View Poll Results: Who do you support for President?

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  • George W. Bush

    98 65.77%
  • John Kerry

    38 25.50%
  • Ralph Nader

    3 2.01%
  • Undecided

    10 6.71%
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  1. #101
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    Originally posted by jasper45
    [/list]While the convention concluded yesterday, its culmination was a march through downtown to promote peace. This of course, was a news worthy event and as such was covered fairly well here. In the metro section of our newspaper today a picture was published from the rally following the march. Several people were pictured with signs in their hands, with the slogan "victory for the Iraqi resistance" clearly visible. [/list]While I recognize free speach, and the value it holds to us as people I was and still am greatly disturbed by what I saw. In my opinion these are Americans hoping for failure of men and women giving their all to preserve their precious free speach rights.
    I am having a difficult time trying to grasp why any U.S. citizen would hope for failure; hope for the enemy to win. Is life here that bad? If it is that bad, why would they not move to a country where life is that much better? We enjoy many freedoms in this nation, ALL of them paid for with BLOOD. Most of that blood was not from people wishing for failure of our military. I didn't say none, I said most. It is ok to oppose Operation Iraqi Freedom, it is not ok to hope for failure by our men and women in uniform. It is not ok to suck all you can out of this country and then dump all over it. Maybe it means spit on the graves of those who died, were maimed, or were just seperated from their families for long periods of time; just so someone can legally burn the U.S. flag, or hold a sign up hoping the enemy wins. Just a few thoughts.
    Jasper,
    What you have said in the portions I chose to quote gives me chills. Seems that people are going to do to the Iraq veterans exactly what they did to the Viet Nam vets (myself included). From personal and up close experiences, I do not believe that people can say, "I support the troops" but "I do not support the war". To support the troops, you must support the war. They are one in the same. Been there, done that and seen that. I will support the war because I support the military people fighting it! Like they say, hindsight is 20/20. We are at war and therefore must fight and win. There is no alternative with terrorists. It is their choosing and our obligation to destroy them and their fanatical extremist views of the world. I'd much rather fight the terrorists in Iraq (draw as many out as we can and destroy them) and in Afghanistan (geographic wise, not a good place for fighting an enemy) than in our own back yards. These Islamic extremists are not going away. They desire to destroy everything we stand for and drag us back into the 8th century with them. It will take intestinal fortitude to fight them. If history has taught us anything, it is that if you appease the people who are trying to destroy you, the situation will worsen. They will see you as weak and unwilling to fight for what you believe in. Which in turn makes them stronger and a more viable enemy.
    Last edited by FireLt1951; 07-18-2004 at 10:31 AM.

  2. #102
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    Default "REAL FIREFIGHTERS"

    I am glad these hillbilly "real firefighters" are for President Bush. You IAFF dummies!
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  3. #103
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    After I posted this I see it's a bit blurry. In case you can't read it, the sign says "Real Firefighters for Bush". I guess I have been "un-real" all this time.
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

  4. #104
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    According to the poll, they have company..
    SB (Local 1355 retired)

  5. #105
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    If you are referring to the poll posted above, well then they have a whopping 83 people on "their" side.
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

  6. #106
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    And that my friend is why this years election blows. I dont particularly care for Kerry and I am not impressed by Bush either. I would like to know why Bush is so grand. I have heard why Kerry is so awful, but I would like to know what makes Bush "the man". The whole "we are much safer today then summer of 2001" dosent wash with me. Instead of concentrating on the terror war,he wasted time with a "gay marriage ban" amendment to the constitution. The "right" (what really is right or left anynore?) screams about "less government" and "States rights"..That is until a State does something they dont agree with. I am not a "liberal" I am also not a "conservative". Most Americans can smell B.S. a mile away. We worry about the same things,our families,jobs etc.. Do you honestly believe that either one of these two rich fat cats know anything about us average Americans? I said it before and I will say it again. We aren't electing a King here. Our country can weather however gets in. I just get ****ed when I see some redneck holding a sign that says because I am a UNION firefighter, I am somehow not a "real" firefighter. ASnd if my fellow IAFF members think the same way, then they should quit. I dont degrade volunteer firefighters. They should do the same to me. Maybe I need to grow thicker skin but when I see UNION firefighters supporting an obviously anti-union group such as "Firefighters for Bush" it makes me ill.
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  7. #107
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    I was trying to read the signs in the pic you posted Mike, I'm not sure that I was able to read it correctly though; what I think I saw was Union FF's @ a couple hundred thousand and American FF's at over a million (I'm assuming that this is in reference to career vs vollie numbers; nice lets take that argument to the polls ). So if I read this correctly I'm confused (well not really I think the whole concept being portrayed here is infantile, so my comments regarding this are very much tongue in cheek), but are UNION FF's suddenly NON-American?? WTF??? Mike I was pretty sure that you and several other of the Union guys are from the States, geeeeeeez if you are not American FF's what are ya then gotta love the juvenile mentality that comes out at election time.......... The people who are promoting this type of BS need to get their heads out of their nether regions and wake up, YOU ARE ALL American irregardless of who you vote for, where you work, union or non-union. It's simple really vote for who is going to do the most for your country. There is never going to be a candidate with whom you agree with wholeheartedly, but there will be one who can do the greater good.

