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Thread: 2Q license

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    Default 2Q license

    Has any one heard anything about the @Q being eliminated and no special license required to operate fire apparatus come 1/1/05 ?


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    IACOJ Agitator Adze39's Avatar
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    Nope, haven't heard anything about that...did a quick search of the DMV's website and didn't find anything either...
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    Yes, I heard it from a guy whose brother-in-law is a DMV inspector.

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    That would be sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!

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    I have heard this rumor as well. We will not know until January if it passes or not. Both the DMV people & Fire Acadamy 2Q instructors know about it and said the same thing. January will tell the tale.

    No, it will not be sweet. The result is that the state no longer requires any training and certification to drive a 70,000lb 40 foot long truck with air brakes. I'm sorry but that is incredibly stupid.

    Basicly, it will be up to each department to say "you can drive" or "you can't drive". Unless your department is really lazy and really reckless, you still better have a training and certification program that is as good if not better than the state's 2Q class. Anyone who wants to just start letting people drive because there is no longer a required certification should be flogged with a stick.
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    Originally posted by nmfire
    No, it will not be sweet. The result is that the state no longer requires any training and certification to drive a 70,000lb 40 foot long truck with air brakes. I'm sorry but that is incredibly stupid.

    Basicly, it will be up to each department to say "you can drive" or "you can't drive". Unless your department is really lazy and really reckless, you still better have a training and certification program that is as good if not better than the state's 2Q class. Anyone who wants to just start letting people drive because there is no longer a required certification should be flogged with a stick.
    I agree.


    The only way you would probably think that it would be "sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet" is if you cannot pass the test to begin with...and if you cannot pass the test, you shouldn't be driving!

    The 2Q test is free and you use a fire truck, so it is not like you have to pay for a test and rent a vehicle (like the CDL).
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    A Q2 class also means that I would have to take time off from work in order to get a license to drive apparatus. If the Q2 isnt needed I would be able to go through our driving program at my own speed. And get the knowledge and know-how over a longer period of time. Also, I really dont think that the state lifting the Q2 requirement to drive apparatus means that a bunch of idiots are going to be out there driving. Im sure departments will develope their own driving policies.
    Last edited by TVFDT141; 08-08-2004 at 11:35 AM.

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    Originally posted by TVFDT141
    A Q2 class also means that I would have to take time off from work in order to get a license to drive apparatus. If the Q2 isnt needed I would be able to go through our driving program at my own speed. And get the knowledge and know-how over a longer period of time.
    This is true. That is about the only advantage of it. And that is assuming you have people capable of running their own class. You could do that before anyway. The only difference was after you teach yourselves, you would take the test with the DMV.


    Also, I really dont think that the state lifting the Q2 requirement to drive apparatus means that a bunch of idiots are going to be out there driving. Im sure departments will develope their own driving policies.
    Hahahahahaha. Are you kidding. That would imply that today with the 2Q, there aren't a bunch of idiots out driving? Right, believe me there are and removing the state mandate for a unified test will not help.
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    And as soon as someone ****s up, it'll be CDLs across the board.
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    Why bother getting a 2q ?? I have my CDL, which an instructor that teachs my town's parks and recs. He instructed us on how to do the flag course and local driving. Granted I learned this all in a dump truck. still why not have a license with you can do more with then just drive a fire truck. I didnt have to take any time off work for it the test was on a saturday. If I need side money i can drive an oil or dump truck with proper endorsments

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    Originally posted by fireguystu
    Why bother getting a 2q ?? I have my CDL, which an instructor that teachs my town's parks and recs. He instructed us on how to do the flag course and local driving. Granted I learned this all in a dump truck. still why not have a license with you can do more with then just drive a fire truck. I didnt have to take any time off work for it the test was on a saturday. If I need side money i can drive an oil or dump truck with proper endorsments
    Well, the CDL has the written test with I would bet a lot of people who drive with a 2Q might have problems with. Also, the moving violations with CDL carry a much stricter penalty which most would probably rather avoid. I'm not saying I have the intention of driving stupid but in the case of an accident or something, I'd rather not have to worry about that.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

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    Let's not forget that it cost money to take a CDL test...you have to pay for the test and rent a rig (most towns don't let their firefighters borrow Public Works rigs).

    A 2Q test is free. The test doesn't cost money and you use your fire apparatus (or a neighboring one's if you are in a group).
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    Default 2q

    Hey, thanks for the info, and the dialog.
    I too would not like to see the 2q go, for a lot of reasons. All bring up valid points. The bottom line it training, simple as that. I'd like to keep the control on guys we do not want to drive, if you have no higher standard after your own rule/regs then some one will force you to let'em drive.

    In my dept, you must have a 2q , 21 yrs old and have at a minimum 10 hours of driver trainig PER vehicle you want to be cleared on, not counting pump time/aerial oeration etc. We do allow the 18yr olds to drive the ambulance, but must have had a drivers license for over 2 years.

