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    Question the best new turnouts available

    I am a student who is taking college classes at the pinetop fire station in arizona and i am doing a research project on the best types of turnout gear and scba's if you can reply to me that would help my group a lot. thanx

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    Personally I like Morning Pride or Globe Structural Firefighting Gear..As Far As SCBA I'm A Scott Boy Through And Through..Either Scott Air Pak Fifty or the New Scott NxG2 Pak Is Nice

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    Wow - Ford vs. Chevy...

    We all have our preferences, I've been very fond of Morning Pride, but I wear Securitex now. Not bad stuff, lightweight, and best of all we piggybacked a neighboring department's huge order and got one heck of a deal. Veridian sent us a set of sample bunkers through a local dealer, I'm so far very impressed with these as well.

    Scott SCBAs rule, especially when factoring in the sales folks we've had here. MSA needs to reconsider whom they've got representing them in my neck of the woods.

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    as for turnouts, i currently wear Quaker and they have been a nice set, gone through alot of training, mvc's, and fires and are still going strong. i do like Fire-Dex though, they have good prices, fast delivery, and seem to have about the same quality as everyone else. as for scba, i also am a big fan of scott, i like how most of there face pieces fit older, and newer regulators, not sure if the same face piece can be used on the nxg2. also how the regulator fits the face piece, msa has something where you slide then turn to lock the regualtor to the face mask. scott is just line it up turn until it clicks and your on ready to go.

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    Default 2 cents-

    Most of us will agree on the Scott SCBAs. Simply the
    best. #2 would have to be Survivair, followed by a
    tie between MSA and Interspiro.

    Turnouts-

    -Globe seems to be popular.
    -I have heard Morning Pride has awesome
    customer service.
    -Over all, I like Janesville. They have
    a material called "advance" and it looks
    like little squares. It seems to hold up very
    well and repel dirt.

    If you want some pictures, please let me know...
    Bou

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    Not being a smart alec or anything...but the best turnouts are the ones that work the best for you. You'll get as many different answers to this questions as the number of people who answer the post, and each one of them is the right answer. What works best for them might not work best for the next poster, and might be even worse for the poster after that.

    Personally, I like my Quest gear...the gear I use now, followed by the Morning Pride I had 4 years ago, followed by the old canary yellow Globe I had when I first got in the service in 1989. I wouldn't line my dog's house with the Securetex I had before I got my Quest.

    SCBA's are the same situation. Each has qualities that make them work better than the others in certain situations. We have used MSA only since about 1992. Before that we used MSA and Survivair. Both did an admirable job. Not haveing used Scott other than in training, I can't say how they would perform...but I wasn't impressed with the Scott packs when I did use them.

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    Default my opinion

    I personally like Janesville turnout gear with ISI airpacks. We are currently looking at globe turnout gear also. Most of our county now uses globe turnout gear and Scott airpacks. Janesville offers a great lumbar support that I like and the ISI airpacks have an ambiant air switch which allows you to switch from room air to tank air with the touch of a button. Its all a matter of opinion every department has a different brand that they prefer but whats important is it all does the same job.

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    I just went through a great deal fo research and evaluation on these two PPE issues, I have come to some conclusions.

    Bunker gear is all made from the same stuff. The materials that make up PPE, be it Advance, PBI, Nomex, what have you all comes from the same sources, IE Dupont and Souther Mills. The only difference between different brands is the construction. Some companies go the extra mile in stitching and other little design features.

    There is a HUGHE variety of outer shell material, thermal/mousture barries to choose from. If you look at the studies, there are some clear top performers, with clearly the top prices. Nomex is generaly the bottom rung these days, while IIRC PBI (or maybe PBO) is the top performing outer shell. I cant recall much about thermal barriers right now. The information is out there. Go to the Morning Pride website for info like this and more.


