Thread: layoffs

  1. #1
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    Thumbs down layoffs

    Have the rumors started flying around anywhere else. For the second year in a row they are talking layoffs. We managed to save the jobs last year. But i don't think it will happen again.

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    UGH!(*@!(

    What a terrible thing to come into work unsure of whether your job will be there.

    I'm sorry brother, let us know if we can help

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    Most of the paid departments in this area are being threatened with layoffs. One department is having about 25% of their members layed off this week unless something happens to prevent it.
    Mark
    Firefighter / Paramedic
    IAFF Local 10

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    Last year many departmnets laid off members here in Massachusetts when a state budget shortfall of $3 billion was "balanced." This year I hear a low number of $2 billion in state budget shortfalls. Those departmnets that skirted layoffs last year are going to WHACKED this year. Those departments that laid off guys last year are going to lay even more off this year.

    I have a friend who is on the Job in Fitchburg, MA and he was laid off in June, one of eight to be laid off. In addition 12 retirements that occurred last year or since June have not been rehired. These guys are going to probably be laid off alond with a lot more guys this coming June.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

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    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

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    Angry Layoffs

    Isn't it amazing that the state that laysoff the most firefighters (Mass.) is the same state that Senator Kerry is from. What has Sentor Kerry done for the firefighters of Mass.??? Why did the IAFF back this man if he can not even save the jobs of the firefighters in his own state??? New York State is not far behind Mass. Our small dept of 34 firefighters is looking at a 25% cut in man power at the first of the year. What will Senator Kerry do for us???

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    I THINK THE BIGGER QUESTION IS HOW IS A REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT GOING TO TREAT THE FIREFIGHTERS OF THE US IF HE IS REELECTED??

    AT LEAST SEN KERRY IS FROM MASSACHUSETTS AND MASS. IS A LOT MORE PRO UNION AND PRO LABOR THAN A PRESIDENT FROM TEXAS. WHAT HAS PRESIDENT BUSH DONE FOR ANY OF US??

    SEN. KERRY HAS COME OUT IN FAVOR OF FIREFIGHTERS AND THE FIRE SERVICE. THE CURRENT PRESIDENT REALLY COULD CARELESS ABOUT ANY OF US.

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    That's alright, Kerry is floundering in a mjor way. He is losing in polls right here in Massachusetts aginst everyone one.

    As for supporting firefighters, I think President Bush does support firefighters, he just is not pandering to the union.

    I THINK THE BIGGER QUESTION IS HOW IS A REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT GOING TO TREAT THE FIREFIGHTERS OF THE US IF HE IS REELECTED??
    I have to wonder why anyone would make a decision about a candidate for president based upon how they will treat any one, small segment of the greater population of the United States. One should vote for a candidate because of how they will perform for the common good of all citizens of the United States, not based on one issue.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

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    AT LEAST SEN KERRY IS FROM MASSACHUSETTS AND MASS. IS A LOT MORE PRO UNION AND PRO LABOR THAN A PRESIDENT FROM TEXAS. WHAT HAS PRESIDENT BUSH DONE FOR ANY OF US??
    What the heck is that supposed to mean? You taking a shot at the prez or at TX or both?

    I can think of NO TX Dept's that have to face this issue. Lay offs are never discussed in my Dept... or even in my old depts.

    My deepest regrets to those who are faced with this, especially at this time of year.
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    Thumbs down LAYOFFS

    Bush is definatly NON-UNION. He proposed that all federal firefighters drop their Unions. Unions have their purpose, but sometimes they loss touch with reality. The IAFF could careless about the small 34 man Unions. They only care about the big departments with lots of union dues. We are suppose to be in the IAFF and we are also part of the AFL- CIO. How come each has picked a different canidate. You think they could have picked one together instead of fighting each other.

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    Why do you say that the IAFF only cares about larger locals? Did something happen where the international failed to support you or back you?

    Just curious...

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    Thumbs up Whitpain Township PA, IAFF local 4054 is getting our help!

