1. #1
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    Default Kerry Endorsement

    Just one question:

    How many of you union guys agree with the IAFF endorsement of Kerry?
    The way I see it, he IS good for the union, but at what cost to the rest of the country?
    Yup, I'm going to hell.
    BUT, I'll be draggin a 2 1/2 with a smoothbore, so when the rest of you get there, make sure yer carryin overhaul tools. And bring me some more smokes...

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    I cannot think of anything he is good for.I do not agree with the Union endorsing him.

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    C'mon guys. I see 45 views and one reply?
    Just trying to figure out whether or not I'll be joining the union when I get a career spot. I have a lot of friends in the Denver area talking about dropping out of the union over this. Did the IAFF even ask for input from it's members before endorsing this wacko?
    Yup, I'm going to hell.
    BUT, I'll be draggin a 2 1/2 with a smoothbore, so when the rest of you get there, make sure yer carryin overhaul tools. And bring me some more smokes...

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    I'm not in a Union, but I would not base my decision of joining the Union or not on it's endorsement of Kerry. The IAFF has done a lot more good things for it's members. Endorsing Kerry is just one of it's many positions. Look at the bigger, overall picture.

    Just my opinion.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Default firefighter184

    expand the dates at the bottom of this section and you will find a lengthy thread on Kerry and the IAFF endorsement. I think people are just sick of debating it.
    Proud Right-Wing Extremist since 1992

    "Extreme Liberalism is a Mental Disorder"- Michael Savage

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    firefighter184,

    Come on now dawg, crawl out from under the rock. Lots of people get endorsements from a lot of other orgs. The IAFF looks at which candidate will be best for UNION fire fighters they look at nothing else if you dont agree with the IAFF choice dont friggin vote for the guy. Take a quick look around and you will notice no one is holding a gun to your head.
    I think in your case you should not join the IAFF some one as simple as you would do more harm than good.
    I.A.C.O.J IRISH TATTOOED-HOOLIGAN

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    Not venture too far into the political side of things, even though I suspect that is the reason this thread was started.From the informatiion available on the IAFF websie, and the monthly newsletter, it would certainly appear that Mr Kerry certainly is more amemenable to firefighter issues then Mr Bush.
    My personal opinion is that that is the only context withing the union should be advancing an opinion as to who would be the better candidtate
    A'int No Rocket Scientist's in The Firehall

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    The IAFF forms its endorsement based on facts pertaining to firefighting. I have a very hard time understanding why people complain about who the IAFF has endorsed. If you feel that he is not the candidate for you, don't vote for him.

    From some reading, people seem to think that they HAVE to vote for this person because he is endorsed. Unless I woke up in Cuba this morning, that is not the case.

    Take the information that the IAFF has provided about your job, mix that in with your thoughts and stands on other issues you find important, then make your own educated decision on the best candidate.

    People need to stop acting like sheep and start acting more like the Shepard.

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    The IAFF has chosen to endorse a candidate, and you don't agree with it. Many people fall into this category, that is life in America. Take what the union says with a grain of salt and vote your conscience. If you don't feel that is enough, take some action to change it. That change starts at the local level. Just because the IAFF takes a particular candidate as their choice for President, that does not mean that each local has to blindly follow. That also is life in America.

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    From the informatiion available on the IAFF websie, and the monthly newsletter, it would certainly appear that Mr Kerry certainly is more amemenable to firefighter issues then Mr Bush.

    REALLY???????????

    Check out this site for a different point of view.
    www.firefightersforbush.com

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    Talking Kerry IS for Fire Fighters

    I only read the first letter, didn't need to go on...
    During President George Bush's term, our rural fire department has received three grants from the Assistance to FIrefighter's Program.
    These grants this Fire Dept. Received (Fire Act) was started by the Clinton administration. President Bush has tried to cut this, Act ever since he took office.

    How misguided!