    OUTER SHELLS

    Advance - is the trade name of Southern Mills' Kevlar 60%/Nomex 40% product, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Barrage - is the trade name of Southern Mills' Basofil product, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Basofil products being marketed in the fire service (ours and competitors) are actually an engineered blend of 40% Basofil and 60% Kevlar. This outer shell offers exceptional heat blocking characteristics across a range of heat fluxes and thus will often allow the use of lighter liner systems. Basofil also appears to be exceptionally durable and comfortable. Basofil, however, does not offer all the advantages of the premium outer shells (PBI and PBO). Additionally, some competitive fiber providers have raised the issue of formaldehyde off-gassing with Basofil. The third party testing and research we have seen indicate this is NOT a valid concern. Basofil is an intermediately priced product, and we believe is among the best of those intermediate products. Basofil is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock Program.

    Brigade - is the trade name of Difco's Nomex IIIa, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Crusader - is the trade name of Difco's Kevlar 60%/Nomex 40% product, please see that product description. To specify Crusader, order 54xx model numbers and note "Difco's Crusader Kevlar 60%/Nomex 40% only".

    Defender - is the trade name of Southern Mills' Nomex IIIa, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Fusion - is the trade name of Safety Component Technologies ("SCT") Kevlar 60%/Nomex 40% product, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Guardian - is the trade name of Difco's PBI, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Gladiator - is the trade name of Difco's Basofil, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Kevlar 60%/Nomex 40% - This Kevlar Nomex blend product is probably the most durable outer shell and offers 300% improvement in char length over Nomex IIIa outer shells. Kevlar/Nomex stays flexible and supple, maintaining it's integrity after moderately severe thermal exposure. While Kevlar/Nomex is a superior product to Nomex, customers are cautioned that the premium outer shells (PBI and PBO) offer strong comparative advantages. Kevlar/Nomex should be considered a Nomex upgrade rather than a PBI/PBO equivalent. Nomex/Kevlar is priced between Nomex and the premium shell alternatives. We believe Kevlar/Nomex is one of the best of the new products positioned between the premium shells and Nomex with very good comfort and durability characteristics. Kevlar/Nomex is our recommendation for knee and/or pocket reinforcements; it wears like iron. Kevlar/Nomex is also now available with an enhanced water repellency treatment and in a choice of weights and pics. The Kevlar/Nomex product has traditionally been available as a three pic (three strands form the rip stop box). But two pic cloth is also available now. While three pic rip stop should be more durable than two pic, the two pic product here is an ounce heavier so that should compensate. Two pic products will generally be more supple and less likely to become nappy or fuzzy with wear (one less thread strand 'presented' for abrasion in the box weave).

    Kevlar 60%/Nomex 40% is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock Program.

    Kombat - is the trade name of Southern Mills' PBI, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Millenia - is the trade name of Southern Mills' PBO product (40% Zylon/60% Technora). Please see PBO product discussion in our catalog.

    Nomex IIIa - (not to be confused with Nomex Omega, a separate product discussed separately here) products being marketed in the fire service (ours and our competitors) are actually an engineered blend of 93% Nomex, 5% Kevlar and 2% Carbon anti stat. Nomex IIIa is the most economical of the available outer shells. Nomex will not melt, drip or char at temperatures up to 700-750 degrees F. It is also a durable and long-wearing material. Nomex is available in three weights (6 oz . 7 oz, & 7.5 oz) and three weaves (rip stop, twill and duck). The 7.5 oz duck weave outer shell is the Nomex material which the market is most familiar with, the other Nomex product offerings are newer materials. Nomex IIIa is also now available with enhanced water repellency finishes. Nomex IIIa is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock Program.