    Well, Whitpain Township PA, IAFF local 4054 is getting our help. The township supervisers there are looking to cut their staff 70%. They are only a 6 man Dept. north of Philadelphia. We are planning to go to the next Township supervisers meeting on December 2 at 8pm. Click here to read more. Click here for the PPFFA web site.

    If my understanding is correct, their are quite a few brothers and sister comming in to support their brothers and sisters from across state lines. And we will see how well members of the IAFF care about each other. Any one else want to join in?
    Be kind to fire fighters. Please don't let your dogs use fire hydrants.

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    Default Questions for Local 719 (junior member)

    Are you a active member in your local? Are you active in the labor movement? Are you active in your local labor council? Are you active in your cities politics?

    I hope you answered yes to all these questions. If not, maybe you need to be educated in these areas, so you can make educated statements!

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    Thumbs up

    Schlener you're right on the mark. If we as individual departments sit on our hands and do nothing we are marked. All IAFF union members need to be active in national/state and in local politics. We also need to support fellow members in other cities when they are under attack. Just my 2 cents from being involved fighting hostile city administrations.

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    Every local has few of "719's"... the first ones who complain about the way things are run in the local, yet they are the ones who don't get involved, only show up for meetings if there is a contract vote and never show up for things like informational pickets or a show of support!

    719.... here's an example that blows your theory to hell..

    Estero, Florida: a really small local (8 to 10 firefighters, I beleive) who were fired by the Estero Town Council during contract negotiations and a private, for profit fire department managed by Wackenhut Security was brought in.

    Wackenhut promised the citizens of Estero the world, and they did not deliver. The Professional Firefighters of Florida and the International went to bat for the tiny local in Estero and the firefighters were reinstated when Wackenhut was fired. There was also a LODD on Wackenhut's watch, which the company tried to blame on the deceased firefighter.

    Wackenhut also tried to take over fire protection in Dover, New Hampshire and Willlimantic, Connecticut in the mid 80's. It was the combined effort of the Locals, the IAFF and the State organizations that stopped this from happening!
    Last edited by CaptainGonzo; 11-29-2003 at 08:17 PM.
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    Default Whoa guys.....

    I live in a city near by local 719 and can tell you that the problems that they are experencing are a little larger than non involvment by our union. There city has reached there constitutional taxing limit and is holding a layoff gun to the heads of many city workers in that city. The last I heard was that they wanted to layoff 12 firefighters , 12 cops and numerous other city workers and still are in the hole after those cuts for 1 million bucks. Call it what you will but these citys in the northeast have been dying on the vine for years, and until there is a fundmental change in the way they do business there will be layoffs of firefighters and cops. Cut the brother some slack I am sure he is frustrated by the whole situtation and is looking for a little advice and support.
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    Default Statement for ALL IAFF MEMBERS!

    Ask not what your Union can do for you

    BUT

    What you can do for your UNIUON


    UNION YES!!!

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    Default Re: Whoa guys.....

    Originally posted by Ltmdepas3280
    Cut the brother some slack I am sure he is frustrated by the whole situtation and is looking for a little advice and support.
    I'd love to help...but from the posts, what are we supposed to think? All wee see and read is somebody griping with no elaboration or fact as to the problem.

    Did they request a financial analysis of the towns books from the IAFF? Do they even know they can? You send the budget info and they will go over every penny to prove that firefighter layoffs are not needed. Did they call and meet with the IAFF District rep? What about the state association of FF's (which I assume your state has)?

    As for the whole idea (in an earlier post) about the International only working for the big unions, I don't buy it. If anything, the small locals make out better. My local sends in over $1500 per month in dues, and the international will provide the same services to the locals that only send in $100 per month.

    To Local719...If we can help fight the layoff issue and help your local, let us know how. It's a lot more productive to actually discuss the issue and ask for advice!

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    The reason I posted the reply I did was to try and make a point that the President has made decisions in the past as Governor and again as the President that were not in favor of Firefighters in general. I was not making any statements about Texas. Never been there dont know anyone there cant make any statements about the State itself just some of the political practices that have gone on there in recent times.

