1. #1
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    Default Seat belt?? or no seat belt??

    After reading the article about Engine 6 in Vegas and reading some of the comments it made me curious as to some of the policies on seatbelts.Not to many guys in my department, including my self wear seatbelts on runs. Probably because my department does not have any SOP's regarding the use of seatbelts in the rigs. I have actually tried to wear it a few times but I found that it gets in the way of everthing else you have on or are putting on. Do any of your departments have guidlines or rules for wearing seatbelts? Also do you like wearing the seat belt or like me find it getting somewhat in the way?
    P.S. I always wear mine in my person vehicle, feel umcomfortable without it!

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    I ALWAYS wear my seatbelt, whether I'm in one of the emergency vehicles going to a call or in my personal vehicle. The only time I am not belted in a vehicle is when I'm at work and attending in the back of the ambulance.
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    in my pov i always wear my seatbelt if leaving town. on calls i never remember my seatbelt because of the adrenaline rush. it also seems like between putting my coat on and gloves and talking on the radio it would be too bulky to get on. although on the way back i usually dont have my coat on so i will wear the belt. and if we are going some where for training and i dont have my gear on yet i will wear the belt.
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    Default seat belts

    I wear them when we're cruising around town, and when I'm driving. But I usually don't wear them on the way to a call because, like you said, they get in the way

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    I like to ride the bumper and hang onto the hand rail with one hand makeing siren sounds at the top of my lungs...



    Seriouly, in my VFD our SOP is bealt up ALWAYS!!! Exception being pump and roll stuff on a wildfire, you are in and out of the truck so much the bealt gets to be a real hindrance.

    Most of us have a federal fire background (BLM, USFS, etc..) so it has been hardwired into us to buckle up.
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    I always wear my seatbelt in my truck, as does the rest of my family. Like 55 said, I feel uncomfortable without it on.

    As for on the engine.. I don't wear it. We have SOP's that state we should wear it. I made an honest attempt when I started... we had an open cab, and I thought it was the best thing to do. But, even before we got our enclosed cab I stopped. It's just too much of a hassle. It does not make it right... the right thing, the smart thing, is to wear it. I would not advise anyone to not wear one. I'm just being honest and telling you I don't. Now that we have the enclosed cab I'm not even usually in my seat when we start to roll... we usually put our gear on enroute to save time. About the only attempt to to be really safe is my LT. who puts the keeper strap on his SCBA. Since his faces forward he feels it's a danger to not be strapped down. He also won't allow us to carry FE tools in the cab... something one of the other shifts did for a while. He feels that if there is an accident that they create a hazard by flying around. So, until they stopped doing it for the same reasons, we had to put them back every shift. I do agree with him about it though.. I don't want to be hit by a halogen in a roll over or otherwise... after all, I'm already pushing my luck.
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    Wow 33motor, I never thought of flying halligans in a crash. We do the same in our truck company; many tools mounted in the cab, but they are all secured down by brackets or "locks". But you never know what can happen!

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    You think wearing a seatbelt "gets in your way"? Thats real smart. Lets look at some other things that are "in the way"...

    See how "in the way" the windshield is when you go flying through it. Or see how "in the way" your other firefighters are you soar through the air and land on them. Also, see how "in the way" the roof and side walls of the cab are when your body gets bounced off of them repeatedly.

    Wear your seatbelt. Period.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Depends, if a medical call, service, or just cruisin around, yes I do. If a MVA or a fire call, I don't until I am finished getting dressed. Have had words of advise from firefighters about rollovers, if the truck rolls left, you start going to the right and visa-versa. Plus we have really good drivers, or atleast the ones I've rode with.
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    Originally posted by explr985
    Plus we have really good drivers, or atleast the ones I've rode with.
    Tell that to the guys from one of our neighboring departments who were pulled over on the side of the road and the shoulder and part of the road gave way and they rolled NUMEROUS times down an embankment. I bet if you were to go and ask ANY ONE of them they'd say they should have had belts on, oh...... my whole point here ..... it doesn't matter whether or not someone is a good driver, when **** hits the fan you had better be ready
    Last edited by PFire23; 11-05-2003 at 06:35 PM.
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    In Illinois it is easy seat belt use is the law.
    How may of us have to die before we realize that seatbelts save lives. How can we tell the public to buckle up then get in the rig and not put it on.
    Are you responding to your house on fire? Hell even if you are if you get killed enroute to the fire you don't help anyone.