    From the informatiion available on the IAFF websie, and the monthly newsletter, it would certainly appear that Mr Kerry certainly is more amemenable to firefighter issues then Mr Bush.

    REALLY???????????

    Check out this site for a different point of view.
    www.firefightersforbush.com
    Yea,REALLY!
    Last edited by Bikefire; 08-12-2004 at 05:46 PM.
    Be kind to fire fighters. Please don't let your dogs use fire hydrants.

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    Default Re: Kerry IS for Fire Fighters

    Originally posted by Bikefire
    I only read the first letter, didn't need to go on... These grants this Fire Dept. Received (Fire Act) was started by the Clinton administration. President Bush has tried to cut this, Act ever since he took office.

    How misguided!

    Yea,REALLY!
    OK bro, you got your opinion but hopefully you'll also look at the BIG picture when you cast your vote in November.

    "John Kerry is a man out for personal gain and, like Bill Clinton, will use the our nation's highest office to further his own interests and ambitions which will include selling our soveriegnty as a nation at the UN.

    We must understand that there is far more at stake in this election than the needs of the fire service. "

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    Default Endoresment was a mistake!

    We screw up again with that dam Kerry endoresment.

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    Thumbs up

    I can tell you that George Bush doesn't give two ****s about firefighters. The homeland security money has all mostly been going to the cops around here, it must be a new trickle down economics or something. Kerry has been in my fire house and spoken with us. I never have seen Bush anywhere near a firehouse unless it was on 911 to get a photo op. When John Kerry was here we spoke to each other about terrorism responce training, the age of our equipment etc. Since a Republican Governor has been put in charge of our nieghbor to the south, (Mass.), many firefighters have been laid off. John want to hire more, he wants everyone to have a right to collective bargaining. Open your eyes. The current administration can't find one guy in a cave, perhaps it's because they don't want to. After all George Senior was in a meeting on the morning of Sept. 11th 2001 with Osama's brother. It is an oil war for his oil owning buddies. What has it cost me. We have been without our brother firefighter for almost a year because of his W's oil dreams. As John Kerry has stated, we shouldn't be opening fire house in Iraq and closing them here.
    On a local note, when six Worcester, MA firefighters were reported missing and presumed dead, John was on a flight towards Asia. Senator Kerry ordered the plane to turn around. He gave the Worcester firefighters any help they needed. It was he and Al Gore who came to show there support.
    About a months ago Kerry's caravan was being escorted by local police through a southern state. When a motorcycle cops bike went down he again ordered his crew to stop and swing back around to check on the fallen officer personaly. In Vietnam he turned his boat around under heavy fire and scooped up a brother from the river under heavey fire. I have met the man he pulled out, while working security for John at the NH Primary. The swift boats liars never met
    John.
    He is a good solid man

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    Default ems556, where do I begin?

    The homeland security money has all mostly been going to the cops around here, it must be a new trickle down economics or something.
    The damn Homeland Security Money SHOULD go to the Police. After all, I haven't seen Firefighters and Firetrucks patrolling the streets, looking for suspicious activity. I don't see Armed Fireboats guarding our Ports, I don't see fireman scanning baggage at airports, Arming themselves and getting on Airplanes nor do I see Fireman Arresting Terror Suspects.

    We will see Fireman in the aftermath, as it has been discussed before.

    Kerry has been in my fire house and spoken with us.
    Good, I am glad to see he is pandering to your union instead of out there pandering to the constituents who want to know WHERE HE STANDS ON ONE SINGLE ISSUE! Don't worry, he will flip-flop on FIREAct and SAFER and anything else your union stands for.

    I never have seen Bush anywhere near a firehouse unless it was on 911 to get a photo op.
    He wasn't near a firehouse, he was on top of a crushed Fire Truck. Get it right. And I am glad he is not out Pandering your union, I feel much better seeing him out in the crowd with EVERYONE. I don't want to see my Presidential Candidate worrying about Labor Unions, I want him to worry about how to keep the quality of life I enjoy now free from Isalmofascists and Fundamentalists. I have a job, I get Overtime....I don't need a SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP. Law Enforcement and the Department of Homeland Security are who I want to see the funds go to.

