1. #1
    Permanently Removed
    CALFFBOU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    6,520

    Default Warning about Ford 4x4 trucks.

    BE ADVISED- My friend told me about this and
    included a picture.

    Some of the new Ford 4x4 trucks are coming out
    of the factory with the locking hubs covered
    up with a cap, including the one shown here.
    The caps were later removed.

    People are engaging the gears inside the
    truck thinking they are in 4 wheel drive,
    but really arent. There is no notice about
    this from the factory/dealers.

    Just check before you off road...Bou
    Last edited by CALFFBOU; 07-10-2004 at 03:24 PM.

  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber
    SamsonFCDES's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    1,708

    Default Re: Warning about Ford 4x4 trucks.

    Originally posted by CALFFBOU
    BE ADVISED- My friend told me about this and
    included a picture.

    Some of the new Ford 4x4 trucks are coming out
    of the factory with the locking hubs covered
    up with a cap, including the one shown here.
    The caps were later removed.

    People are engaging the gears inside the
    truck thinking they are in 4 wheel drive,
    but really arent. There is no notice about
    this from the factory/dealers.

    Just check before you off road...Bou

    It doesnt even cover this issue in the operators manual???

    -Brotherhood: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
    -Mistakes: It could be that the purpose of you life is to serve as a warning to others.

    -Adversity: That which does not kill me postpones the inevitable.

    -Despair: Its always darkest before it goes Pitch Black.

  3. #3
    55 Years & Still Rolling
    hwoods's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Glenn Dale Md, Heart of the P.G. County Fire Belt....
    Posts
    10,739

    Talking Proves My Point...............

    Friends don't let friends drive FORDS My DODGE shifts into locked 4 wheel drive at speeds up to 30 mph, the hubs AUTOMATICALLY lock. Ford CAN do better, why they insist on keeping 1950's technology is a good question.
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
    In memory of
    Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

    IACOJ Budget Analyst

    I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

    www.gdvfd18.com

  4. #4
    Permanently Removed
    CALFFBOU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    6,520

    Default Answer...

    Both of you guys...I dont know. Its not my truck. Please dont
    kill the messenger.

  5. #5
    Forum Member
    nmfire's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Maryland (DC Suburb)
    Posts
    5,738

    Default

    First of all, screw dodge.

    Second of all, manual locking hubs will beat the pants off your automatic hubs any day. Find me one hardcore professional off-roader that thinks otherwise and I'll eat my hat.

    Third. This shouldn't be a problem that requries a "warning". If your driver training program doesn't include learning how to properly operate the 4-Wheel Drive, you need to make so changes to the program. If you drive around with the hubs unlocked thinking it is in 4WD, you are not qualified to drive it in my opinion. Yes, it is stupid to conceal it with vanity covers. But I don't think they hide in the manual for truck either.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

  6. #6
    Truckie
    SPFDRum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 1999
    Location
    St Paul, MN
    Posts
    2,516

    Default

    hwoods, it's not 50's technology. It's just fact that there isn't an auto-hub made, by Ford or after-market, that can handle the torque of the 6.0L diesel. Besides, I've seen fan motors with more torque than a Dodge!
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
    George Mason
    Co-author of the Second Amendment
    during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788
    Elevator Rescue Information

  7. #7
    Forum Member
    firespec35's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Milford MI USA
    Posts
    213

    Default

    Spfd has it right, Hwoods is probably driving a small block 1500-2500 dodge to where the truck pictured is a 6.0 liter F-450 or 550 (Cant see the plate) The torque difference in monstrous. I drove my father in law-s F-450 with the 6 liter. The thing is a tank. You could pull a house with it. I don't think he has the vanity covers though. I'm sorry that's dumb. That makes engaging 4wd a pain in the butt.
    Never Forget 9-11-01!!!!!!
    There wasn't just 343, the other 73 rescue workers deserve to be remembered too!!!!

  8. #8
    Forum Member
    DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,584

    Default

    Brothers...ever stop to consicder one thing here?

