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  1. #1
    Truckie SPFDRum's Avatar
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    Angry Child chained to bed dies in fire.

    From the Firehouse Homepage:
    Arkansas child chained to bed dies in fire. Linked below:
    http://cms.firehouse.com/content/art...Id=46&id=21742


    Anyone else think the death penalty may be to easy?
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
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  2. #2
    Forum Member PFire23's Avatar
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    Ya know, THERE are words for people like that, and sick twisted bastards really isn't it, but it is what is least likely to get me banned. YES the death penalty is too easy on them. As a matter of fact, I think if you can kill someone, or put them in a position such as this child was placed, then you can damn well be put to death in the same damn manner in which your victim died. THAT is justice.


    Rest in Peace Molly Holt. Please know that not all Mommy's and Daddy's are vicious, cruel and uncaring.
    To the world you might be one person, but to one person you just might be the world.

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  3. #3
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    sickening how stupid and cruel people are!!!

  4. #4
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    That story is just a glimpse of how sick and sad this world really is.
    "when in doubt, cut 'em out"

  5. #5
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    BASTARDS
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  6. #6
    Sr. Information Officer NJFFSA16's Avatar
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    Post Updated information

    CLARKSVILLE, Ark. (AP) - A 10-year-old girl chained to a bed by
    her ankles died in a house fire and the child's parents face
    manslaughter charges.
    Sheriff Wesley Kendrick said investigators believe the fire was
    accidental. Four people made it out of the home - the parents and
    their two other children.
    The body of Molly Holt was found by firefighters in her bedroom
    under debris where the roof had collapsed, said Chief Deputy Jerry
    Dorney. Investigators also found a chain and padlock that they
    determined had secured the girl to her bed, Dorney said.
    "The reason that the child was chained to the bed is unknown at
    this time," Prosecutor David Gibbons said Wednesday. "I do know
    that there is no justifiable reason to chain the 10-year-old child
    to their bed."
    Molly's parents, Lloyd Holt, 32, and Teresa Dick, 31, were
    arrested on a felony manslaughter charge. At a hearing Wednesday, a
    judge appointed a public defender to the case and set bond at
    $100,000 for each of the parents, said Deputy Prosecutor Bruce
    Wilson. The couple were jailed at Clarksville.
    Investigators believe the fire started in the front of the
    house, where the girl's bedroom was located, but they hadn't
    determined by Wednesday what caused the fire.
    "The entire house was completely destroyed and on the ground,"
    Dorney said. "The only thing standing was a brick chimney. At this
    point, we believe the fire was accidental."
    The chief deputy would not disclose what the parents told
    investigators when asked why their daughter was chained to the bed.
    He said when deputies arrived at the scene, the father said he
    wasn't able to get Molly out of the house.
    The body was sent to the state Crime Laboratory in Little Rock
    for an autopsy.
    Dorney said deputies received a call at 12:45 a.m. Monday of the
    fire about 13 miles north of Clarksville. The nearest residence to
    the two bedroom, wood-frame rent house was about a quarter-mile
    away.
    When deputies arrived, the front of the house was engulfed in
    flames, and Lloyd Holt told them he believed Molly was still
    inside.
    Both parents are employed, although Dorney said he didn't know
    exactly where. "We've not had any problems with them that I can
    remember off the top of my head," he said.
    The couple's other children - a girl about 5 and a boy about 3 -
    were placed with relatives, Dorney said.

    (Copyright 2003 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)
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  7. #7
    MembersZone Subscriber LAFireParamedic's Avatar
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    Default *Shakes Head*

    This is just beyond words , I cant really understand how a parent can do this to there child. I hope both of them get put away for a long time. This sounds more like muder than manslaughter.

  8. #8
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    This is one of the most disturbing things that I have ever read. For "parents" (in this case, I used that term very loosely) to do this to any of their child is unspeakable. They are several cases of child abuse in and around philadelphia that I just cannot believe would actually take plce. This one tops them by a long shot.