    John want to hire more, he wants everyone to have a right to collective bargaining.
    John Gonna Pay for it? Yeah, with YOUR FREAKIN TAXES THAT HE RAISES!

    After all George Senior was in a meeting on the morning of Sept. 11th 2001 with Osama's brother. It is an oil war for his oil owning buddies. What has it cost me.
    Stop Listening to Michael Moore. THE KOOL AID IS POISONED, THE KOOL AID IS POISONED!

    As John Kerry has stated, we shouldn't be opening fire house in Iraq and closing them here.
    Michael Bloomberg closed those Firehouses, not G.W. Bush. If the City of New York spent a little less money on Liberal Social Programs and a little more on Public Safety, they might not have had to close them. I mean c'mon, it cost almost $8 for a pack of Smokes in NYC, where the F--k is all the Tax Money going?

    Senator Kerry ordered the plane to turn around. He gave the Worcester firefighters any help they needed. It was he and Al Gore who came to show there support.
    That is what he is supposed to do, he is (as someone claims) a Massachusetts Senator. But, you can't Blame GWB for that one. the Election was still almost a year off. Where was Bill Clinton? Why did he have to send Al Gore as his Puppet?

    In Vietnam he turned his boat around under heavy fire and scooped up a brother from the river under heavey fire. I have met the man he pulled out, while working security for John at the NH Primary. The swift boats liars never met
    In Vietnam? You mean John Kerry served in Vietnam? Damn...never knew that....

    You don't have to meet "John" to know he is full of BS.

    A "Good, Solid Man?" Questionable at best, I haven't seen him stand solid on a single issue.

    You go ahead and vote for him. But remember this, The needs of the Fire Service cannot dictate the Needs of the Entire Country. A vote for Kerry is a Vote for Terrorism. A Vote for Kerry is a Vote for our Soldiers (like your buddy that is serving) to be tried by the United Nations at the Hague for any type of infraction. A Vote for Kerry is a vote for socialism and taxes so high you can scrape the bottom of a 747.

    You go ahead and pull that lever for him, I will pull mine for the true and tested leader....George W. Bush. (And I will vote for his Brother if he runs in 08)
    Proud Right-Wing Extremist since 1992

    "Extreme Liberalism is a Mental Disorder"- Michael Savage

  16. #16
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    (a) FIREFIGHTER ASSISTANCE PROGRAMS- Section 33(e) of the Federal Fire Prevention and Control Act of 1974 (15 U.S.C. 2229(e)) is amended by striking the first sentence and inserting `There are authorized to be appropriated for the purposes of this section $900,000,000 for fiscal year 2005, $950,000,000 for fiscal year 2006, and $1,000,000,000 for each of the fiscal years 2007 through 2010.'.

    This passed the Senate on a 97-0 vote. Look closely, 1 TRILLION dollars by 2007.
    Oh, before I foget, John Kerry was ABSENT for the vote. How is Kerry supporting firefighters again?
    Now I don't at all advocate all this federal money for local fire departments, as your basic firefighting is a local government function. But stating that the Senate and Bush are anti-firefighter funding just don't hold water.
    Last edited by SPFDRum; 08-25-2004 at 03:17 PM.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
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  17. #17
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    Don't be a hater baby.

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    IMHO, Kerry has more faces than Big Ben. I certainly wont be voting for him.

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    Talking www.bushisamoron.org

    I can’t find the bill you say Kerry didn’t show up to vote on. The bill you quoted is in committee and hasn’t even been voted on yet according to the US Senate’s website. Perhaps the US Senates website is wrong? I did notice however the bill had 37 sponsors, one of which was John Kerry. I also noted that 27 of the 36 sponsors were Democrats and only 8 were Republicans.

