;
    63,960 acres. Arson.
    - October 1991: Tunnel Fire, Oakland hills of Alameda County. 25
    dead; 3,276 homes and apartments; 1,520 acres. A fire that was
    believed contained rekindled when an ember ignited a tree.
    - June 1990: Painted Cave Fire, Santa Barbara County. One death;
    641 homes, apartment complexes and other structures; 4,900 acres.
    Arson.
    - November 1980: Panorama Fire, San Bernardino foothills. Four
    dead; 325 homes; 23,600 acres. Arson.
    - September 1970: Laguna Fire, San Diego County mountains. Six
    dead; 382 structures; 175,425 acres. Power lines.
    - November 1966: Loop Fire, Angeles National Forest in Los
    Angeles County. 12 firefighters killed; 2,028 acres. Power line.
    - November 1961: Bel Air-Brentwood Fire, Los Angeles County. 484
    homes; 6,090 acres. Cause undetermined but believed accidental.
    - July 1953: Rattlesnake Fire, Glenn County. 15 firefighters
    killed in Mendocino National Forest; 1,300 acres. Arson.
    - October 1933: Griffith Park Fire, Los Angeles County. 29
    welfare workers clearing brush were killed; about 47 acres. Cause
    undetermined.
    ---
    Sources: California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection,
    local fire agencies, newspaper articles, official and scholarly
    reports.

    (Copyright 2003 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)
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  12. #12
    Senior Member ffdfireexplorer's Avatar
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    I just found out that my relatives in CA. have been evacuated from their home.
    Jaime
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    I hope this works. I took it from our printed newspaper this morning. If it weren't for the implications of the event itself, this would be a really cool picture.

    For the guys who are working this fire, I wish you good luck and hope that things can be brought under control quickly. I have seen what this sort of fire can do, and it just ain't pretty at all.

    **for those of us with bad eyesight, the caption at the bottom reads:

    "Firefighters gaze at a twister of flame from a wildfire Sunday in Simi Valley, CA."
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by MalahatTwo7; 10-27-2003 at 11:23 AM.
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    Forum Member Lewiston2FF's Avatar
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    I have a friend that lives near California State Univ. Campus in San Bernardino. He said that many of the homes around the school he teaches at have been damaged, or destroyed. He said life has gotten really interesting now that the Old and Grand Prix fires have combined. He figures the Simi fire may join up next, then life will get really interesting. I hope the best for him.
    Shawn M. Cecula
    Firefighter
    IACOJ Division of Fire and EMS

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    Forum Member Engine101's Avatar
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    Thats been roughly the size of the blze that fire crews have to contend with, Not to mention the heat and winds

  16. #16
    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Post Monday evening update

    Major California wildfires:
    -CEDAR FIRE, San Diego County: 11 people dead, 206,664 acres
    burned, 528 homes destroyed. Started Oct. 25, apparently by lost
    hunter setting a signal fire. Air traffic nationwide was disrupted
    when flames forced evacuation of a Federal Aviation Administration
    control center. No containment.
    -DULZURA FIRE, San Diego County: No deaths, 34,800 acres burned.
    Started Oct. 26, cause under investigation. 17 percent contained.
    Briefly burned across border into Tijuana, Mexico.
    -PARADISE FIRE, San Diego County: 2 people killed, 57 homes
    destroyed, 17,000 acres. Started Oct. 26, cause under
    investigation. No containment.
    -GRAND PRIX FIRE, San Bernardino County: No deaths, 77 homes
    destroyed, 56,474 acres. Started Oct. 21, blamed on arson. 25
    percent contained.
    -OLD FIRE, San Bernardino County: 2 people killed, 450 homes
    destroyed, 26,000 acres. Started Oct. 25, blamed on arson. 5
    percent contained.
    -SIMI VALLEY, Ventura County: No deaths, 13 homes destroyed,
    90,000 acres. Started Oct. 25, cause under investigation. 5 percent
    contained. Blaze moved past Ronald Reagan Library without causing
    damage.
    -VERDALE FIRE, Los Angeles County: No deaths, 9,000 acres.
    Started Oct. 24, blamed on arson. 85 percent contained.
    -CAMP PENDLETON, San Diego County: No deaths, 8,500 acres.
    Started Oct. 21 on the Marine base, cause under investigation.
    Contained.
    -PIRU FIRE, Ventura County: No deaths, 25,000 acres. Started
    Oct. 23, cause under investigation. 5 percent contained. Damaged
    small corner of Sespe Wilderness and Sespe Condor Sanctuary, but no
    condors are currently in the refuge.
    -MOUNTAIN FIRE, Riverside County: No deaths, nine homes
    destroyed, 10,000 acres. Started Oct. 26, cause under
    investigation. 55 percent contained.
    ---
    Source: California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection
    and local fire officials.
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    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Post 10,000 firefighters....and it's not enough.