    In regards to the treatment of Firefighters - The Northeast States are very pro Union and pro Labor. Many things that go on in Texas and other "Right to work" States go against what is common in States like Massachusetts with its labor protections laws etc. that do not exist in these mostly Southern and Western States, except California.

    I believe that someone should make a decision for electing someone to office that is based on a full review of the issues and the candidates views on same. I think the people at the National level need to continue and maybe even increase the activities in the political arena to benfit all Firefighters in this Country. Why is the government spending so much money taking care of Iraqi firefighters who dont want us there, revel in the deaths of US Soldiers and look at us as the enemy no matter what is done to help them?

    These layoffs being discussed here should not be happening at all. This is the time when public safety positions should be increased in numbers, have added training, purchase new more modern equipment and upgrade deplorable facilities. I am frustrated at the lip service all who are employed in the Fire Service are getting, regardless if you are career, POC, or volunteer. The government should be more concerned about us here in the US not the Middle East.

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    Thanks for the replies guys. Sorry I sounded like I was bitching. You tend to get a little emotional when your name is on the layoff list. Yes , I am number 11 out of the 12 to possiblally be layed off. It was a little bit of a shock. For the record, I started as an executive board member my second year on the job. I wanted to be in contol of my own future, not lettin someone with 20 + years sell my job for better benifits or a bigger retirement bonus. My third year on the job, I became the president of my union and after 2 years now I am the VP(alot of stress at the top). I've helped negotiate on 4 contracts since I started in this department. I fought layoffs last year and won. Last year our union was the only one to help the city by paying 25% for our health insurance. In exchange for that we got a no layoff clause. The city has finally realized that the clause has some teeth. It looks like they may still layoff some police and DPW guys but we may be ok for now.
    We have already started our financial analysis on our own. We have foiled all the information and are waiting for the results. We have contacted our District VP going through the chain of command. He just says to keep him updated on what's going on. We did not want to jump the gun and go directly to the IAFF, if this was just a scare tactic by the city to get us to give up our benefits. They want us to give up our good health care for lesser plans. I am not against the IAFF or our state organization, but when you tell them that you are having problems, they don't seem to lift a finger to help. I know we are not the only department in the Country in trouble, but a phone call or a visit to check on us wouldn't hurt.
    Last edited by Local719; 12-01-2003 at 12:04 AM.

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    If we can help in any way, let us know. We need to show politicians that they cannot mismanage funds for decades then choose layoffs as a solution.

    Good luck.

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    Thumbs down laid off

    As of 12/29/03 the Administration of the city of Girard, Ohio, decided to shut down our fire dept. run ambulance, and lay off myself and one other full-time Firefighter/Paramedic. They also laid off our 8 part-time Paramedics. The Administration stated the cuts were to save money, due to our city being in fiscal emergency. Currently there is no contract with any private ambulance co., but they have met with Rural/Metro and two other companies. The Administrations says they hope to have a contract by Feb. Today there has been a Rural/Metro Ambulance posting in our city, and I have heard them on the scanner responding to calls in our city. This all happened in the middle of our contract negotiations. By the cuts of our two full timers and 8 part timers , they cut our dept. by nearly 50%. I just wanted to let my fellow union brothers and sisters be aware of our situation and the scabbing currently going on. Bryan Iceman L-1220

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    Angry

    Richmond F.D. (CA) Lays Off 18 Firefighters

    RICHMOND;

    Firefighters Picket Mayor's Home

    Copyright 2004 The Chronicle Publishing Co.
    The San Francisco Chronicle
    JANUARY 2, 2004, FRIDAY, FINAL EDITION

    About 40 firefighters protesting layoffs picketed in the rain in front of Richmond Mayor Irma Anderson's home Thursday morning.
    Facing a $9.5 million deficit, the City Council voted to lay off 18 firefighters, leaving 70 remaining in the department.

    The measure took effect Thursday.
    Firefighters say the cuts, which include elimination of the city's sole ladder truck and a rotating closure of one of the seven fire stations, will jeopardize public safety.

    "She (Anderson) has got a letter from Deputy Fire Chief Richard Giaramita saying these cuts will decimate the Fire Department," said Fire Capt. Dan Colvig, spokesman for the firefighters union.

