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Thread: Fire Hydrants

  1. #1
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    Exclamation Fire Hydrants

    Does anybody have any information on fire hydrants? i'm doing a report on the lack of fire hydrants in rural areas and how they over come the problem of not haveing any hydrant hookups. im looking for facts about hydrants vs not hydrants, basicly anything that could assist me in this report. If any of you have any ideas on stuff i could talk about regarding lack of hydrants, that'd be great. im basiclly looking for anything.


  2. #2
    Forum Member stm4710's Avatar
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    You could talk about stratagies different departments use to make water soruces out of almost nothing! There was thread in here that talked about how a department dammed brooks or culverts with hey bales and plywood or street signs-------now thats resourceful!

    You could also talk about how water supply affects your ISO rateing.

    You could talk about how as you move away from urban areas you go from the normal 500/750 gallon tanks on qauds in citys to the 1000,1500,2000,3000 and 8000 gallon tankers used in more rural areas. And you could discuss that with out hydrents you have to bring more water to the fight in the beggining.
    You might want to examine the paradox that the more rural the bigger the tanker yet the weaker bridges.
    Or talk about what is more effective two big tankers vs four smaller tankers.
    Last edited by stm4710; 02-18-2004 at 08:15 PM.
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    MembersZone Subscriber Firefighter1219's Avatar
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    My department covers all of Northeast Gadsden County Florida (with help from HVFD). We only have one (1) hydrant in our territory. The hydrant is located in front Coastal Lumber Company, which is a major manufacturer of plywood, landscape timbers and fence posts.

    The hydrant is near the west side of our territory and our station is located at the east side of our territory. To get water to the scene of a fire, we have to haul it in on tankers. We currently have 1 Rescue/Brush/Rapid Attack Truck with 300 gallons of water (Rescue 1), 1 Pumper/Tanker with 1,500 gallons of water (Engine 6), and 1 Tanker with 2,000 gallons of water (Tanker 71).

    Out our station, we have an old 5,000 gallon jet fuel tank hooked into our well. We have a pump hooked into the tank that pumps water into a pipe that is high enough for our trucks to drive under. Attached to the end of the pipe is a 5' section of 2.5" hose that drops down into the top of our trucks. This is how we refill our trucks after a fire.

    We have automatic mutual aid on all structure fires. If we run into a situation that requires us to use more water than we carry on our trucks, we will have to do tanker shuttles. If we have to shuttle, we can either drive into Havana to hit a hydrant, hit the tower at Havana Waterworks, hit the hydrant at Coastal, find a pond or the Ochlocknee River, or go back to the station to hit the refill tank. We carry a 2,000 gallon portable dump tank on our tanker so when we run into a situation where we need more water, we dump Tanker 71's load into the tank and go hauling butt for more water at one of the above mentioned locations.

    You might want to examine the paradox that the more rural the bigger the tanker yet the weaker bridges.
    That's quite an astute observation. This is another very unfortunate situation that plagues rural departments. Many of the bridges in our territory are not rated strong enough for our trucks to pass over. Off the top of my head I can think of one bridge in our territory that is rated for 10 tons. Engine 6 weighs over 28,000 lbs., Which is roughly 14 tons. Tanker 71 weighs over 16 tons. If you have a fire on the other side of the bridge, what do you do? Drive over 'em anyway.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member FFMcDonald's Avatar
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    Well - You usually don't have hydrants - where you don't have water mains. Hydrants = civilization.

    Before everyone jumps on my back - I have been on departments that utilize tanker shuttles for water supply. I have seen them provide flows in excess of 1800 gpm.
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  5. #5
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    I did a search here on FH Forums for "Hydrant" in the Firefighting section:

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sea...g&pagenumber=1

    Some links from there that may apply, or may not apply. These include grants for new tanker narratives (Relates to water supply!),
    Planning for hydrants, and other issues. Some news, some just formal presentations of info. This is NOT them all by any means, many more pages inside of the main search. Hope these get you started.

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...hlight=Hydrant

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...hlight=Hydrant

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...hlight=Hydrant

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...hlight=Hydrant

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...hlight=Hydrant

    http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...hlight=Hydrant
    Last edited by 42VTExplorer; 02-19-2004 at 08:59 PM.

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    You want a some nutty info regarding fire hydrants, dig into USDA Rural Development. These are the guys that will spend millions of taxpayer $ to run water pipes down every deer path in rural America and into small town America (including areas where high quality wells exist) but REFUSE to even hear of installing so much ONE fire hydrant. They have no interest in anything except installing pipline. Note the USDA guys typically live in upper income white collar State Capitals and have a hydrant on the corner. Guess what battle I've been engaged in.
    Last edited by neiowa; 02-21-2004 at 02:44 PM.

  7. #7
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    Originally posted by stm4710
    You might want to examine the paradox that the more rural the bigger the tanker yet the weaker bridges.
    Or talk about what is more effective two big tankers vs four smaller tankers.
    Big tankers are more effective. Manpower devoted to moving water does not count towards ISO manning req. And in fact is not involved in solving the problem that lead to the call. Big tanker starts at 5000gal.

    The bridge issue of the NE is not a universal issue. You will find in the midwest/west with big time ag operators we have real bridges. Counties and county engineers had to proactivly solve this problem some time ago. Big farmers are running 40000lb 4x4 tractors pulling big heavy equipment. Confinement operators are pulling 100000lb 4 axle honey wagons behind said 4x4s over our rural roads/bridges (dry weather). In our area the county engineer has a great and inexpensive innovation where new bridge structure consists of two retired railroad flatbed cars in tandem with a concrete deck (up to 80ft span and something like 200ton capacity).

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    neiowa I feel your pain...

    The problem with hydrants and our rural water company is that their system is classified as a potable water system, not as fire suppression. Therefore, it is not designed to provide us with drafting capablities. Their idea of their system is that it was created with the purpose of suppling water to rural residential customers, not to the fire department. They see it as our priviledge to be receiving free water from their system. We use the water company hydrants for refilling of tanks only. We only have 4 hydrants in our district anyway. We rely on dry hydrants and other means of water when we need it.

    Most of the mains are 4 inch mains, the ones that the hydrants are on are 6 inch mains.

  9. #9
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    i just worked a barn fire last night out in central PA...i had the misfortune of being on the last due engine on the second alarm of the box...so of course we get stuck sitting at the closest hydrant (like half a mile away) to fill the tankers...i think we had about 7 or so tanker there running the shuttle and it seemed to work well...they had enough water in the dump tanks to run 3 inch lines and i even heard they had a few deck guns in opperation...however i can't tell you first hand since i didn't get close enough to the fire...from my short experience with tankers (as i am from northeast NJ were we have a hydrant every 10.5 inches, hehe, i mean 50 ft) they seem to work well when there are enough of them to keep the dump tank full...it does requir shutting down streets or whatnot in order to give the crews enough work to fill and dump the tankers, the idea works very well...what I have also noticed is that the best tankers seem to be those that are engine/tankers...they carry hoses, pumps, ladders, basic tools, a larger than normal tank (2000 gallos+)and a cab, big enough for 4 members officer and driver...this way this piece can be first due for fires, and they can begin their attack before a water supply is in place, since the major downfall of tanker shuttles tends to be the time it takes for inital setup and travel times between water supply and dump tanks...don't hate me for writing so much...sry...

    stay safe

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