    As for the comment, that some one stated that they didnt want to take time off from work to get thier license, I would question what you are doing in the fire service if you are a volunteer. Volunteerism means sacrifice, sacrifice of your time. When some one in my dept says stuff like that I write their resignation and ask them to sign it. That is usually an eye opener. No one has signed, but they loose that attitude.

    Even with the 2q each department has to police its drivers, each compant officer has to look at each person and decide if that person should drive. We got guys who have the 2q and are not allowed, others have them and dont want to drive.

    Putting some one thru the class is a good trainig tool 'cause it does open the guys eyes to things that the to or co may not be able to get across to the trainee. I hope the 2q stays. What about a CDL then, well if you sit thru the class , do the driving, the only diff then is a] a written test and you cannot use a fire truck. So, go figure.

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    Also, the moving violations with CDL carry a much stricter penalty which most would probably rather avoid.
    Are you afraid to stand up and be accountable for your actions ?? or would you rather be a tool and hide behind a 2Q restriction??

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    I think if the 2Q goes away, I would push for department policy mandating CDL to drive apparatus currently needing 2Qs or CDLs.

    Yeah, it would cost money but my department would make it a training expense.

    -----------------------------------------



    Here's another question:


    Years ago, they offered a chance for people to bump up from a 2Q to a CDL. All they had to do was take the written test.

    When they do away with the 2Q, are they going to offer this again?
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    Default Re: 2q

    Originally posted by REDRIVER6
    As for the comment, that some one stated that they didnt want to take time off from work to get thier license, I would question what you are doing in the fire service if you are a volunteer. Volunteerism means sacrifice, sacrifice of your time. When some one in my dept says stuff like that I write their resignation and ask them to sign it. That is usually an eye opener. No one has signed, but they loose that attitude.
    I dont care who you are, what your background is. You are not going to question my dedication to the fire service as a volunteer. I am going to bet that you dont have enough members in your department to write "resignation" slips. Furthermore, what the hell is a "resignation slip." People resign voluntarily. In essance, you would be firing them. I dont think that firing a volunteer for not taking time off from work for a class would hold up too well in court. Also, I dont think that your community would be too impressed with your weeding of "free" help. But, what the hell do i know. Continuing I must add that what you have said is probably one of the more rediculous things that I have ever read. You have a lot of balls to post something like that in a public forum.

    It would probably be wrong for me to say that I also have no interest in driving fire apparatus as well.

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    Originally posted by Adze39
    Years ago, they offered a chance for people to bump up from a 2Q to a CDL. All they had to do was take the written test.

    When they do away with the 2Q, are they going to offer this again?
    Talked to someone over at the CFA today. They are not going to do the bump.


    Furthermore, the 2Q is definately going away. There was supposed to be a meeting today with the Fire Chief's association and people from the CFA regarding this issue. The Q came about at the request of the Fire Chief's and there was no legislation establishing it. They might come out with some sort of "certificate" program which basically says you were trained on driving apparatus.
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    2Q, CDL or whatever, When was the last time anyone drove an oil truck, dump truck, or a box truck swerving through traffic with lights and sirens. Probably, never. These trucks may be the same size, weight, and height of a fire truck, but now they have lights and sirens. There should be an entirely different license for driving any emergency vehicle. Especially in emergency response mode. Take a look at Firehouse.com. There are stories posted there of fire apparatus accidents happening all of the time. Today alone there are three of them posted there. Most of the accidents seem to have speed as a major factor. Trucks dont just leave the road all by themselves. Paid or Volunteer, it doesnt matter, there should be a separate cert. to be able to drive emergency vehicles. You can be the greatest dump truck driver, box truck driver, etc, but when your adrenaline is pumping going to a working fire call, its a different story. I've been driving fire and EMS apparatus for the past 10 years now, I still remember driving to my first call (a little too fast), but I'm still not a pro. Thats just my opinion of the whole licensing issue.

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    I agree with the idea that more has to be done. Perhaps the DMV should look at making firefighters et al take mandatory EVOC classes in order to operate emergency vehicles.
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    Oh this is going to be fun.

    Originally posted by fireguystu
    Are you afraid to stand up and be accountable for your actions ?? or would you rather be a tool and hide behind a 2Q restriction??
    Excuse me sir? I suggest you take your moronic comments to somewhere else. Word of advice, if you are going to quote, why don't you quote the whole thing instead of just a piece to make yourself sound tough. Since you obviously lack the brainpower to comprehend let alone read my entire post, allow me to repeat it for you. I'll even highlight the parts you decided to leave out to make my statements look bad (like a damn politcal ad on TV)....

    "Also, the moving violations with CDL carry a much stricter penalty which most would probably rather avoid. I'm not saying I have the intention of driving stupid but in the case of an accident or something, I'd rather not have to worry about that."

    Can you please point one where in this statement I am suggesting that I want to "hide' behind a Q or that I do not want to be accountable for my actions?? Oh wait, of course you can't because it isn't there. I was making a general statement as to why some may not want a CDL.

    So, Mr. Alimighty God of the Road, back the ____ off. You clearly do not know me becasue if you did, you would know how entirely stupid accusing me of that was. I am the LAST person you need to worry about in this matter.

    Thank you and have a lovely day.
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