    Omni 45 - is the trade name of Amatex Norfab's Basofil, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    PBI products being marketed in the fire service (ours and our competitors) are actually an engineered blend of 40% PBI and 60% Kevlar. PBI has distinguished itself in some of the most active metro departments. The fabric was initially developed as part of the Project FIRES effort to provide non-charring protection at temperatures above Nomex's capabilities (approximately 750 degrees F). While Nomex remains an effective insulator charred, it can break away with movement and in the event of a continued or secondary exposure could allow a potentially serious breach in the protective envelope. PBI, in contrast, will resist charring up to temperatures that exceed the firefighters biological capabilities. Only PBO offers better anti char performance than PBI. PBI is available in three weights (6.0 oz. 7 oz. & 7.5 oz.). PBI is available in two weaves (rip stop and twill). PBI is also now available with enhanced waterproofing. The 7.5 oz rip stop product is available in Black and dying the natural bronze color seems to dramatically reduce UV degradation problems and to improve durability. In our opinion, the PBI outer shell (especially in Black) is one of the most preferred and high performing outer shell products.

    PBI - Both Black & Bronze PBI is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock Program.

    PBO products being marketed in the fire service (ours and our competitors) are actually an engineered blend of 40% Zylon and 60% Technora. PBO is the newest of the premium outer shells, being commercialized only in early 2000. PBO performs most like PBI but offers comparatively higher Taber abrasion test results (which should translate into better durability), lower water absorption tendencies, higher tear strength and better anti char characteristics (but PBI already offers such high anti char resistance that this latter point may be of suspect value). In fact, PBO offers the best performance in Taber abrasion resistance testing when compared to any other commercially available outer shell fabric. PBO also offers the highest strength retention and thermal stability after thermal exposure when compared to any other commercially available outer shell fabric. PBO as initially offered was somewhat stiff but Southern Mills (currently the only source for PBO under their trade name "Millenia") has done much and continues to work to soften the hand of the product. Contact your area director, if you wish to arrange field tests or see material samples on this new (or any other current) offering.

    THERMAL LINERS

    Caldura - is the trademarked names for Souther Mills' Nomex Semi Slick liners, please see that product discussion in our catalog. Caldura/Batt Heavy is the most insulative offered, and features 6 oz. of batt quilted to 4.1 oz. Caldura facecloth. Caldura/Batt Light is a 4 oz Kevlar batt.

    Cotton (FR) / Basofil Batt This newer liner is extremely economical and has been extremely well received in the field (in spite of it's relatively heavy 10.75 oz sq. yd. weight), perhaps because of cotton's high comfort characteristics. The liner has also proved very durable in the field.

    Cotton (FR) / Basofil Spunlace Protective Comfort Liner This liner, unique to Morning Pride, is extremely thin and comfortable. The PC liner offers the comfort of cotton and the wicking / drying advantages of a spunlace fill. It also offers the high insulation bump, 48 TPP's after 5 washes (38.7 TPP's before wash). As with all our light liners, we STRONGLY recommend the extra insulation of extended dead air panels. We also suggest that this very light liner is best mated to a Basofil outer shell (since that shell provides a TPP bump up).

    Flamequilt - is the trademarked name for Westex's Cotton (FR) / Basofil Batt liner, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Meta Aramid / Basofil (Omni liners from Amatex Norfab) Meta Aramid and Nomex are the same material. However, Nomex is a trademarked name of Dupont. A Meta Aramid is a material NOT produced by Dupont. This group of liners is becoming one of our most popular as they are very thin, comfortable and highly insulative. As with all our light liners, we STRONGLY recommend the extra insulation of extended dead air panels.

    Nomex Batt/Heavy - This is the heaviest of all the liners and it offers the most insulation and the least breathability. It is also one of the most economical liner choices. Sweating guarded hot plate testing is on going as this catalog went to print, it is possible that this heavy liner will not meet minimum breathability requirements with some of the less breathable moisture barriers. If there is a problem with your order in this regard, our customer service group will be in contact.Nomex/Batt Heavy is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock progam.

