In our co. we are looking at replacing our Salvage (1984 Chevy/Baker) our Engine (1994 Seagrave) and our Wagon (1986 Pierce Arrow) We just bought a Tanker in 2000 by Pierce-- We are a fairly small town and dont get much support from our Town, we are looking at either a Rescue Pumper to replace our Wagon and Salvage or a medium duty or heavy duty squad? Could anyone tell me which would be a better choice? and a good co. to look at purchasing this for.. Let me know Please..
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03-30-2004, 01:33 PM #1
- Join Date
- Mar 2004
Rescue Pumpers/Heavy/Medium Duty Squads
Last edited by luvnfirefghtrs; 03-30-2004 at 01:38 PM.
03-30-2004, 07:23 PM #2
We recently made the change of going from a rescue squad to a rescue engine. We took a 1978 Chevy/Gerstenslager out of service, and adjusted our 1984 Pierce to a rescue engine. We did this as we were getting shorter on man power during the day and could not always get the medic unit, haevy squad and an engine to an MVA. So far it has worked fine for us, you can check it out @ www.rossfordfire.com (E-790)IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
"but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
04-08-2004, 06:57 PM #3
Go rescue pumper
an additional $.95 will get you coffee at McDonalds
The "rescue pumper" trend is coming from short staffing (especially daytime for Vollies) and replacing multiple vehicles with one vehicle.
If you are going to combine vehicles, I recommend a crew cab, whether on a commercial or custom chassis. If your rescue pumper is on a commercial chassis, I would recommend a front or rear mount pump to keep wheelbase down as much as possible. If you go with a custom chassis, my preference is midship (FireFish will disagree )
You need to think about the details. One of the big details is ladder placement. On a traditional pumper, with the ladders on the right side and 1/2 height right side compartments, you limit compartmentation. Give serious thought to a hydraulic ladder rack that puts the ladders overhead (and lowers them to a very ergonomic height) or "through the tank". If this is going to be your first due engine as well as rescue, then the ladder rack is probably your best bet.
If this is a rescue with pump and water, ladders through the tank, as well as stokes through the tank can work out best. Find a truck salesman that will work with you.
And try to budget for a foam system.
04-08-2004, 09:50 PM #4
- Join Date
- Nov 2002
- Brooklyn, NY
PFD3501 sounds like he built our rescue pumper. We have pretty much the same as described. We went with a Pierce Dash with a side mount pump panel. The only thing I would suggest is do what we did and figure out exactly what tools and equipment you are going to carry on the rig and spec it out according to your needs. Ours worked out very, very well. GOOD LUCK!
04-09-2004, 08:08 AM #5
- Join Date
- Sep 2003
DO IT RIGHT - THE FIRST TIME!
Sounds as though you have a “curiosity” to move into the new design of a rescue pumper and are in the investigative mode of purchasing. It seems as though, you, like many of us, are looking to do more with less. Interesting concept huh?
Anyway, I have a few suggestions and along with them and $1.99, you can get coffee at Starbucks! That $.99 McDonalds coffee is bitter!!! I have never been a low bid sorta guy! LOL!
Start with NO preconceived notions! Don’t say: “That’s what I need”, “We need a Pierce”, “We are going to buy that E-One, as it has huge compartments”……..yada yada…. You may ultimately end up buying a Pierce or E-One, but go into it openly!
Start with the basics. Create a mission list to keep clear what the priorities are of the “USE AND FUNCTIONS”:
Search and Rescue
First responder medical or ambulance support
Salvage and Overhaul
Then do the same with the equipment to be carried, asking yourself: “What do we use the most”…..and do not let emotion in the mix when doing so. Make your decisions on statistical and historical “real” data….Not, “Well we used that cellar nozzle ONCE, so we better put it in the engineers compartment”! “We needed some 6x6 cribbing on that accident we had 7 years ago, remember?”!
INVENTORY INVENTORY AND INVENTORY!
Make the list of tools – NO EXCEPTIONS! Too many times, we make the “Whoops” after we bought the truck, just to realize that now we need to store that smoke ejector sideways in the compartment, because the manufacturer did not tell us that the door pans took 2” out of the depth of the compartment, as an example! ALL Legitimate manufacturers will do engineering drawings for you, calling out each device to be carried in a compartment, use them, its FREE!
Weigh the tools
MEASURE THE TOOLS!
And then PRIORITIZE the tools, what could be considered a primary, secondary and reserve device!
This will then allow you to make decisions based on usage and then wisely arrange compartments to make all primary items in the right places and easy to access, easy to store and lastly, functionally mounted for protection of the tool and the compartments.
If you want a BIG BOX with a bunch of “Space”, throw some shelves and trays in it, there are a ton of builders that can do it for you! Just remember what you will get when you are done-----A BIG BOX with a bunch of crap thrown in it and it takes removal of six tools to get the one you really need! If you really do not care about anything except that it has HUGE compartments, carries and pumps water, 6 people, ladders and a bunch of “stuff”…….go buy a beer truck and throw a pump and a tank on it….its CHEAP! If you want a true rescue pumper, go to people who do it right and take the time to help you!
DO NOT become the Department who issues a Black and Decker cordless drill to everyone when they get their membership card! I have seen tons of trucks that look like swiss cheese and are a stock investment dream for a bungee cord manufacturer! If you have an accurate inventory, the manufacturer can price mounts for EVERY device – and if they don’t or won’t – DON’T deal with them! Your investment in a rescue pumper, is big. DO IT RIGHT and spend the money to have your tools custom mounted and arranged. Even if you lose your tools for a week or two, it is worth it for the next 10-20 years you have to operate the vehicle efficiently and safely with retention devices and functional arrangements….. It will take more front-end work, but the investment will payoff when you go to put it in service!
