Don't waste your breath on this loser (the writer) ladies and gentlemen. He obviously just doesn't get it, plain and simple. Never has, never will.
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11-05-2003, 11:17 PM #201
- Join Date
- Oct 2002
- Grand Rapids, MI
He just doesn't get it.
11-06-2003, 12:15 AM #202avfdjoeFirehouse.com Guest
THREATENING ANYONE HERE IS TOTALLY INAPPROPRIATE.
TO THOSE WHO REQUESTED THE THREAD BE LOCKED OR DELETED BECAUSE OF ONE PERSON'S POST, THATS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. THE POST HAS BEEN REMOVED.
11-06-2003, 12:22 AM #203
Let it Go
Methinks the tail has wagged the dog enough.
Last edited by FlyingKiwi; 11-06-2003 at 12:25 AM.Psychiatrists state 1 in 4 people has a mental illness.
Look at three of your friends, if they are ok, your it.
11-06-2003, 07:19 AM #204
COMMENT REMOVED - WEBTEAM
- Join Date
- Nov 2001
I just got a reply from this guy!! He must be very intelligent considering what the Reply I got!!! Cause I told him to call the garbage man when he has a fire at his house!! B.S.!!
With statements like this I'm sure his next column will deal with how psychotic firefighters are. Get real people.
11-06-2003, 07:57 AM #205
- Join Date
- Nov 2003
Smoke & Mirrors
Former Indiana Coach and current Texas Tech Head Coach said it best.
"Most people learn to write in the 3rd grade...and then move on."
11-06-2003, 08:21 AM #206
- Join Date
- Jul 1999
- Flanders, NJ
Re: rich bastardOriginally posted by avfdjoe
COMMENT REMOVED BY WEBTEAM. I am a volunteer firefighter and have been one for just about 6 years now. I love every moment of it. This guy who write "Smoke and Mirros: stop calling firefighters heroes" needs to take a step back and look at look at what firefighters really do. I don't need to go into detail about training because most of us know what it takes to be a firefighter. If he doesnt want firefighters to keep doing what they are doing, its fine with me. But when his 3 million dollar house is being threatened by a ragging wildfire, we will step back and say oh yea we aren't heroes and let his house burn right to the ground! I guess he should go back to writting about the real "heroes", sports players. Screw you!
As I said earlier, FIREFIGHTERS ARE NOT A PROTECTED CLASS OF PEOPLE. People are allowed not to like us. I don't even like us much right now. All of you who wrote emotional, idiotic rantings and ravings should go back now and read the 14 pages of posts and see how proud you are of the fire service at this moment. The more this thread goes on, the more embarrassed I become.
11-06-2003, 09:17 AM #207
I too, found that post extremely offensive and way over the line. I, too reported it to the webteam.
Your outrageous comment give people like Doug Gantbein and William Langeswiche more ammunition to slander the fire service.
Congratulations, you irresponsible (expletive deleted!)
When you cry that "we don't get respect"... remember your post as one of the nails in the coffin of the fire service.
Fortunately, there are many of us who care about the job, honor the traditions and are pulling up the nails as fast as morons like you are putting them down.
Last edited by CaptainGonzo; 11-06-2003 at 09:25 AM."The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY
11-06-2003, 09:32 AM #208COMMENT REMOVED - WEBTEAM.
11-06-2003, 09:32 AM #209
COMMENT DELETED BY WEBTEAM.I just got a reply from this guy!! He must be very intelligent considering what the Reply I got!!! Cause I told him to call the garbage man when he has a fire at his house!! B.S.!!
- Join Date
- Jan 1999
With people like this on our side, its no wonder we face the problems we do.
Everyone needs to take a huge step back here and breath. If you are not qualified to write and educated, intelligent response to someone's opinion.....don't.
Should we as firefighters have taken this article personally..yes.
Should we, as George said (I can't believe it - again George we agree), read this and reflect on what may be true....yes.