    In general Democrats have done a lot more for organized labor than the Republicans. Some of the previous comments have seemed anti-union which surprised me. Others mention how life is good because they get there overtime. The Bush administration has just stripped the ability of many to get overtime. AP NEWS Aug 23rd
    http://news.yahoo.com/newstmpl=story...l_pr/edwards_7

    "Today, millions of workers will find out that instead of getting time-and-a-half, they're going to get a hard time from their government," the vice presidential nominee said in prepared remarks as the rules took effect Monday. "More than 60 years of protecting overtime work have been wiped out with the stroke of this president's pen."… "The overhaul rewrites rules for awarding overtime pay for the first time in more than half a century. Employers sought the changes for decades, complaining that the regulations were too confusing and out of date….Edwards and presidential nominee John Kerry (news - web sites) predict the changes mean smaller paychecks for millions and predict workers like teachers and computer programmers could see their pay shrink." ... "Taking away the right to overtime pay and doing nothing while paychecks shrink and jobs go overseas makes sense only to someone who does not understand American values and does not respect what work means in this country," Edwards said.

    President Bush has most recently linked arms with Massachusetts Republican Governor Mitt Romney to come to the great state of New Hampshire in the next few weeks. He will then parade Romney and his Asst. Governor at the Republican National Convention (RNC).

    It is not surprising that Bush likes Romney as he has saved the state of Massachusetts thousands of dollars by laying off many firefighters and other needed civil servants. Please view the following text from http://www.massdems.org/body/pressrel3.htm

    ”In Springfield, Mayor Michael Albano has laid off 300 city employees, including 76 police officers, 35 police dept. civilians, 57 firefighters, 12 school nurses and 25 DPW employees. Street sweeping has been eliminated; public skating continues only with supervision by volunteers; three library branches have been closed and 42 library employees were laid off.

    In Lynn, Mayor Edward Clancy reported that 31 city hall workers and 42 school employees face layoff on March 28th. Twenty-six of those employees are classroom teachers.

    Everett is slated to lose $2.4 million in July, which will mean the loss of 20 police officers and 20 firefighters, according to Mayor David Ragucci. Although education has yet to be touched, it appears inevitable that cuts will be made in the city's school system in FY04.

    Why does W. want to parade this Governor who has forced the lay offs at the RNC? It’s because he is doing what Republicans want. Romney is cutting jobs out of the government to save a couple bucks. It doesn’t matter if those jobs are needed to save lives. George Bush has a history of not funding firefighters, please look at the following Reuters article to see how George cared for us in 2002.

    Firefighters Vote to Boycott Bush Sept. 11 Tribute
    Aug 14, 9:26 pm ET
    By Steve Friess
    LAS VEGAS (Reuters) - The International Association of Fire Fighters voted unanimously on Wednesday to boycott a national tribute to firefighters who died on Sept. 11, in an angry response to U.S. President George Bush's rejection of a bill that included $340 million to fund fire departments.

    Bush is expected to speak at the Oct. 6 ceremony in Washington D.C., where the National Fallen Fire Fighters Foundation is hosting its annual tribute to those who died in the line of duty during the prior year.

    The IAFF, the umbrella organization for the nation's professional firefighter unions, is enraged by the president's rejection of a $5.1 billion appropriations bill that included $150 million for equipment and training grants requested by some of the nation's 18,000 fire departments.

    It also include $100 million to improve the communications systems for firefighters, police officers and other emergency personnel as well as $90 million for long-term health monitoring of emergency workers at the Ground Zero site where New York's World Trade Center towers once stood.

    "The president has merely been using firefighters and their families for one big photo opportunity," Mohler said. "We will work actively to not grant him another photo op with us."
    http://news.excite.com/politics/article/id/173402|politics|08-14-2002::21:30|reuters.html

    As I stated earlier, very little of the homeland security money has been going to firefighters. The little homeland security money there has been reaching fire departments is declining.