    Nomex Batt/ Light This lighter batt lining amterial is intended to provide a compromise between the relatively high bulk and insulation of Batt Heavy liner products and the relatively low buld and insulation of the newer materials such as E-89 products. The batt in this liner is Kevlar (70% garnetted and 30% virgin).

    Nomex/E-89 This liner system is available in a number of lay-ups and has proven to be one of our most popular systems. Nomex E89 appears to be the liner of choice for metro departments. It is light, wicks up sweat well and dries quickly. It is low bulk so movement is facilitated. While is not one of the very lightest liners, customers may still wish to consider dead air paneling systems to beef up it's insulative capabilities. Nomex/E-89 is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock program.

    Nomex Semi Slick Facecloths These liners attempt to balance a blend of slick or filament yarns with woven yarns. The goal is to preserve the easy movement of the slicker materials while avoiding their problem of minimized moisture pick up (which can lead to a clammy, stressful liner feel against the body once sweating begins). Nomex Semi Slick liners are available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock program.

    Omni 1, 2, and 3 - are trademarked names for Amatex Norfab's Meta Aramid / Basofil liners, please see that product discussion in our catalog. As with all our light liners, we STRONGLY recommend the extra insulation of extended dead air panels.

    Protective Comfort Liner - is the trademarked name for Morning Pride's Cotton (FR)/ Basofil Batt liners, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    Q9 - is the trademarked names for Southern Mill' Nomex/Batt Heavy liners, please see that product discussion in our catalog.

    XLT - is the trademarked names for Difco's Nomex/Batt Heavy liners, please see that product discussio in our catalog.

    Moisture Barriers

    Crosstech - The new and improved Crosstech (Type 2C) is both the most breathable and durable moisture barrier product available today. The enhanced PTFE based bicomponent membrane technology incorporated within the new and improved moisture barrier improves upon the already superior performance capabilities of Gore's "original" Crosstech moisture barrier. Among the improvements, the primary benefits to the user are increased total heat loss and an overall greater durability - both of which are still provided in conjunction with the already superior thermal stability performance of Gore's expanded PTFE Teflon based products. It is Morning Pride's position that the new and improved Crosstech moisture barrier is the preeminent moisture barrier available today. While we do not recommend any particular outer shell or thermal liner material as the best choice for all customers, we DO recommend the improved Crosstech barrier as the moisture barrier of choice to all our customers. While slightly more expensive than alternative moisture barriers, the Crosstech barrier product offers compellingly better properties and with its comparatively better durability is almost assuredly a lower life cycle cost product than products of lower initial cost. The new and improved Crosstech product on Nomex facecloth is an acceptable moisture barrier per the terms of the Nomex Omega licensing program, also.

    Crosstech is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock Program.

    RT7100 - This alternative PTFE-based moisture barrier is a product of W.L.Gore. It incorporates Gore PTFE technology, however, NOT the enhanced bicomponent technology that is part of the new and improved Crosstech moisture barrier, nor the technology that was used in the original Crosstech barriers. This alternative product is intended as a thermally stable, price competive alternative to NFPA compliant polyurathane based moisture barriers without the superior product benifit advantages of the Crosstech moisture barrier. The Basofil blend substrate may provide an insulative bump (often typical of Basofil) that will allow the use of lighter liners.

    RT7100 is available for quick delivery in our Custom Stock Program.


    There are a lot of studies as to which of the above materials are the best performers.

    Here is a website that deals with CarbonX, a fairly new material that looks to be very effective. It compairs it to other materials. As of yet I dont know of any CarbonX turnouts, but we do have CarbonX face shrouds on our wildland gear at my VFD.

    http://www.chapmaninnovations.com/products/carbonx.html

    Here are some graphs from the site comparing some of the available fire resistant materials.