I said this in a post about a week ago. We, the Fire Service, suck at selling ourselves. We do what we do and don't ask a lot in return. But when times are tough, we act as though we should be entitled to things. Bull****. We need to sell ourselves, period, end of statement. Will it always work, no. But when you consider that the fire Department is one of the "Big 3" in budget expenses, you think maybe the residents might what some justification as to where the money goes. And just saying we need it isn't enough.
As for the morons that have threatened Dougie Boy, think about the oath you took when you were sworn in. And then maybe consider hanging it up. To even jokingly threaten to let his house burn, or whatever is the biggest disgrace that this article has produced. Worse than anything that Dougie boy could have written.
Think about it.....
Last edited by hfd66truck; 11-06-2003 at 09:42 AM.
11-06-2003, 09:37 AM #210
I have reported avfdjoe and his post also. I have also asked that this thread be locked or deleted.I.A.C.O.J. Charter Member
"Chet, get an inch and a half on that!"
"Not for fame or reward,Not for place or rank. Not lured by ambition or goaded by necessity. But in simple obedience to duty as they understood it. These men suffered,sacrificed,dared all, and died. Let us never forget our fallen friends."
11-06-2003, 11:34 AM #211
- Join Date
- Nov 2002
Indeed your article may have some merit to it. I must agree with you on a few things. We do have one of the best work schedules which allows us some time off now and then. However, its been quite sometime that I can remember getting a good nights sleep here at work. So after pulling that 24 hours at work We now have to go home and catch up on some much needed rest.
If it wasn't for us showing and teaching kids who come in for tours of our house about fire and how its not a toy, we would most definatly have our hands full. You see, Fire prevention is just as much part of our job as Firefighting, which means we have to be teachers as well.
Yea, there are less fires now than before, we take up other skills such as rescue, EMS, and Haz mat. But isnt that another valuable service that we provide to the public?
Firefighters dont have dangerous jobs, your right. I cant see any danger in crawling into a burning building in which we have no visibilty, the super heated environment that keeps us low to the floor. The left over needles from crack addicts laying in the floor of a burning crack house that could stick us in the knee. Traffic accidents in which we have to dodge oncoming vehicles not paying attention.
The only thing on there mind is that we are in THIER WAY, holding THEM UP.
Anyhow, I Bit. Hero is not a term I like to use often about our job. THANKLESS is More Appropriate!
It sure is a good thing we have sports reporters doing such a fine service for the public. Putting life and limb on the line for countless people whom you've never met. GREAT JOB! You're my hero!
11-06-2003, 12:43 PM #212
- Join Date
- Oct 2002
Don't be such as "dummy" Mongoose772
Felt the need to respond to:
"While many volunteer departments are plagued with “jolly whackers” that still think William Shatner made a big comeback on Rescue 911…the reality is that to most professional firefighters, this is just a job."
Paid and union dosen't necessarily mean "professional". I've been involved in the volunteer fire service for 18 years as a firefighter, officer, instructor. I've seen professionals and amateurs in both paid and voluntter departments and the reality for most volunteer firefighters is that for us our fire service is "just a job" as well. A second, unpaid job that takes us from our homes and families in the middle of the night and which we strive to do in the most professional manner humanly possible. This nation's first responders are 90% volunteer. Show some respect brother!
Stay safe, never forget.
11-06-2003, 01:31 PM #213
- Join Date
- Jul 2003
Question: What do you say to someone that can't pass the fire test and is jealous of firefighters (heroes)?
Answer: Nice article *******!!!!.....Slate.com, is that the best place you could find to post your pathetic attempt at "journalism". You are a sad, pathetic, weasel. If you ever need them, I'm sure you'll be very happy to see some of those "union protected adrenaline junkies" Rot in Hell you low life S.O.B.
11-06-2003, 01:48 PM #214
I can't believe what I'm seeing.
I can't believe some of the stuff I'm seeing that has been written here. I see that there are those that wouldn't show up to help this guy if his house was burning or he needed medical aid. Others have posted his address and phone number, then tried to justify it saying that it was already available in the public domain. That's all well and good, but it doesn't mean that you have to make it easy for some fruitcake by finding it for him. Don't be so naieve as to think that there aren't one or two that read these forums.