    And for the "experts" not to understand what is wrong and do not have an idea why some children behave the way they do these days, wake up. It is situations like this that should open their eyes and do something for the good of everyone. Maybe there would be less violence and drug abuse amongst kids and teenagers. Are we going to prevent everything, No, but someone has to start somewhere.

    I wholeheartly agree with Pfire23, put the parents in the same situation. Anything else would not be justice. Hopefully, we will never have to read anything else like this.

  9. #9
    Forum Member ThNozzleman's Avatar
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    What the hell were they thinking???
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  10. #10
    Forum Member firemangeorge's Avatar
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    I suggest that you all wait until we find out why the parents had chained the girl to her bed. We don't what the history is with this child. As the parent of a ten year old, I can tell you that a child of this age is able to operate any lock that an adult can, which means that child can get up and leave any time they please. As a firefighter in a large city, I have had to respond to children of this age and younger wandering around the streets in the wee hours. Everyone is shocked that a parent would let their child wander out of the house. The truth is that the parent could not prevent the child from leaving, especially when the parents are asleep. No parents can possibly maintain a 24 hours watch of their children, and proper parenting will allow a parent to keep most children in bed. However, there are always exceptions to this, and children with severe behavioral problems cannot be controlled through normal means. Consider that this may be a case of a parent who has reached their wits end with the child, and chaining them to their bed to keep them safe at home seemed the only solution. I am not saying that this is what happened, but before we start all of this "I can't believe they could do this to their child" talk, I suggest we get all of the facts.
    I felt I must point this out because of a fire that occurred in my city some years ago. A single father who worked nights locked his children in their rooms so that he could get some sleep, so he could keep his job, so he could feed his children. The general public was of course shocked that he locked them in their rooms, "How Awful!", "Sick Bastard", "Child Abuser". If you had seen his face when the bodies were brought out, you would have known why he did it. He loved his children and was trying to protect them. As we all know, most people believe that a fire is the last thing that will happen to them. The dangers they perceive for their children don't normally include losing them to fire. It really doesn't happen that often, and gets far less publicity than abduction, molestation, etc. We may not always make the best decisions when it comes to protecting our children, but perhaps it seemed like the best answer at the time.

    May you rest in peace Molly Holt and all children who are victims of fire.

    FG
    See You At The Big One

  11. #11
    Forum Member PFire23's Avatar
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    firemangeorge, I'm sorry, but I beg to differ with you on your view here. As a parent of a child who had some pretty major behavioral issues and who would run away from home on a regular basis, not once did I ever lock him up or chain him up. I attended many different parenting classes (all offered free of charge), and NOT one of those classes EVER, EVER promoted any of the actions outlined in your post. As for the father who "locked his children in their rooms so that he could get some sleep, so he could keep his job, so he could feed his children", save that argument for someone who's buyin'. I work many nights, I also have 3 children and guess what, ALL of my kids will be courteous enough to understand that I have to sleep if I've worked an all nighter, of course this is if they aren't in school; and even when they were smaller I "cat napped" on the couch with one eye open to keep an eye on them. There is NEVER any excuse for LOCKING, CHAINING OR PENNING up a child, I don't give a crap who you are or what excuse you are using. They are NOT animals and do not deserve to be treated as such. And I WILL argue this point until I'm blue in the face, this is stupidity and cruelty that is unmatched.
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  12. #12
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    I agree with Pfire on this. When a sherrif decides to bring back the "chain gang" concept as a mean of incarceration, people scream holy hell that is is demeaning, dehumanizing and cruel and unusual punishment.

    Locking a child in a room is wrong...chaining a child to a bed is abuse pure and simple. It is a human rights vilation.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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  13. #13
    Forum Member firemangeorge's Avatar
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    Pfire,

    I will ask you this:

    Did the sides of your childs baby bed have rails that looked like a pen? Did you ever use a gate at the top of a flight of stairs? Do you buckle your children into their seats when they are in the car? Did you ever use a child safety seat?