    The basic concept and definition of a high performance FR fabric is usually considered a man-made fiber with a continuous operating temperature ranging between 375° to 600° f. The fibers are classified as having favorable characteristics in at least one of the following performance properties: operating temperature, the limit of heat transfer, tensile strength when exposed to high temperature, chemical resistance and, Limiting Oxygen Index (LOI). Most of the FR fabrics currently used for FR safety applications perform well in one or more of these areas. CarbonX® performs extremely well in all of these categories. CarbonX® also has the highest LOI rating of any FR fabric available.

    "Flame resistance is commonly measured by the highest Limiting Oxygen Index (LOI), the amount of oxygen needed to support combustion. The higher the LOI value, the more flame-resistant the material. CarbonShield (made with CarbonX fabric) has an LOI over 50% higher than Nomex® and 33% higher than PBI/FR/Rayon blends" - PGI Inc. marketing literature.

    Obviously, the higher the LOI, the more fire retardant the fabric is. When exposed to intense heat or flame, CarbonX® fibers will carbonize and then expand, eliminating any oxygen content within the fabric. This characteristic enables CarbonX® to outperform any and all FR fibers and fabrics currently available. The LOI rating for the majority of the FR fabrics on the market is often achieved by adding a flame retardant finish to the fiber or fabric. The treatments can deteriorate after continued UV exposure and normal laundry care. CarbonX®, on the other hand is never treated with any additives or chemicals. UV exposure, laundry and chemicals will not significantly affect the performance properties.

    Limit of Oxygen Index (LOI)
    CERTIFIED LABORATORY TESTING




    Another relevant rating system that has been used for years is the Thermal Protective Performance system, or TPP. This applies to the garment's ability to provide thermal protection when exposed to both direct flame and radiant heat. The system is designed to calculate how long a given material will protect the wearer from second-degree burns.

    After performing TPP testing for a period of 10 seconds at temperatures of approximately 600° f., the leading FR fabrics will burn, shrink, char, crack and decompose. These FR fabrics ignite during flammability testing, and often have problems passing the shrinkage test. Under the same testing conditions, CarbonX® will not ignite, burn or shrink and successfully disburses the heat energy for periods in excess of 60 seconds. Even after exposing CarbonX® to temperatures exceeding 2600° f., for a period exceeding 120 seconds, CarbonX® will not ignite, burn, or shrink. Below are the testing results comparing CarbonX® with the leading FR materials available in the market today. For testing results on individual CarbonX fabrics, see CarbonX Products:

    CarbonX® Versus Leading FR Fabric TPP Comparison Testing




    When seconds could be the difference between escaping a dangerous situation unscathed or suffering severe burn injury, the added protection of apparel made with CarbonX can make the difference. Thermal manikin tests were conducted to compare the protective capabilities of CarbonX in relation to Nomex®, INDURA® and INDURA Ultra Soft®. Manikin testing is used to compare the relative thermal protective performance of fabrics by exposing full-size garments to laboratory simulations of a flash fire. Results are reported in percentage of body burn. The added protection of apparel made with CarbonX is dramatically illustrated after four seconds of flash flame exposure. In this extreme environment, only 12.4% of the surface area of the manikin suffered the equivalent of 2nd or 3rd degree burns compared to results ranging from 40 percent to over 60 percent burns from INDURA Ultra Soft®, INDURA® and Nomex®. See graph below.

    NFPA 2112





    All PPE MUST meet minimum standards and is 3rd party tested to said standards. There is most likely a combination of outer shell, thermal barrier, and moisture barrier that is the clear top performer, but I havent every looked into the numbers that hard. Also, there is the aluminized outer shell materials used for proximity gear, which without a doubt gives more protection from extream radiant heat, but is not as durable as more covnetional bunker gear outer shells.