It's not like that was bad enough, but now "someone" has suggested that he should be tracked down and killed. THAT particular post was quite possibly the most moronic, childish, and potentially dangerous thing I've seen posted here. Congrats...you've achieved a higher plane.
What the hell is wrong with you guys? The article was little more than literary gasoline that he threw onto a pile of coals...a big flash, and it's gone. Was it that he wanted to take away the holy title of "hero"? Is that why you're doing this job? To be called a hero? If that's why, you're no more of a firefighter than the author of this article. There was nothing in what he wrote that warranted some of the responses I've read in this thread.
He called me(us) an adrenaline junkie. There's some truth to that, I guess. At least in my case. I look back at what I used to do for relaxation, and see that the title may not be that far from the truth. In addition to things like baseball and basketball, I've raced motorcycles and cars, ski, spelunked caves, climbed and rapelled cliff faces all over Ohio, Kentucky and West VA, competitively fired firearms, and but for some broken bones from a motorcycle wreck at the time of opportunity, would have taken up skydiving (I never said I was good at any of this stuff ). In fact I still may do the skydiving thing, since my interest is piqued again. I hardly think I needed firefighting in my life to get that adrenalin rush.
It's not the only reason that I do this stuff though. I know the reasons, and quite frankly, I don't care if anyone else knows why or not. I don't need Douggie's or anyone else's validation for anything I feel or do. Firefighting just seems to be a perfect fit for me. I volunteered for years, and now I'm lucky enough to be paid for it, so I'd be doing it either way. I see it as far more my lifestyle than my vocation. My immersion in it has cost me a lot over the years, and not monetarily.
Like has been stated in this thread ad nauseum, this is one person's opinion. Is it that important that so many are disgracing themselves and their brothers and sisters by threatening to not do their jobs and all the other stuff? He upset me as well, but jeeze...he's nobody, and his article is little more than drivel. Be ****ed, but there's a line that several are crossing in their response to this thing.
Those of you that would be willing to turn your backs on anybody whose property was burning or needed some other assistance that you would willingly offer to anyone else that needed it, should consider taking up writing op-ed pieces like this, because your attitude is disgraceful. You're giving his piece national attention. Has it crossed your mind at all that there is going to be a follow up piece to show just how right he was, and what a bunch of immature whiney asses we all are? You've given him more than enough **** to make us all stink. You can rest assured that he won't even mention posts like Chief Reason's or E229Lt's. Why would or should he. He's after the "shock effect", and he certainly has gotten it here.
I wasn't going to address this issue again, but I was laying out my Class A's to do the honor guard gig for one of our retiree's funeral in the morning, and it started me thinking what he would have thought seeing this kind of response to the musings of such an obscure author. Knowing his attitude, I'm sure he would have been far more upset by some of the responses of the "firefighters" here than by the article.
I think E229Lt said it best when he said:...we don't look at ourselves as heroes. The pain came from the inference that we do.
Believe me, Doug's article is rapidly becoming less and less of an issue for me than the crap that some people are posting in response to it.
Last edited by Steamer; 11-06-2003 at 02:02 PM.Steve Gallagher
"I don't apologize for anything. When I make a mistake, I take the blame and go on from there." - Woody Hayes
11-06-2003, 01:49 PM #215
- Join Date
- Dec 2002
We aren't all heros, but the wife and kids of some drunk a-hole who comes home at 3am and decides to cook breakfast just befor he passes out and sets the house on fire. They think we are pretty good people to see in the driveway.And a lot of us do that for free.
11-06-2003, 01:56 PM #216
Steamer I couldn't agree more. Enough said. Let it go now. This guy wants publicity. Let's not give him what he wants."We shouldn't be opening firehouses in Baghdad and closing them in New York City."