    Mabe the manufacturer of the unit (not the cab chassis manufacturer) pout on a set on Phoenix wheelcovers to dress up the rig, or the FD that ordered the rig wanted it that way?
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  9. #9
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 1999
    Location
    Engine 74
    Posts
    108

    Default

    Here's a scenario: The department gets in a brand new 4WD truck. It has all the pretty chrome and all that. The owner's manual, which is a generic pamphlet that covers a wide variety of vehicles, says, "If your vehicle is equipped with manually locked hubs, you must engage them before using the 4WD feature." A quick look up front - I don't see no hubs, must not have 'em - and away we go. Since not all firefighters are "professional off-roaders" a lot of guys (and girls) wouldn't know to look for the things if they were covered by chrome wheel covers.

    Now, on to more serious business: My Dodge can whip your Ford with one wheel tucked behind its back!!!

    E-4-A
    IAFF 1176

  10. #10
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    Swanton Fire Dept. Swanton, Vermont
    Posts
    479

    Default

    CaptainGonzo has it right. The Ford vs. Dodge stuff is fun (HA HA) but the fact is whoever put the fancy chrome on did the damage not Ford. It would be the same if they did it to a Dodge....NOT Dodge's fault.

    Now if you really want to get technical, it is not a Ford vs. Dodge issue with the power. It is a Navistar vs. Cummins issue if my thoughts are correct.... This should stir the pot...Bad day at work sorry.

  11. #11
    Forum Member
    nmfire's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Maryland (DC Suburb)
    Posts
    5,738

    Default

    Originally posted by EdShanks
    Here's a scenario: The department gets in a brand new 4WD truck. It has all the pretty chrome and all that. The owner's manual, which is a generic pamphlet that covers a wide variety of vehicles, says, "If your vehicle is equipped with manually locked hubs, you must engage them before using the 4WD feature." A quick look up front - I don't see no hubs, must not have 'em - and away we go. Since not all firefighters are "professional off-roaders" a lot of guys (and girls) wouldn't know to look for the things if they were covered by chrome wheel covers.

    Now, on to more serious business: My Dodge can whip your Ford with one wheel tucked behind its back!!!

    And that is why you need to train all your apparatus drivers on how to properly operate ALL ASPECTS of the vehicle before you hand them the keys. Just handing them the instruction manual doesn't count.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

  12. #12
    55 Years & Still Rolling
    hwoods's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Glenn Dale Md, Heart of the P.G. County Fire Belt....
    Posts
    10,739

    Talking AWRITE!!.......................

    The Ford, Dodge, Chevy thing is just a bunch of good-natured ribbing among friends. Besides, we ain't started on the Toyota Corolla with the TwinSonic Lightbar yet. Whoever was asking, yes it's a 1500, 4X4, A/C, Power Everything, 318 Gas, Built Dec 95, titled as a 96, Now at 139,000 Miles. Dark Green, Club Cab, Aluminum Diamondplate Toolbox, Bedliner, I won't go into the electronics that are on board. (No Lightbar) This Truck has done everything that I've asked of it over the years, including pulling a Seagrave Pumper out of the Mud once. (Yes, a whole Box Alarm worth of witnesses) It's been Fun! And Yes, my next truck will be another Dodge.
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
    In memory of
    Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

    IACOJ Budget Analyst

    I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

    www.gdvfd18.com

  13. #13
    MembersZone Subscriber
    npfd801's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Somewhere in Illinois
    Posts
    2,220

    Default

    How's this for an idea? We have two F-550s with 4wd, and chrome simulator wheel covers that cover the manual hubs. In the summer, the rigs will almost never go into 4wd. The 4wd is primarily a winter convenience item for us.

    So, come the first cold spell, our apparatus officer takes off the covers and there you have it, easy 4wd access in times of need.

    Pretty simple if you ask me. I'd bet that the damn simulators come with the covers anyway, so you might as well use them if it isn't a huge hindrance.

    Good or bad feelings about Ford, if you haven't driven the latest generation of Powerstroke with the 5-speed, it is a huge improvement over the old motor/tranny combo.

  14. #14
    Forum Member
    snowball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Just North of South Central
    Posts
    2,740

    Default Re: AWRITE!!.......................