    Aluminized PBI - Although Morning Pride has manufactured proximity products out of aluminized Kevlar and Nomex in the past, the advantages of the new knit PBI aluminum substrate are so strong that we have limited our line to the product. Cracking of the aluminized skin is a problem that plagues most conventional fabrics. The suppleness of this aluminized 33% PBI/66% Kevlar knit helps to reduce cracking significantly. Because they are stiff, conventional aluminized fabrics tend to crease in the same place each time they bend, causing cracks in the area. The flexible PBI knit creases differently each time it bends, and this helps to prolong the life of the aluminum coating. Customers should, however, be aware that while this is the most durable of aluminized shells, all aluminized fabrics have a much shorter wear life than non-aluminized fabrics (but non-aluminized fabrics don't meet the NFPA Std. #1976 radiant heat test requirements). The PBI knit fabric is significantly lighter, more flexible and more supple than the eariler aluminized products of Kevlar and Nomex (test results show that it takes up to five times more force to bend the eariler fabrics). The lighter weight of the PBI knit also means wearers may experience less stress and fatigue.

    So, once you settle on your idea combination of materials you move onto the next step, the design and constructions. We evaluated the full featured Morning Pride turnout and the full featured Chieftain turnout. They are very similar in most respects, with most likely a node to the MP turnout for excellent stiching and some neat little features. BUT, we went with Cheiftain for a few small, but significant factors.

    MP turnous have a long tail to cover the lower back when you bend over. Our guys HATED that with a passion. They didnt like the way they ended up sitting on it while riding in the engines. They felt like they were pined to the seat because of the long tail.

    Chieftain is the other way, the pants have the lower back protectio built in, while the coat is short all around. That was the number one factor for not going with MP turnouts.

    Quality wise, there was very little preceptable difference.

    Another factor was that Chieftain had quick ship turnouts in the exact specs we wanted, kakie Advance outer shell and compliant barriers in a full featured turnout, the 3200X. This was the exact turnout we wanted, and we had the 12 sets we ordered in 2 weeks!

    This is in complete contrast to our brother department in the county who has been going exclusivly with Morning Pride and Globe (firefighter preference choice there). They have been waiting up to 4 months for just 2 sets of turnouts!!!

    So, I guss what I am getting is there is a clear cut top performing combination of materials, and you have to order those materials in the style of turnout that best suites you departments. The design aspects of PPE can be debated all day, but the numbers regaurding the performace of the PPE materials is of a more scientific nature, and hence a top materials combination can be found.

    On the design, in general, all of the full featured turnouts from most manufactureers are so very similar it is basicly a personal preferance issue.

    SCBAs

    IMO there is one big deciding factor when you buys SCBAs.

    Support and Service!!!!

    It doesnt matter if you have the best or the worst, if you dont have support and service to keep them working/compliant.

    That was the number 1 reason my department went with Drager PSS100 with Sentinals, amplifyers, and buddy breathers.

    We had the Drager pack go head to head with the Scott Fifty, 4500 PSI latest pack (NOT NXG2 which would have realy screwed up our mutual aid).

    The maintenace on a Drager is 2 O rings a year and maybe some bateries, total <10$. The Scott packs would have cost us a minimum of 50$ a year for maintenance checks.

    Also, we dont have any Scott techs within a reasonable distance. We would have been UPSing all of our Scott stuff if we went that way. Our Drager tech is 1.5 hours away and willing to come work for us anytime we call.

    Drager will also train people from you department to be Drager techs for no cost.

    As far as performance and features of the packs, there realy was not a whole lot of difference. Thanks to the NFPA and such, a lot of packs these days are very similar to operate.

    I would say the Drager is a bit more user friendly then the Scott. The mask regulator is so easy to use on the Drager it is fool proof. The Sentinal on the Drager is a very nice feature as well, it is a little computer that gives you time left to breath as well as pressure, and it also gives you what the abient air temperature is, a handy bit of info at times.

    I did like the Scott facepiece better, but on the other hand the Drager facepice is NFPA compliant for all face sizes. You dont have to have size fitted masks with the Drager.

    Mostly from what I have research and from coments form place like this forum I would say that:

    Scott and Drager are the top tier SCBAs.