    “Bush has cut port-security grant funding by 75 percent, from $200 million in his 2004 budget to $50 million in his 2005 budget, according to information provided by Kerry-Edwards campaign officials. That information also indicates the president cut funding for state and local homeland-security grants by $800 million in 2005.” http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/0...news/31205.htm

    After all the blue canaries that are getting the funding for things like SCBA’s that they don’t know how to use are blown up or passed out, who do you think is going to get them? We are going to get them and with the same old tired out equipment as before. Even after 9/11 most of us have no new equipment and or training. We are expected though to face what ever the police can’t arrest with there new equipment. If you don't know why we need more money take a look at the facts. There were almost 6 firefighters killed for every 1 police officer killed in the 9/11 attacks. We are in more danger when an attack happens.

    W. may cost a lot of us our jobs if he stays another 4 years. I think a commercial says it best. “Since George W. Bush has been in power, he has lost over 1 million jobs. That's more than any president has lost since the Great Depression. George Bush — it's his job, or yours," Matt Damon.

    Remember, he is going to have to lay off some more people soon to help pay for these wars. Wars that have cost more money than any democrat could tax you out of in 4 years……… The most recent guess of money spent on Iraq using estimates from congressional appropriations is over 100 billion dollars. www.costofwar.com

    Not to mention over 900 dead soldiers….

  20. #20
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    Mayor Michael Albano has laid off
    - not Bush.
    Mayor Edward Clancy
    - not Bush.
    Mayor David Ragucci
    - not Bush.

    Firefighters Vote to Boycott Bush Sept. 11 Tribute
    Yup, real Brotherhood. Let's not show up to honor our fallen brothers.

    rejection of a $5.1 billion appropriations bill that included $150 million for equipment and training grants
    Do you remember what most of the other money was for? Bridges, tunnels, etc. stuff most commonly referred to as PORK. Want to complain about that bill, tell your Senators to stop adding unrelated crap to it and then it would be passed.

    There were almost 6 firefighters killed for every 1 police officer killed in the 9/11 attacks. We are in more danger when an attack happens
    Interesting logic.

    more money than any democrat could tax you
    hope we'll never find out with Kerry.

    As John Kerry has stated, we shouldn't be opening fire house in Iraq and closing them here
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

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    Default grown ups

    the amount of silly union-bashing that goes on in these forums is disheartening. so is the childish rightwing vs. leftwing debate that rears its head over and over and over. i know, because i've participated in it. i keep reading, hoping that some sort of information will actually be distributed, but instead all i find is a regurgitation of agit-propaganda from both sides. none of us are going to change each others minds. i, personally wouldn't vote for george w. bush if he called me on the phone to tell me he'd secured me a 200,000 dollar a year salary with all benefits paid and retirement after 15 years at 100% of my salary. that's because i don't think american politics is about me. i think it about OUR society. so i vote based on who is better for our society as a whole. i think most people, regardless of their party affiliation really believe one candidate is better for the country than another. no union (or, if your a republican, massive military-industrial complex) should be the final word in how you vote. non of them pretend to be. thus the word: ENDORSEMENT. if you want to quit the union, or not join, based on a suggestion of the union for a political candidate, good riddance. but a better idea is to make your voice heard within the union, and organization you have a right and responsibility to actively participate in if you pay your dues.
    if the union endorsed bush, i would be up in arms. but i wouldn't slink out the door and cower with the scabs because of it. the union is not forum to decide the president, it is a mechanism for workers in the country to check the power of wealth and ownership (a power enjoyed by both john kerry and george w. bush, both of whom are 2-faced, flip-flopping, aristocrats who don't really care about firemen, or soldiers, or farmers, or factory workers). if you don't want to join the union, don't. you can sell us all down the river because you are that kind of person. i think that's despicable, but at least it is a decision based upon an ethos. you shouldn't, however, make that decision based upon a political endorsement you don't agree with.