    We can't move the rig without everyone buckled up. And that is the way it should be. Not buckling up is the same as going in without gear, you can do it till something happens. Lets face it we could mask up without gear and be fine most of the time. Why don't we push for that. That gear is hot and takes time to put on, so lets not do it.

    Wear you seatbelt.

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    It's funny that you should post this. I try to always wear my seat belt. We had a run earlier for a MVA. On the way I did not have my belt on and was just thinking how I should have worn it. The other day when we were going to a training exercise I got in the back of the engine with another guy who is pretty new. I told him to put his belt on and he was just like "why?" I can't believe the things we do sometimes.
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    Policies in both paid FD & VFD are that the seatbelts MUST be worn when the vehicle is in motion.
    I ALWAY wear my seatbelt!
    I have my pants and coat on before I board the apparatus. I don't have any problem getting my SCBA & other equipment on with my seatbelt securely fastened.
    In the VFD where I'm a Captain, I make it a point to ask on EVERY call whether everyone in the apparatus are buckled in.

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    I don't until I am finished getting dressed.
    It's just too much of a hassle.
    we usually put our gear on enroute to save time.
    I usually don't wear them on the way to a call because, like you said, they get in the way
    Probably because my department does not have any SOP's regarding the use of seatbelts in the rigs.
    C'mon you guys- you're killing me here!

    How the hell can you honestly not wear a seatbelt when you think about the sort of calls we go to- people ejected from vehicles, rollovers, etc.

    How the hell can you honestly not wear a seatbelt when you look at the sort of situations we are driving in when responding- through red lights, stop signs, overtaking other vehicles, etc.

    How many people can honestly stand up and say that they've seen what's left of someone who gets ejected from an MVA? It's not a nice picture.

    We, the FF's, of all people in the world should know the importance of these devices.

    You don't need an SOP to tell you to put the belt on- do it for your benefit.

    CLICK HERE for a recent photostory of 3 people that were ejected from an MVA. All 3 are in a serious condition with head, neck and back injuries!

    For those that are not ready when that truck pulls out of the station- don't get on board. Get dressed before the truck turns out....

    This whole argument amazes me.
    Luke

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    Their ain't no argument on our department, besides its the law up here in the great white north, no exceptions. Susspensions ahve been imposed as a result of non compliance.

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    I know they are not worn enough, including in our dept. The traditional excuse has always been that we only respond 1.5 - 2 kms away at less than 50kph.

    Unfortuantely, the facts speak for themselves. For volunteer ff's, the top causes of death are:

    1. Heart Attack
    2. Motor Vehicle Accident
    3. Non-fire related accident (falls, etc.)

    For career ff's, simply swap numbers 1 & 2 around (they are in a little better shape, but they drive just as bad ).

    We really do need to change this one. The seat belt only takes 5 seconds to apply, and 2 seconds to release at the scene.
    Last edited by mcaldwell; 11-06-2003 at 05:54 AM.
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    Hello. It doesn't matter how good your driver is. You can have the absolute BEST apparatus driver in the world. That is not going to do $hit when somoene crosses the yellow line and plows into you. Think McFly!!

    Let me share my seatbelt story. I used think the same way all of you people that think it isn't neccessary think. "Oh, it's a fire truck, what do I need a seatbelt for. It will just slow me down." Well, one day, I was sitting shotgun in the engine as we pulled out of the station for an MVA. We had to take a left out of the parking lot and basic physics pushed your body to the right while making a left turn. It so happens that my door was not shut properly or I was leaning on the handle or something. So, here I am trying to sound all professional on the radio calling enroute when mid sentence, the door opened and I started to go out the side of the truck. Imagine my voice signing on while staring at the road hanging out of the truck. That my friend, will learn you. I wear a seatbelt everytime I get in the truck now.

    Unfortunately, if you aren't smart enough to think of it on your own which it seems there are many here, it will take an incident that scares the bejeasus out of you. Hopefully, that incident doesn't mame or killy you but the probability for it to do so is very high.

    Wear your seatbelt. There is NO excuse not to, ever.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Depends, if a medical call, service, or just cruisin around, yes I do. If a MVA or a fire call, I don't until I am finished getting dressed.

    How about getting dressed before you leave the station? Works for me.
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    Originally posted by Duffman



    How about getting dressed before you leave the station? Works for me.


    Have tryed that, the crews are too fast, plus most get dressed in the truck too. I kinda have picked up that habbit now too. And belive me, they'll leave ya at the station, almost missed the truck one night getting dressed.
    No longer an explorer, but I didn't wanna lose my posts.