    Survivair and MSA are then next level.

    ISI viking is about here, but there seems to be a lot of troubles reported.

    Cairns Air, while a decent pack from what I gather, was never that popular, about here.

    Interspiro and North are to be avoided like your life depended on it, because it probly does.
    Last edited by SamsonFCDES; 02-13-2004 at 05:24 PM.
    -Brotherhood: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
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    All of the answers in this topic will be opinion and nothing more, including mine. Having said that, all turn-out gear should meet NFPA standards and as such from that standpoint they should all be equal. It boils down to material and fit and finish.

    I have used BodyGuard, Morning Pride, Janesville, Globe, Quaker, Bristol and a couple of different ARFF sets.

    I prefer Bristol. It is the lightest, most comfortable turn-out gear I have ever worn. Ours is what is considered Boston Specification gear.

    As far as SCBA goes, I have used Scott, MSA, Globe, ISI, Draeger and Cairns. My favorite is Scott. I have used Scott Pak 1's, Scott Pak 2's and 2A's, Scott 2.2's and we have Air-Pak 50's on order.

    Try what is available to you and pick what works best for YOU and YOUR department.

    FyredUp

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    Default A reminder...

    Its not so much the gear..Its the USER
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

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    Default Speaking of gear ............

    Bou is that red hat dirty yet ? and I cannot say it is the best but is nice and thats the Jainesville stuff as well.
    IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
    Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
    ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
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    I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
    "but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
    http://www.firehouse.com/forums/show...60#post1137060post 115

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    Originally posted by KVFDCAPTAIN21
    Personally I like Morning Pride or Globe Structural Firefighting Gear..As Far As SCBA I'm A Scott Boy Through And Through..Either Scott Air Pak Fifty or the New Scott NxG2 Pak Is Nice
    amen to that!!

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    Default Re: A reminder...

    Originally posted by MIKEYLIKESIT
    Its not so much the gear..Its the USER
    How about "Its not so much the USER...Its the training."

    Why do all gear and equipment topics always have these obvious statements stated?

    It is impossible to have a "scientific" discussion about fire service gear?

    There are labratories that test and verify fire service gear, so why cant we dicuss such things without the every present comments about what fills the fire gear, IE the USER.

    Now for the actual reason for this post.

    navitstudent, why dont you post your research project when you get done with it, I (and i am sure others) would like to take a look at it.

    Hope this thread helped.

    Thanks and good luck
    -Brotherhood: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
    -Mistakes: It could be that the purpose of you life is to serve as a warning to others.

    -Adversity: That which does not kill me postpones the inevitable.

    -Despair: Its always darkest before it goes Pitch Black.

  14. #14
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    martinj's Avatar
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    Apr 2000
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    60

    Default Turnout Gear and SCBA

    I think Samson covered alot of technical details. A number of people here have offered their opinions on the topic as well. However, I must ask: what is the nature of your project? Are you doing research based solely on opinion or are you looking for data and statistics regarding these two components of PPE? Are you examining the various types of outer shell material and their inherent properties? Are you looking for preformance data of the PPE and SCBA?

    Just a few questions. Understanding exactly what type of information you need regarding these two articles would help in replying to your post. If the project is for a business class and you are looking for user feedback, opinions are great. If you're doing this for a fire science class, opinions may not be the type of information that you want.

    Stay safe.
    Jonathan Martin
    martinj@wpi.edu
    WPI Mechanical Engineering
    "Be safe, use smoke detectors...be safer, sleep with a firefighter..."

  15. #15
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    CaptOldTimer's Avatar
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    Jun 1999
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    7,243

    Smile

    My nickel worth.

    We use Jansville gear and Survivair Panther's. Every one like both items. We had MSA and Scotts once. Don't think we will ever use them again. We have tried several other brands of turnouts and do evaulate some others annually. We stay with Jansville in the end.

    Just our way we do business.


    Stay Safe & Well out there....

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