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    but a better idea is to make your voice heard within the union, and organization you have a right and responsibility to actively participate in if you pay your dues
    chingon, just a question on one thing (as this seems to be what has people upset) - did your Union ask you who they should endorse?

    Good post.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  23. #23
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    Originally posted by ems556
    ....Open your eyes. The current administration can't find one guy in a cave, perhaps it's because they don't want to.


    REALLY?!?!....thats funny....I was over there crawling around looking for him. Its the military looking for the guy...NOT the suits in Washington. And I to believe that if Kerry is elected he will be able to pull Usama out of his *** and save us all?....NO!!!!!

    I am very familar w/ the terrain and politics there...May-be I missed you but what unit were you in?


    After all George Senior was in a meeting on the morning of Sept. 11th 2001 with Osama's brother.


    Oh..here we go again.....get it right...it was the entire Vast right wing 5th columinst that had tea and crumpits with UBL and his family....


    It is an oil war for his oil owning buddies. What has it cost me. We have been without our brother firefighter for almost a year because of his W's oil dreams.
    And what has it cost you? Was your brother KIA?

    Umm..Oil dream...?...errr...how much is oil a barrel?...I didn't know Iraq was the sole controlers of the Oil....what happened to OPEC?


    TILLERMAN25ding...round 3...here we go again.

    bones42...I was going to ask the same....
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    Default Re: www.bushisamoron.org

    Originally posted by ems556
    Not to mention over 900 dead soldiers….

    Yes..no kidding. These are MY brothers and Sisters....please do not use them to try and make a point. It is tactless and it disgusts me. You do not have to agree with the War or current politics...but do try to us the Men and Women to make some political point. EACH and EVERYONE of the VOLUNTEERED with full knowledge that they might me called to go someplace and fight...and possibly DIE. That is was a Warriors life is. They we sent to get a mission done...they went and paid the ultimate sacrifice. I would even venture to say that most..if not all of them would disagree with you. Ofcourse there are others that would agree with you too...BUT as a whole...those men and women whould arguee against you....as would most of thier commerades. Just remember...you may not believe that the Iraqi were not a threat to us....and granted...they was no way that the 8 Republican Guard Divisions were going to conduct an Amphibious Assault on the Carolina Coast, but warfare has changed drastically since the 40's...or even the 90's. "Students" of Military Warfare can understand what I am writing about.....basically it is WAY more complicated than many think or believe. And Mike Moore IS NOT a good reliable source of intell.....this has already been proven.

    EMS556..I am sure you are a good person...and if your in the Emergency Service field, then your better than most Americans out there becasue you are driven by a duty to act and serve with unselfish commitment to the people you protect. Just like the men and women who answered the call and gave thier all. It is not fair to them if people keep using thier memory as leverage in a political debate to try and prove they died "unjustly"...in war every death in UNJUST and IMMORALE. Like I said earlier...they knew what they were getting into...they answered the call and did thier job.

    On a lighter note....

    The Kerry Voting bit...

    heres' a link....Kerry for Jobs?...NO!!!!....None of these Poloticians care about any of us?...How many Blue Collar Congressman do you know?

    http://www.gnp.org/senate-votes.htm


    http://www.gpoaccess.gov/hob/index.html
    Search your to your hearts content

    http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/leg...ative_home.htm
    This ones better....



    But I put my Nations Security first. The contracts, money and benefits will come later.....I am NOT pleased with Kerry's lack of participation in the Senate. He was not around for HR228....but he thinks he can better lead me....? Not ALL THE CBNR gear in the world will stop of minimize an attack...unless EVERY American is issued MOPP gear. That is why I am not to concerned with the Fire Act...but I am more interested in our defense as a nation...I..like Tillerman25 think the Cops (and the like) should get tons of money..for the same reasons he states.....well...time to leave work..I guess I'll just wait for a reply.