    LOS ANGELES, Oct 28 (Reuters) - An army of 10,000
    firefighters struggled on Tuesday to contain the worst
    wildfires in California in years, keeping a wary eye on
    unpredictable winds that could change course at any moment and
    whip the flames toward suburban neighborhoods.
    Ten active fires burned from Los Angeles County to the
    Mexican border, blackening nearly 500,000 acres (200,000
    hectares), killing 14 people, injuring dozens of others and
    destroying more than 1,000 homes.
    Gov. Gray Davis said the wildfires would cost California
    billions of dollars amid the dire financial woes that prompted
    voters to recall him from office, and officials said the cost
    to the state would be unprecedented.
    "This will be the most expensive fire in California
    history, both in loss of property and in cost of fighting it,"
    Dallas Jones, director of the state's Office of Emergency
    Services, said. More than 10,000 firefighters were battling the
    fires, aided by crews from Nevada and Arizona.
    President George W. Bush has declared a state of emergency
    and California officials defended themselves against criticism
    that they had not acted fast enough when the first of 10
    wildfires erupted last week.
    More than 40,000 people have been forced from their homes
    and at least 30,000 more homes stood in the path of erratically
    shifting fires feeding on bone-dry scrub brush and timber.
    "The fire forces in California have aggressively pursued
    every fire in the state as soon as possible with everything we
    could bring to bear," Jones said. "You have to understand,
    though, that with this number of wind-driven fires you
    ultimately run out of resources.
    Officials blame the hot, dry Santa Ana winds that blow
    through southern California each autumn for the ferocity of the
    fires, and firefighters hoped that calmer conditions would
    prevail long enough for them to contain the worst blazes.
    Of great concern to fire officials was a huge blaze just
    north of Los Angeles, which threatened two small foothill
    communities and was burning in areas which were nearly
    impossible for fire trucks to reach.
    MALIBU IN THE CROSS-HAIRS
    "The worst case scenario is that this fire could spread to
    the west across L.A. County through Rocky Peak into Malibu,"
    Tom Foley, California Department of Forestry Battalion chief.
    Malibu, a beach enclave, has been plagued in recent years by
    fires in its canyons and hillsides.
    Governor-elect Arnold Schwarzenegger was traveling on
    Tuesday to Washington, D.C. to meet congressional leaders and
    ensure that California gets the federal funds triggered by
    Bush's declaration of a state of emergency.
    Schwarzenegger said he intended to "make sure that we get
    federal money for people who have had their homes and
    businesses destroyed."
    Fire crews got an unexpected break on Monday when the Santa
    Ana winds began to weaken and forecasts showed cooler
    temperatures and lighter winds by mid-week.
    The most destructive fires, in San Bernardino County about
    50 miles (80 km) east of Los Angeles, destroyed more than 500
    homes. Police believe the twin blazes, which merged into one
    mammoth fire on Sunday, were set by arsonists.
    In San Diego County, three fires -- one set by a hunter
    trying to signal his partner -- ringed the area and threatened
    to merge into one enormous fire of 150,000 acres (60,000
    hectares).
    Police said San Diego-area fires killed 11 people, many of
    whom died trying to run from the flames, and were believed a
    factor in the deaths of about two dozen others.
    The wildfires rained ash across a 500-square-mile (1,300 sq
    km) area, forcing residents indoors and shutting schools,
    businesses and, in San Diego, the county courthouses.
    "We have basically shut down the county," San Diego Mayor
    Dick Murphy said. "We have asked employers to keep employees at
    home. Schools are closed; several of the freeways are shut
    down; everything is at a dead stop. The air quality is
    horrible. ... It is not even healthy to be outside."
    Residents were warned to stay indoors to avoid "extremely
    unhealthy" air, to conserve water and electricity and to keep
    roads clear for emergency crews. San Diego Gas & Electric
    officials said 50,000 customers lost power after fires
    destroyed transmission lines and transformers, and they may not
    regain it for several days.

    Reut02:59 10-28-03
    Proudly serving as the IACOJ Minister of Information & Propoganda!
    Be Safe! Lookouts-Awareness-Communications-Escape Routes-Safety Zones

    *Gathering Crust Since 1968*
    On the web at www.section2wildfire.com

  18. #18
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    Sitting in my chair, listening to the scanner while the young kids respond
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    Question worst ever?

    I had an E-mail from my brother in law today. He lives in Bakersfield and was in LA area yesterday. He is retired from the Forest Service and used to work a Type 1 team. He says this is the worst fire situation he has ever seen and glad he is retired and not half to work it. He has family in the San Diego area that has been displaced and may lose their appartment building.

    Question for he experts out there. Was the CDF a little slow in requesting national teams or did the fire just move too fast. No blame intended, just a question. I know that NJ posted that it takes time to move and that funding was a problem.

    It's tough for an old and retired structure firefighter like me to fully understand the problems and challenges facing our brothers and sisters in CA.

    Stay safe,

    Pete
    Pete Sinclair
    Hartford, MI
    IACOJ (Retired Division)

  19. #19
    MembersZone Subscriber E229Lt's Avatar
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    Default

    Fox News!!!

    Today they brought in "an expert" for comment on the California Wildfires. Thomas Von Essen!!!

    This guy knows about as much about fighting wildfires as he knows about Nuclear Physics, or Urban Firefighting for that matter.

    C'mon FOX, don't insult America

  20. #20
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    Default

    Loo,

    Thats the funniest thing I've heard in a long time. Hell why don't we ask a Marrine Co. Captain in Boston what his comments about CA. Wildfires in are. Leave it to the media.

    I have a question for the Brothers on the west coast...

    After Major flooding in the Midwest many people in fact entire towns were not allowed to re-build in flood plains for obvious reasons.

    Now after years of fires which require Millions of dollars and many thousands of FFs...will these people be allowed to build in these mountianous regions filled with scrub brush and forests. It would seem after listening to people telling the news that they have survived a few fires over the years only to eventually loose their houses this year that the government wouldn't let anyone build here again. For the good of the people and the good of the Government and business(Insurance). Can these people still buy fire insurance?

    Stay safe out there.
    FTM-PTB

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