    Anderson said Giaramita is not the head of the department and that Fire Chief Joe Robinson supported the cuts as necessary. "We're not jeopardizing the health of our citizens," she said.
    Living the dream...

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    Good showing at the Richmond city council meeting a couple of nights ago. I couldn't count how many locals showed up- even a couple of brothers from FDNY were there, and made a couple of speeches during the discussion. We filled the assembly room up, and people were standing along the walls and in the back hallway. Even among the citizens who showed up there was tremendous support for the 18 laid off firefighters.

    One thing became painfully obvious throughout the meeting: "Madame Mayor" is an absolute idiot. I was dumbfounded by how clueless she was, not to mention how childlike and rude she acted. When she announced her support of public safety and was met with a tremendous roar of laughter from the audience, she got quite defensive, and reminded us that she has been on city council for 12 years now (attempting to impress us, I guess). 12 years? I think I see the problem now. You've had a clown running the city into the ground for the past decade.

    I also found much amusement in how she used the argument "Oakland is laying off firefighters too, so it's ok!" A weak argument at best, but even weaker when you realize that Oakland is not laying off- in fact, they're hiring. Of course, whenever a speaker brought this up to "Madame Mayor," they were met with a rude and dismissive scowl and a shaking of the head. I guess she knows more about Oakland fire than the guys who's friends with an Oakland firefighter, the lady married to an Oakland firefighter, and the several local 55 members in attendance.

    Richmond is laying off the wrong people- fire those clowns on city council!

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    Working in New Zealand I am well outside this current issue, but in the recent past, our Union (and others) fought the Government to a standstill over a decade of "restructuring and modernisation" that would have involved a heap of layoffs and contract benefit losses.

    A few observations of what worked and what didn't in that time.

    The Union ARE the members. "They" don't do anything, "We" do it, or don't do it as the case may be. Some of our brothers and sisters are staunch, some are lazy and some will be fooled by a clever con. Make allowances for peoples humanity and work very hard at the things that everyone can agree on.

    Politicians are politicians, they will do whatever they have to in order to get elected or stay in office. Don't be in a rush to put in someone who talks a good game unless you know s/he will back up their words with actions, and will have the authority and resources to do so. Someone who has done you no favours may still be better than someone with an unspoken plan to screw you royally.

    No one can be hired, or continue in employment if the money is not there. Human beings will always tend to exagerate in their own minds how much others get and how little they get in comparison. Claims must be realistic and comparisons must be valid or your argument will fail. A suggestion here of a two percent rise with no change in contract was angrily dismissed by union members who felt they deserved, and could reasonably expect, much better than ten percent. For the next eight years we got no rise at all and the eventual settlement would never make up that lost difference.

    Someone on the other side of the fence is not necessarily your enemy if you don't turn them into one. We won two significant lawsuits with help from such people who may have philosophically disagreed, but would speak the truth in court about the lies and exagerations being made by the employer. Stupidity by the Employer in angering those who should have been their natural allies in the fight was a major factor in our eventual victory. Avoid personal insults, they will be recognised by those outside the argument as irrelevant and will tend to damage your crediblility. Beware of rising to calculated provocation from someone with a news crew in tow.

    Unity is strength and knowlege is power. These are not just phrases, communicate communicate communicate. People who feel left out on a limb will become angry and are more likely to hurt their own cause. Don't get mad if people don't all agree with your point of view, find a way to change their minds if you can, and keep an open mind yourself. Get the biggest pain in the *** you know to pick holes in your own arguments, then find a way to counter their points, and you will have a better argument to take to the employer, the media or the courts. If you can't find a better argument anywhere, maybe they are right and you will have to concede that point. Better that, than to lose in public and damage your crediblility on other issues.

    The people we serve are our true employers no matter who may temporarily represent them (or us for that matter). Work to make your Union as much an advocate for their interests as your own. Helping people is what makes this the greatest job in the world. Don't let short sighted people sell them short on protection, or greedy people put in place benefits for yourself that can't be sustained in the long term. Good luck and good wishes to you all. You have friends in places you may have never heard of!

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