    SGT VinnieB
    USMC 95-03
    Last edited by VinnieB; 08-29-2004 at 01:09 AM.
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    You know EMS 556,

    I have to wonder exactly how you can blame Gov. Romney for laying off people at the city or town level? Exactly how does a governor come in and tell people that they are laid off?

    Do you blame every one of the Commonwealth's Representatives and Senators that voted for the fiscal budget? Considering the way the Massachusetts (and U.S. Constittution for that matter) are set up, the legislature controls the budget and the governor (or President) must sign it into law. If you are upset at the Republican governor of Massachusetts, then you should be equally upset at the Democratic legislature in Massachusetts (of which only 8 members are Republicans). So who exactly is responsible for these layoffs?

    I myself was laid off in 2002 from a Union fire department in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. I do not blame the governor, the legislature, the members of the community that I was employed in (who did not vote for a Prop 2 1/2 override by the way), or anyone else. These things happen. Life goes on.

    The same can e said for the deficit of the federal government. Are you upset at Bush? Then you should be upset at every member of congress that voted for the budget to be submitted with a deficit in place. Are you? One branch of government cannot do anything without another branch of government approving it.

    John Kerry says he will recind the tax cuts. How can he do this? It is congress that passes the tax code so they must recind the tax breaks.

    As I stated earlier, very little of the homeland security money has been going to firefighters. The little homeland security money there has been reaching fire departments is declining.
    Much of the money goes to states and large municipalites for them to disperse as they see fit. If they are not getting the money that they "need" then perhaps they should look into why there is a failure at the state or municipal level. Or would you rahter have the feds telling you exactly how to spend the money? What works in one state, may not be best for another, so I would rather have locals direct the funding.

    There were almost 6 firefighters killed for every 1 police officer killed in the 9/11 attacks. We are in more danger when an attack happens.
    Yeah, and? The only that may have change things would have been communications equipment - which was a VERY long standing issue in NYC and was / is a local issue that 3 years later STILL has not been rectified.

    As for the fire being in more danger, that is relative to the actual incident. Police officers die just as easily and readily as firefighters do at a major incident. They are just as eager to aid in an incident as any other firefighter.

    W. may cost a lot of us our jobs if he stays another 4 years. I think a commercial says it best. “Since George W. Bush has been in power, he has lost over 1 million jobs. That's more than any president has lost since the Great Depression. George Bush — it's his job, or yours," Matt Damon.
    Explain to me how a President loses jobs, or creates them for that matter. Explain to me how one person loses a million jobs. It is the individual corporations that make the decision to lay people off.
    The economy is cyclical and every 10 years or so it hiccups. It is a self correcting mechanism, it takes a few years under normal conditions to grow again, never mind in a time of war and after major terrorist attacks. A second note that is forgotten frequently is that the economy began a downturn, a steep one at that, in April of 2000. George W. Bush was not even President then, so he inherited a problem. I am not saying President Clinton is responsible for it, but the problem began under his Presidency - so I guess if George W. Bush is responsible for "losing" over a million jobs, then Clinton is responsible for "starting" a recession.

    Not to mention over 900 dead soldiers….
    And I am humbled by their sacrifice for my liberty and freedom. I will never speak ill of them, and will be eternally greatful. As a former Marine myself, I knew I could go to war at any time - by God's grace I did not have to serve in combat. I knew it was a distinct possibility, and I would have done so if called upon to do so.

    Wars that have cost more money than any democrat could tax you out of in 4 years……… The most recent guess of money spent on Iraq using estimates from congressional appropriations is over 100 billion dollars.
    A necessary thing in time of war. If able to in WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Panama, Grenada, or the Persian Gulf, would you have questioned the cost of those actions? Let us not forget the thousands of soldiers, sailors, arimen, and Marines in Kosovo/Bosnia. What are they costing in that war to keep the peace? What is it costing to keep a heavily reinforced division in Korea every year, plus U.S. Air Force equipment? By your logic all should be ceased.

    Please address these points as they have presented to you.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

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