    We just had an election here and believe me our choices SUCKED, stupid tree hugger party split the vote, and we are still stuck with the same moronic government that we've had for the past few years.

    My opinion on politicians is that they are never truly out for the good of the "people", they just snow us with their BS to get into office and then they just do what they want anyway; someone somewhere ends up getting screwed and it's usually the little guy.

    Now I remember why I don't really follow politics ..... I left junior high behind a long time ago
    To the world you might be one person, but to one person you just might be the world.

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  8. #108
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    Pair
    Of
    Low-life
    Idiots
    Talking
    In
    Circles
    Senslessly

  9. #109
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    Default Mikeylikesit...

    Not all union members are voluntarily in the union. There is such a thing as a closed shop. We don't all live in "right to work" states. I am also not saying that if I could I would leave the union, beleive me, we as a local have had some deep talks regarding our union and our continued membership as a local affiliate. Not every dues paying member likes the idea of john sweeny who is a card carrying member of the democratic socialist party making the decisions on where and how our money is spent. In case you don't know who he is, he is the president of the afl-cio, of which the IAFF is a member.Before you take these remarks as my implying that you are not a "real" firefighter please let me say this. The only "not real" firefighters are those who don't do their job. Your political viewpoints don't sway my opinion about your abilities to do your job. You yourself know whether or not you are real. Don't take offense or get worked up about some signs in a picture. There was another thread that had a t-shirt with a slogan on it designed to get people all worked up. If we can't have differant points of view we lose everything. As long as those viewpoints are well informed. Stay safe.

  10. #110
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    Hey Sandy Burger is that top secret documents in your pockets? or are you just glad to see me?
    SB (Local 1355 retired)

  11. #111
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    After I posted this I see it's a bit blurry. In case you can't read it, the sign says "Real Firefighters for Bush". I guess I have been "un-real" all this time.
    What I think this particular group may, and I do mean MAY, is that they feel that a large percentage of the union membership of the IAFF does not support Kerry, whether it is a majority or not is debatable. This may be their particular point of view.

    I do like Noz's description of Politics. Sadly, we as citizens fo this great country have let our system of government adn leadership get ot this point. We are to blame for having 2 such weak candidates and allowing ourselves to be limited to having only 2 viable choices to choose in most races for political office.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

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  12. #112
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    Default One last thought

    Who's one of Orrin Hatch's best friends in the Senate? Ted Kennedy. How about John McCain? John Kerry. They are probably laughing at us chumps right now. I have come to the realization is truly dosent matter who is in office anymore. But we still have the best program on the planet.
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

  13. #113
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    It's called "bi-partisanship" when you want some of the pork barrel for your legislative district.
    It's called "reaching across the aisle" when they want to reach deeper into our pockets.
    It's called "cooperation" when they need the necessary votes to avoid a filibuster.
    They may be politicians, but they're not idiots.
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  14. #114
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    They may be politicians, but they're not idiots.
    Well, that's a matter of opinion. I can't exactly ever bring myself to say Ted Kennedy is an intelligent person. I shudder just sitting here typing that.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  15. #115
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    Default Teddy

    Shark, you may loathe him, but for better or worse he is one of the most powerful men in America.
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

  16. #116
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    Politics
    Poly - as in many
    Tics - as in blood sucking insects

  17. #117
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    For all the bush bashers

    "Saddam Hussein's regime represents a grave threat to America and our allies, including our vital ally, Israel. For more than two decades, Saddam Hussein has sought weapons of mass destruction through every available means. We know that he has chemical and biological weapons. He has already used them against his neighbors and his own people, and is trying to build more. We know that he is doing everything he can to build nuclear weapons, and we know that each day he gets closer to achieving that goal." -- John Edwards, Oct 10, 2002

    "The debate over Iraq is not about politics. It is about national security. It should be clear that our national security requires Congress to send a clear message to Iraq and the world: America is united in its determination to eliminate forever the threat of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction." -- John Edwards, Oct 10, 2002

    "I share the administration's goals in dealing with Iraq and its weapons of mass destruction." -- **** Gephardt in September of 2002

    "Iraq does pose a serious threat to the stability of the Persian Gulf and we should organize an international coalition to eliminate his access to weapons of mass destruction. Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to completely deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power." -- Al Gore, 2002

    "We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction." -- Bob Graham, December 2002

    "Saddam Hussein is not the only deranged dictator who is willing to deprive his people in order to acquire weapons of mass destruction." -- Jim Jeffords, October 8, 2002

    "We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction." -- Ted Kennedy, September 27, 2002

    "There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein's regime is a serious danger, that he is a tyrant, and that his pursuit of lethal weapons of mass destruction cannot be tolerated. He must be disarmed." -- Ted Kennedy, Sept 27, 2002

    "I will be voting to give the president of the United States the authority to use force - if necessary - to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security." -- John F. Kerry, Oct 2002