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    I think it's pretty obvious what everybody "Should" do. Most people here will've seen what an unrestrained person in an MVA can look like, it's not pretty. Belt up ,is the right thing to do. For our safety, and for that matter everybody else's in the appliance. There is no other answer to whether it should be done.....and for the record nobody as yet as said that it shouldn't.

    What does astound me though is the amount of people trying to justify why they don't do it. They know it's wrong and lots of people here just don't want to except it. "It's hard gettin my SCBA on", "I have to get dressed in the appliance", "It's uncomfortable...."..... errr, stop with all these excuses. What it comes down to is laziness. All these things are trivial, your going to save 5 seconds* at the most... this isn't going to make a difference to anyone your trying to save, but it sure will make a difference when your appliance gets hit by a DUI head-on at 90km/hr....

    By the way, i'm not saying i'm any different here. 9 out of 10 times I will remember to put my belt on on an emergency call (lights and bells).... but if we go out non-emergency, i'll forget and that figure becomes 2 or 3 out of 10. There are no excuses here, it should be 10 out of 10, 100% of the time.

    Stop with the excuses and just cop the fact that you do something stupid, maybe you'll be able to learn from it.

    *For those who disagree, get a stopwatch and see exactly how long 5 seconds is. Think about it, all you have to do is put your feet in your boots, pull your overtrousers up and have one arm into your jacket before you get on your appliance.

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    posted by myself..

    It's just too much of a hassle. It does not make it right... the right thing, the smart thing, is to wear it. I would not advise anyone to not wear one. I'm just being honest and telling you I don't.
    Excuses, I make none... so if someones going to quote me, don't act like I don't agree with your side of the coin.

    ADSNWFLD's post..

    Are you responding to your house on fire? Hell even if you are if you get killed enroute to the fire you don't help anyone.
    Well, to be honest, you're right that I won't be able help anyone... but that stands reguardless... if we are in a wreck, we cannot proceed to the fire anyway. Our SOP's state we have to stop and notify PD, and fill out the accident report. So, that's a mute point.

    When I think about the new engineer we have I think I would be better off buckled in... . I agree with the ones who say EVEYONE needs to wear a belt. I just doubt I'll be one who does. Who knows, I may try and make it a habit, if nothing else, at least when we are just out and about, or on a med run... I just don't see me doing it for fires again.
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    Originally posted by 33motor
    Well, to be honest, you're right that I won't be able help anyone... but that stands reguardless... if we are in a wreck, we cannot proceed to the fire anyway. Our SOP's state we have to stop and notify PD, and fill out the accident report. So, that's a mute point.
    And when your body becomes a lifeless chunck of road pizza with bits of the windshield stuck in your head, the police report will be the least of your worries.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Its amazing how little people learn..More and more the statement "200 years of tradition unimpeeded by technology" rings true. We have firefighters falling out of apparatus and getting run over by their own rig, firefighters getting crushed by their own rolled over apparatus, and firefighters hitting dashes in mva's. What does it take to get it through our thick heads?
    Explorer, I don't know where you run, but no one gets on my rig with their gear in a bag. My quint seats 8. Can you imagine the amount of space that 8 sets of gear would take up if everyone got in ungeared? I can be in my gear (like someone said, feet in boots, pull up the pants and get an arm in the coat) in about 15 seconds. If it takes you longer, you need more practice.
    Ive been to enough accidents to know seatbelts work!

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    Have tryed that, the crews are too fast, plus most get dressed in the truck too. I kinda have picked up that habbit now too. And belive me, they'll leave ya at the station, almost missed the truck one night getting dressed.
    explr985, ring the bell, schools in.

    If everyone you respond with is in too much of a hurry to let the crew get dressed you face one of two problems.

    1. Your folks don't know how to put their gear on

    2. Your folks are too hyped up on adrenaline to know what is good for them

    They'll leave you at the station, so what. Get on the next rig out the door.

    You have yet to offer a single good reason for not wearing your seatbelt, or for dressing while the vehicle is responding.
    "We shouldn't be opening firehouses in Baghdad and closing them in New York City."

    IACOJ

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    On my deparment Explorers, such as my self have to wear seat belts, but i don't think the firefighters have to.

    My dad was saved beacuse of his seat belt. he was responding to a fire in the winter. just as he was taking a corrner one of the walls inside the tank broke, causing the water to shift to the right, over goes the truck. he was hanging in by his seat belt. but the truck was demolished.
    IF YOU FOLLOW ALL OF THE RULES YOU MISS ALL OF THE FUN.

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