    Originally posted by hwoods
    my next truck will be another Dodge. [/B]
    Maybe you could get one with a "slant six". What a pile of usless cast iron that was. I'd rather put Pennzoil in my Ford than drive a Dodge

  15. #15
    Forum Member
    HFRH28's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    573

    Default

    This is just a case of where you need to know what you're operating. SPFDRum is partly right, in that the manual hubs hold better and are more durable than the auto hubs. There are hubs that will hold the torque of the 6.0. I like dodges approach to this (and my chevrolet Z71 is the same way), in that their trucks have the front wheels locked all the time. the front diff does the engaging, along with the transfer case. As to the Cummins vs powerjoke... i'll try not to add more fuel to the fire, but the new Cummins is running 555 Ft Lbs or torque at 1500 RPMS... Try that with a V8 Diesel!

    I think the bigger, and more important warning right now is the 100K+ Vehicles that Ford has a recall on. I'll see if I can find the details on it again, but i remember it involving the 6.0L Negative batterey cable being a faulty ground and causing the wire to burn in two, or start a fire.
    Last edited by HFRH28; 07-10-2004 at 11:42 PM.

  16. #16
    Permanently Removed
    CALFFBOU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    6,520

    Default Wow...

    What a poop storm I started. Sorry about that.

  17. #17
    55 Years & Still Rolling
    hwoods's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Glenn Dale Md, Heart of the P.G. County Fire Belt....
    Posts
    10,739

    Talking Memories.......................

    Originally posted by snowball

    Maybe you could get one with a "slant six". What a pile of usless cast iron that was. I'd rather put Pennzoil in my Ford than drive a Dodge
    No arguement on the slant six, I had a 71 Plymouth Duster with one. I donated it to the Coast Guard for use as an anchor, but they turned it down.
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
    In memory of
    Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

    IACOJ Budget Analyst

    I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

    www.gdvfd18.com

  18. #18
    55 Years & Still Rolling
    hwoods's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Glenn Dale Md, Heart of the P.G. County Fire Belt....
    Posts
    10,739

    Default Re: Wow...

    Originally posted by CALFFBOU
    What a poop storm I started. Sorry about that.
    SORRY? Heck, this is FUN.


    And, If you saved one brother the embarrassment of improperly operating the 4 wheel drive part, it's worth it.
    Never use Force! Get a Bigger Hammer.
    In memory of
    Chief Earle W. Woods, 1912 - 1997
    Asst. Chief John R. Woods Sr. 1937 - 2006

    IACOJ Budget Analyst

    I Refuse to be a Spectator. If I come to the Game, I'm Playing.

    www.gdvfd18.com

  19. #19
    Forum Member
    spearsm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Lowndes, MS USA
    Posts
    742

    Talking

    God know wouldn't you hate to be the one that got it stuck? Try explaining that one to the Chief.
    YGBSM!
    Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

    If all you have is a hammer, then your problems start to look like nails.
    ___________________

    IACOJ
    Southern Division.

  20. #20
    MembersZone Subscriber
    MalahatTwo7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Loco madidus effercio in rutilus effercio.
    Posts
    12,837

    Default

    Earlier in the Spring, we were toned (during working hours) to an excavator fire. The Engine with 2 responded, and MA'd to Mill Bay for their tanker. Anyhow the short story is that when all was said and done, because it was a logging area, and a wee bit of water from the portable tanks, the Engine got stuck.....

    By the end of the event, nearly all of us had responded, including Pfire, with Truck 5, our "Fast Attack" F350 crew cab, 4x4. With some effort we were able to pull the pumper to 'safety' (Pfire did a great job on the tow, by the way. ) but then we ran into another problem.... the 350 would not disengage the 4x4 on the hubs. Which are manual locking by the way. Up till this time, the owners manual was still located in the Engieers files. Needless to say it is now in the glove box because we do not use the deep 4x4 very often. For the truck to not disengage was a simple matter of doing things in the correct order.

    On a social note, I prefer Ford to any other, but currently own a 1985 Blazer 4x4................. soooooo.......

    AND, I bear the scars of working on a '66 Valiant, in high school, changing out the orignal motor for a slant 6 - I will never work on any Dodge/Chrysler product for as long as I live!
    If you don't do it RIGHT today, when will you have time to do it over? (Hall of Fame basketball player/coach John Wooden)

    "I may be slow, but my work is poor." Chief Dave Balding, MVFD

    "Its not Rocket Science. Just use a LITTLE imagination." (Me)

    Get it up. Get it on. Get it done!

    impossible solved cotidie. miracles postulo viginti - quattuor hora animadverto

    IACOJ member: Cheers, Play safe y'all.