    "The threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real, but as I said, it is not new. It has been with us since the end of that war, and particularly in the last 4 years we know after Operation Desert Fox failed to force him to reaccept them, that he has continued to build those weapons. He has had a free hand for 4 years to reconstitute these weapons, allowing the world, during the interval, to lose the focus we had on weapons of mass destruction and the issue of proliferation." -- John Kerry, October 9, 2002

    "(W)e need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime. We all know the litany of his offenses. He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation. ...And now he is miscalculating Americaís response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction. That is why the world, through the United Nations Security Council, has spoken with one voice, demanding that Iraq disclose its weapons programs and disarm. So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real, but it is not new. It has been with us since the end of the Persian Gulf War." -- John Kerry, Jan 23, 2003

    "We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandates of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them." -- Carl Levin, Sept 19, 2002

    "Every day Saddam remains in power with chemical weapons, biological weapons, and the development of nuclear weapons is a day of danger for the United States." -- Joe Lieberman, August, 2002

    "Over the years, Iraq has worked to develop nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. During 1991 - 1994, despite Iraq's denials, U.N. inspectors discovered and dismantled a large network of nuclear facilities that Iraq was using to develop nuclear weapons. Various reports indicate that Iraq is still actively pursuing nuclear weapons capability. There is no reason to think otherwise. Beyond nuclear weapons, Iraq has actively pursued biological and chemical weapons.U.N. inspectors have said that Iraq's claims about biological weapons is neither credible nor verifiable. In 1986, Iraq used chemical weapons against Iran, and later, against its own Kurdish population. While weapons inspections have been successful in the past, there have been no inspections since the end of 1998. There can be no doubt that Iraq has continued to pursue its goal of obtaining weapons of mass destruction." -- Patty Murray, October 9, 2002

    "As a member of the House Intelligence Committee, I am keenly aware that the proliferation of chemical and biological weapons is an issue of grave importance to all nations. Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process." -- Nancy Pelosi, December 16, 1998

    "Even today, Iraq is not nearly disarmed. Based on highly credible intelligence, UNSCOM [the U.N. weapons inspectors] suspects that Iraq still has biological agents like anthrax, botulinum toxin, and clostridium perfringens in sufficient quantity to fill several dozen bombs and ballistic missile warheads, as well as the means to continue manufacturing these deadly agents. Iraq probably retains several tons of the highly toxic VX substance, as well as sarin nerve gas and mustard gas. This agent is stored in artillery shells, bombs, and ballistic missile warheads. And Iraq retains significant dual-use industrial infrastructure that can be used to rapidly reconstitute large-scale chemical weapons production." -- Ex-Un Weapons Inspector Scott Ritter in 1998

    "There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years. And that may happen sooner if he can obtain access to enriched uranium from foreign sources -- something that is not that difficult in the current world. We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction." -- John Rockefeller, Oct 10, 2002

    "Saddamís existing biological and chemical weapons capabilities pose a very real threat to America, now. Saddam has used chemical weapons before, both against Iraqís enemies and against his own people. He is working to develop delivery systems like missiles and unmanned aerial vehicles that could bring these deadly weapons against U.S. forces and U.S. facilities in the Middle East." -- John Rockefeller, Oct 10, 2002

    "Whether one agrees or disagrees with the Administrationís policy towards Iraq, I donít think there can be any question about Saddamís conduct. He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do. He lies and cheats; he snubs the mandate and authority of international weapons inspectors; and he games the system to keep buying time against enforcement of the just and legitimate demands of the United Nations, the Security Council, the United States and our allies. Those are simply the facts." -- Henry Waxman, Oct 10, 2002
    SB (Local 1355 retired)

  18. #118
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    Stovebolt - Don't muddy the issue with the introduction of facts.

    Mikeylikesit - Please don't remind me. Powerful? Maybe in his own mind, but he is basically an annoying mouthpiece for the left side of the party to go after anyone with a varying idea from the liberal norm. To think he has been there for over 40 years and done little for the state of Massachusetts. He gets his mileage out of having that last name, like every other Kennedy. Like I said, the people are responsible for his position and allowing the abuse of his, and any other politician's, power.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  19. #119
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    i like the undecided vote, is that the same people that can't find their precinct?
    SB (Local 1355 retired)

  20. #120
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    I just know that the commercials in many of the races for state and federal positions have gotten a lot nastier in the past week.
    I know that I got infuriated when I see mothers of young soldiers who were killed in Iraq or Afghanistan blaming Bush. Don't make me puke.
    They didn't have to join the Armed Forces or the Reserves or the National Guard. They did so of their own free will. The likelihood that they would be called into duty was always there. Making those kinds of decisions comes at a price. You can't expect to get the extra money for college and not be prepared to serve out your agreement.
    There are graveyards full of soldiers who have given the ultimate sacrifice. It's disrespectful to them to believe that a soldier shouldn't have to serve because you or Mom don't agree with the decision.
    Would this same mother blame the car manufacturer should her son die in a vehicle accident?
    Makes you wonder.
    The commercial is cheap, low class even for the Dems and elevates Michael Moore to sainthood by comparison and Moore is a complete idiot.
    I'll be glad when this election is in the books.
    JUST VOTE!
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