    "There is NEVER any excuse for LOCKING, CHAINING OR PENNING up a child, I don't give a crap who you are or what excuse you are using."
    See You At The Big One

  14. #14
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    You can't really be trying to compare a gate at the top of a stairway to a chain and padlock attached to a bed are you? A car seat to locking them in a room?

    Could not that single father have simply put a lock on the top of the doors to the house exits as opposed to locking them in their rooms? God forbid they have to wake up and use the bathroom at night...
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  15. #15
    Forum Member PFire23's Avatar
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    Originally posted by firemangeorge
    Pfire,

    I will ask you this:

    Did the sides of your childs baby bed have rails that looked like a pen? Did you ever use a gate at the top of a flight of stairs? Do you buckle your children into their seats when they are in the car? Did you ever use a child safety seat?

    "There is NEVER any excuse for LOCKING, CHAINING OR PENNING up a child, I don't give a crap who you are or what excuse you are using."


    OHHHH GEEEZUS here we go with the misguided logic again. George, yes I used a crib and yes I used a gate at the top of stairs and ohhhhh bad bad mommy me yep I used a play pen occasionally too, yep on car seats, booster seats and seat belts. BUT, those are LEGALLY accepted SAFETY measures for infants, small children and the seat belt is an accepted safety feature for all humans. I do NOT agree with PADLOCKING, OR CHAINING a child to a bed, or anything else. Good God Man, you actually find this acceptable. This argument that you have just used doesn't hold water, c'mon.


    Thank you and please come again when you are better armed and have a better sense of logic
    To the world you might be one person, but to one person you just might be the world.

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  16. #16
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Originally posted by firemangeorge
    Pfire,

    I will ask you this:

    Did the sides of your childs baby bed have rails that looked like a pen? Did you ever use a gate at the top of a flight of stairs? Do you buckle your children into their seats when they are in the car? Did you ever use a child safety seat?

    "There is NEVER any excuse for LOCKING, CHAINING OR PENNING up a child, I don't give a crap who you are or what excuse you are using."
    Firemangeorge...

    There is a HUGE difference between infants and toddlers and the methods of protecting them from harm. Failure to protect them from harm is child abuse.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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  17. #17
    MembersZone Subscriber ff7134's Avatar
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    I close the bedroom door on my 1.5yr old so he doesn't get up in the middle of the night and wander off( I have a little thing over the handle yuou have to sqeeze to turn the knob.)

    Now I feel like crap everytime I put him to bed, but that is better than him waking up in the middle of the night(which he does all the time) and getting into something or out of the house. But I would never in a million years chain my son to his bed. That is crazy!! and that is nothing like having him in a crib.
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  18. #18
    Forum Member PFire23's Avatar
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    Jeff, that is a legally, approved and socially acceptable sold in most stores, safety item. I myself used those door knob covers as a safety precaution when my kids were younger.


    But...... ya know, I just can't remember the last time I was in WalMart and they had a display of leg irons complete w/padlock

    That one safety measure musta just slipped right past me.
    To the world you might be one person, but to one person you just might be the world.

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  19. #19
    Truckie SPFDRum's Avatar
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    firemangeorge quoted:
    Consider that this may be a case of a parent who has reached their wits end with the child, and chaining them to their bed to keep them safe at home seemed the only solution.
    Well george, I hate to say, being a parent isn't easy, but chaining your kids to a bed has NO excuses.
    I too work in a big city with a service that also provides ALS coverage, and have yet to see this behavior justified.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
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  20. #20
    MembersZone Subscriber ff7134's Avatar
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    Thanks,

    Kid thinks he is Houdni (sp) And Evil Kinevil....but that is paybacks for all the stuff I did as a kid . Got to do somethin' to protect our 4th Generation Firefighter.
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