11-06-2003, 02:17 PM #217
Most have been feeding him since this got posted .......IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
"but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
11-06-2003, 03:08 PM #218
IAFF President: Author's 'Ill-Gotten Gold'
HAROLD A. SCHAITBERGER, IAFF NEWS RELEASE
Dear Mr. Weisberg :
I write in reference to Douglas Gantenbein's posting on Friday, October 31. While I will withhold my comments regarding his character and sensibility for the face-to-face meeting I hope to arrange, I will share some broader thoughts here.
Mr. Gantenbein, among other exploits, spent four months on a fireline in the West and now styles himself as the arbiter of all things related to fires and fire fighting.
His experience, however brief, has allowed him to fully comprehend all of the greedy motives of the nation's fire and rescue professionals--and he has graciously consented to share that insight with us.
And greedy we apparently are. Mr. Gantenbein has us slyly purveying our propaganda" using the trappings," cards," and labels" of heroism" while we sleep" at our cushy job."
Our job, he reminds us, isn't that dangerous" and is usually not terribly onerous," though he manages in the same breath to excoriate us (adrenaline junkies") for the very real risks that we take. In Mr. Gantenbein's world we are truly damned if we do...
Though there is much with which to take exception in an article best characterized as revolting, nothing matches his disgraceful decision to refer to funerals for fire fighters killed-in-the-line-of-duty as tasteless" and absurd." In his sociopathic zeal to de-mythologize fire fighters, must he really sink so low?
To Mr. Gantenbein we would say that the world is full of heroes, if being a hero means a person who exhibits a measure of selfless courage.
We suspect that the public reserves some special depth of feeling for those who are courageous on behalf of others. Of course, that includes not just fire fighters, but police officers, social workers, health care professionals and all those who truly serve the rest of us. And we believe that the public, despite Mr. Gantenbein's rotting prose, will continue to choose its heroes wisely.
Perhaps if we are truly lucky, Mr. Gantenbein is at this very moment working for a month or two in a busy hospital so that he may inform us of the lavish working conditions and outrageous pay of the nation's nurses. Or perhaps he will teach for a term in an inner-city school in an attempt to persuade us that public school teachers are over-paid and under-worked.
Perhaps--but we think not.
It is however, very likely that Mr. Gantenbein will continue to line his pockets with ill-gotten gold, derived from those who really serve our society. In so doing, he will only underscore the obvious: that when we look upon the world we tend to see what is in our own hearts. And in his case it's a rather bleak and barren view. Still, we wish him the best in his search for the villains among us, however misguided his search may be.
Harold A. Schaitberger
Dont buy Gantebbeins book, steal it...
And then burn it.
Seriously, do NOT buy anything with this guys name anywhere near it.
Yep, thats me, I cant lie. I love mortorcycles, paintball, and a lot of other dangerous stuff. If that makes me less of a person, then oh well, I would rather be an animal anyway.
Yes, fighting fire gives me an adrenaline fix. Haul me away, lock me up, I am an adict.
-Brotherhood: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
-Mistakes: It could be that the purpose of you life is to serve as a warning to others.
-Adversity: That which does not kill me postpones the inevitable.
-Despair: Its always darkest before it goes Pitch Black.
11-06-2003, 03:32 PM #219
- Join Date
- Nov 2002
- cincy O-HI-O
Let this guy say what he will, because no matter what is said, I still will go to work, I will still love my job, and I still will not need validation of it from anyone. I don't want to be a hero, I don't want anyone to take notice of what I may (or may not) do. I will just keep doing what I do, because it is what I want in my life and I love it no matter what any one person may write..."We had trouble putting out the fire because the house and everything in it was burning at the time"---The Chief while speaking to the press--no lie
11-06-2003, 04:27 PM #220
- Join Date
- Nov 2001
- Still looking for Waldo. Have you seen him?
OK, who's the fireman that boned this guy's wife when he was at Star Trek convention? He's mad at us for something!
When our forefathers drafted the Constitution, I'm sure they never expected freedom of speech reveal such an idiot! Just when when I thought I had met the world's biggest jackass, this guy went and wrote an article!
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