  21. #21
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Originally posted by SPFDRum
    hwoods, it's not 50's technology. It's just fact that there isn't an auto-hub made, by Ford or after-market, that can handle the torque of the 6.0L diesel. Besides, I've seen fan motors with more torque than a Dodge!
    No Torque!!!!!!!!!! Must not of heard about the 600 Cummins that Dodge has, 600 lb/ft of torque. LOL. By the way it wouldn't matter if you did put that thing in 4 wheel drive, with those tires and the wieght that is carrying she is going to be stuck.
    Lt Brian Willey
    FF/EMT/Hazmat Tech
    Cambridge Rescue Fire Company
    Cambridge, MD

  22. #22
    Permanently Removed
    CALFFBOU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    6,520

    Default Ford Trucks...

    Overall, I like Ford trucks. They have always been a proven
    winner. From their super cold A/Cs, to the nice instrument
    clusters, they would have to be #1.

    Here is one of my favorite pictures of a Ford mini. I like
    this one because the lines are straight from bumper to
    bumper, roof to rear rack. If you look closely, it has
    out locking hubs. As far as I know, they havent had any
    problems with them.

    A clean truck over all. Not a lot of stickers/deals and
    junk.

    Oh, in Cali, the minis are classified as "patrols" per
    the state guildlines...Bou

    Last edited by CALFFBOU; 07-13-2004 at 12:01 AM.

  23. #23
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Got my curiousity up now.Every late model Ford we've serviced has automatic hubs on the frt axle.Takes a special tool (which we have) to remove them.They also can be "manually" locked in.Sometimes if you don't uses 4x4 for a time the rollers (locking mechanism)get sticky and won't engage.Dodges are ok if you own a tranny shop and a ball joint tool but I get a lot more miles out of my Fords.I'm on my second Ford after putting a million plus miles on the first one.Never seen a Dodge do that or a Chebbie but I'm not over fond of either one anyway.But both keep me well fed with repairs.T.C.

  24. #24
    Permanently Removed
    CALFFBOU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    6,520

    Default A note...

    Some of my FDs older Dodge diesel minis (circa 1998)
    are very, very gutless. Granted, they have a lot of weight
    on them, but not a lot of torque.

  25. #25
    Forum Member
    Fire304's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    At the Helm
    Posts
    1,174

    Default Of Torque and Men

    Its not the torque, its the weight rating for the axle. The front axle of a F-550 has a higher GAW than the rear of a F-250, Dana (or whom ever is building the alxes these days) does not make an axle with auto hubs that heavy. You get locking hubs with a gas engine F-550 too.

    Dodge's hubs don't unlock, they are always engaged. Dodge unlocks the front end by decoupling the longer axle shaft (right side as I recall) which acording them is a stronger longer lasting method. They've been doing it since at least the early 70's so something must be right.

    For those who would argue the Power Stroke vs the Cummins, consider this: If you buy one of the two base model F-650's you get the option of a Power Stroke (up to 230HP), Cummins ISB (up to 260HP) or a REAL diesel engine, the Cat 3126E (up to 300HP). If you get a heavy duty F-650 or F-750S only the Cat and the Cummins is available.

    Our F-550 mini had holes in the hub caps so we can access the locks.

    Bou, if you compaired a late 90's model Dodge 1 ton to a GM 1 ton with any sort of a load on them (like an ambulance body) you'd think the Dodge was a drag racer. I haven't driven the new GM diesel (made by Izuzu as I recall) but I sure hope they improved the torque of those things.

    I find it interesting that nobody has jumped into the fray with a Chevy or GMC yet, must mean that the battle for top dog truck is solely between Ford and Dodge these days!
    ______________________________ __________________
    If you are new to posting please CLICK HERE for an essential lesson
    ______________________________ __________________
    A bad day in the boat is better than a good day in the office. And in my case the office is a boat!

    IACOJ Fire Boat 1

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register