Only my two cents towards the quality cup of coffee from Starbucks!
Stay safe and good fishing!
PS- Rear pumps are not a bad option to open up a little room for equipment!! Just thought I would throw that in or PFD3501
04-10-2004, 01:49 AM #6
04-10-2004, 01:38 PM #7
- Join Date
- Mar 2001
- Madison, WI USA
I agree wholeheartedly.
Make sure you understand what all needs to be on a truck. Outfitting a truck to be an Engine, Rescue Squad (Not Ambulance), may not be workable for your department due to all the equipment you carry. This is even more important if you are replacing 3 trucks with one. Its very difficult to equip a rescue pumper to be an effective rescue and effective engine. There is a lot of equipment to find room for, and there may not be that much available on an engine. We got a rearmount pumper and gained some space with that. Ours is set up for firefighting, with rescue secondary. We have equipment to work both types of incidents, but weren't able get as much equipment on it as separate heavy rescue would. Thats fine because we don't have as many calls for rescue as we do fire. For example, we dont carry as much cribbing as I would like because we dont have room for it. But we have mutual aid companies come in for bigger incidents.
Admittedly, our truck was purchased as a "big box" with a few shelves. We got a number of "out and down" shelves because we needed to get stuff closer to the ground. Well, they didnt work out really well because we didnt plan what was going in them, and they have stuff that tends to come out when the shelf hits the down part.
We didnt want to "take stuff out of service". But the few days that would have been to get it fit right would have been well worth it, considering the life of this truck is planned at 20-25 years.
Live and Learn.
04-10-2004, 04:17 PM #8
- Join Date
- Sep 2003
Did I read that correctly?We got a rearmount pumper and gained some space with that.
Stay safe and good fishing!
04-12-2004, 12:46 AM #9
and if they got an intelligently designed midship, they could have had more compartment space than the rear mount
04-12-2004, 08:59 PM #10
04-13-2004, 11:46 AM #11Originally posted by pfd3501
and if they got an intelligently designed midship, they could have had more compartment space than the rear mount"The hero is commonly the simplest and obscurest of men."
-Henry David Thoreau
Visit my dept. at www.TCFD.com
04-17-2004, 03:00 AM #12
04-18-2004, 07:22 AM #13
- Join Date
- Sep 2003
Rescue Pumper Bumper
I see you are from Yarmouth.....
I was crusin' around the net and saw your rescue pumper online. I was wondering if you could post some detailed pictures of your front bumper? It looks as though you have a pretty neat front end with tool/reel compts, etc out front with a full width style lid arrangement that utilizes the area well?
It would be nice to see the arrangement, as it looks as though Saulsbury/E-One did a nice job with the construction of the compartmentation.
If not, could you email me some? firefish63 at aol dot com, if that works better also.
Stay safe and good fishing.....
04-18-2004, 08:21 PM #14
Here's one for now courtesy of Fire304 in another older thread.
- We saw Fitchburg Squad 1 under construction at Saulsbury during a meeting there. http://cms.firehouse.com/forums2/sho...r&pagenumber=1 We saw the bumper and basically said, "We want THAT!" Originally we were going to have (moving from officer side to driver side) HRT reel, a preconnected combi tool, and extra storage space. Unfortunately, our bumper was not constructed to fit an Amkus combi-tool... one more reason to send your tools to the truck for them to be installed. Soooo... we now have the combi tool configured to sit in the storage area, and have 100' of 1.75" accordian loaded in the middle (not a preconnect unfortunately, as it was an afterthought).
- A couple of us did the hand-tool mounting on the bumper cover. We added a paint marking wand, nice hacksaw, glasmaster, hood release tool, res-q-wrenches, battery terminal wrench (couple different styles), a combination screw driver, an adjustable wrench, cable cutters, and I think that's about it. We also have a redundant set of these tools in a clam-shell style tool bag, for the times when you aren't close to the vehicle or in the event of multiple vehicles. It also doubles as a generalized disentanglement kit.
- Currently the compartment is not weathertight. Water enters from pretty much all directions, despite out attempts to use weatherstripping and some creative materials on the edges, piano hinge, etc. I think if the cover was hinged from the back like some are, the problem could be reduced or eliminated. We're having some rust issues inside on tools.
I like BC79ers setup:
It's kind of hard to determine the way the cover opens, hinges, etc, from this pic. I think it was very creative to add the drop-panel door for access to the preconnect. The only thing that is missing is the real siren, of course.
I should also mention the Deforest truck:
Last edited by Resq14; 04-19-2004 at 05:07 PM.
04-19-2004, 02:42 PM #15
- Join Date
- Feb 2002
- Cypress, TX
T'aint missing, I just had to edit the picture to make it small enough to post. You should know me well enough that I wouldn't take pride in a truck without a Q. I'd rather walk than ride a truck with no Q.
As far as making it work, the drop down is 2 quarter turn latches. The top cover is hinged in the rear with 2 holds on either side. The drop down isn't holding the cover down, you can put the top cover up independently. There's a plate with 2 quarter turn latches over the hose tray that the combie tool is now mounted to so that we can pack the hose more easily. If I remember to take my camera with me I'll put up an updated pic with all of the toys in it.
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